Topic: Ufology

The Yuri Geller saga is discussed, specifically his claims of communicating with "Spectra," an artificial intelligence sending information backwards through time. White compares the internally consistent but mysterious mathematical formulae Geller received to the Enochian language channeled by John Dee. He notes a continuum of experience where Enochian words recur in 20th-century UFO literature, linking ceremonial magic and ufology.

A new course for RuneSoup members titled "Fairies, UFOs, and Psy" explores the overlap between elusive companions and aerial phenomena. Fairies are described as beings that are only intermittently physical, often associated with Northwest European folklore and a call to an authentic, joyful life. Chris Knowles’ concept of "elusive companions" is used to bridge the gap between historical fairy encounters and modern ufology, suggesting both represent a similar interaction with the non-human world.

Many professional astrologers avoid conspiratorial thinking to gain respect from academia and the professional managerial class. However, the realization that astrology functions effectively often leads to the conclusion that standard institutional narratives are deceptive. There is also a noted lack of overlap between the fields of ufology and astrology, as practitioners in both fields often seek to distance themselves from other "fringe" subjects to maintain a semblance of respectability.

George Howard discusses the idea that "reality shouldn't be classified" and shares his optimism for future disclosures. He links the "crenulated iron spherules" found in Bendell's machine to those found at the Younger Dryas boundary and the 9/11 site, suggesting a common plasma-based mechanism. Carlwood argues for more synergy between occult scholars and ufology researchers to better understand these phenomena.

The discussion notes the recent deaths of several luminaries in the weirdness and esoteric fields, including Dr. Stephen Heller and Philip Coppens. They discuss the "untimely deaths" of UFO researchers, which White attributed to them "dipping into the ultra-terrestrial realm" and entering dark liminal spaces.

Carlwood addresses negative listener feedback regarding a previous interview with UFO lobbyist Steven Bassett. He expresses skepticism toward "official disclosure" and "approved whistleblowers," calling them oxymorons. He shares a detail about Bassett's background as a wealthy tennis player with long-standing family ties to Washington D.C. politics.

The host expresses the frustration of long-term researchers who are tired of "second-hand" testimony and the lack of direct evidence like bodies or craft. Bassett responds by urging disaffected followers to re-engage with the activist movement rather than giving up. He acknowledges the government's goal is to frustrate the public into apathy and insists that the movement is currently at a historical "finish line" that requires final mobilization.

Carlwood addresses listener feedback regarding a recent episode with UFO historian Richard Dolan. He explores the tension between wanting insiders to speak out and the inherent distrust of individuals with backgrounds in counterintelligence. The host argues that career intelligence officers are often disqualified from being trusted sources in the pursuit of honest disclosure, regardless of their claims.

The historical lack of communication between UFO researchers and occult scholars is examined as a result of social stigma. Researchers in the 1950s and 60s avoided occult associations to maintain scientific credibility, a pattern that persists in modern "silos." The discussion advocates for a synthesized perspective to understand a reality that likely transcends materialist explanations.

The discussion deconstructs the UFO phenomenon as a psychological operation led by an "Invisible College" including Jacques Vallée and Hal Puthoff. Ehret suggests that many "alien abductions" may actually be "creepy crawly" style rituals or military-led "MILAB" operations involving drugs and trauma. He posits that the UFO narrative is the latest iteration of a secret cult technique used to create a wall that human reason cannot penetrate.

Greg Carlwood introduces James Madden, a PhD in philosophy and professor at Benedictine College. Madden is the author of "Unidentified Flying Hyperobject: UFOs, Philosophy and the End of the World," a work that applies philosophical frameworks to the UFO enigma. The introduction highlights Madden's background as a lifelong athlete and scholar who seeks to move beyond standard materialist tropes in ufology.

The host reflects on the interview, noting that the diversity of reported alien beings supports a dream-based model over a materialist biological one. He discusses the brain's ability to produce DMT and how shamanism serves as a model that can incorporate all aspects of high strangeness. The summary posits that waking reality may simply be a more persistent and "thick" version of a dream.

The conversation explores the potential links between magic and other fields, such as music and ufology. While some suggest music can be used for spirit attachment, Dr. Skinner views it primarily as a ceremonial accompaniment or a distraction. Regarding UFOs, he acknowledges the theories of Jacques Vallée and others who equate alien abductions with magical or spiritual encounters, though he notes he has no direct personal knowledge of these phenomena.

The paranormal is historically rooted in the supernatural domain of religion, involving saints, mystics, and shamans. George P. Hansen criticizes modern parapsychology for downplaying this religious connection and the role of violating taboos in ritual magic. He also notes that rigid categorization within ufology and academia prevents a holistic understanding of how these phenomena overlap with mythology and folklore.

Joshua Kutchin discusses how a specific insight from Anne Strieber—suggesting that "visitors" are connected to what humans call death—inspired his massive research project. While the link between UFOs and death has been alluded to in publications like Flying Saucer Review since the 1950s, Kutchin notes it was rarely explored in depth. This thread led to the creation of a two-volume set where the first volume provides historical background and the second focuses on the UFO connection.

The host reflects on the interview, praising the depth of the stories in Strieber's book and the quality of his research. He addresses skeptics by noting that the second half of "Them" functions as "hard-nosed ufology journalism" that doesn't rely on personal belief. The contributions of researchers like Mitch Horowitz and Jacques Vallee are highlighted as essential components of the book.

The modern interpretation of UFOs is shifting away from sci-fi extraterrestrials toward a relationship with forces or angels from higher planes. Jeff Harmon discusses his work with MUFON investigating the correlation between astrology and UFO experiences. This perspective challenges the materialist worldview that seeks to keep humanity rooted in the physical plane.

Alan Greenfield previews his upcoming work, including a book titled Saucers and Sorcerers based on his diaries from the 1970s and 80s. He highlights the intersection of magic, ufology, and cryptozoology, noting how participants often become part of the mystery themselves, as seen in the series Hellier. Several of his older titles, including works on the Hermetic Brotherhood of Light, are being reprinted by the Celestial Lodge of Sirius Press.

Greg Carlwood and Richard Dolan express disappointment in the ufology and magic communities for their perceived compliance with pandemic-related mandates. Dolan criticizes the lack of deep geopolitical analysis among leading UFO researchers, many of whom he believes have a "grade school" understanding of power politics. He argues that a genuine understanding of the UFO phenomenon requires a background in history, espionage, and the intelligence community.

Evans recounts his appearance on Coast to Coast AM with George Knapp, noting the irony of Knapp praising his book despite Evans' vocal support for Dan Burish. Evans claims his "contact" with non-human entities confirmed Burish's trustworthiness, marking a significant moment in his standing within the UFO research community.