Richard Dolan | Disclosure News Updates, USO Cases, & Enochian Symbols

00:00 Welcome to one of the few truly independent and sponsored free podcasts on this island earth. If you like these free first hour episodes, consider getting twice as much with THC plus and treat yourself to the full two-hour interviews as they're designed to be where things only get deeper and more interesting behind the curtain a plus subscription gets you five new shows a month in a full archive of great interviews with amazing folks going all the way back to 2010 That is the gist, though there are other details benefits and bonus features you can hear more about at the end of this episode or in the show notes where you can also find the links to sign up and join the club at TheHigherSideChats.com Or if you want to listen on Spotify sign up through Patreon Enjoy! And it's puppet masters almost surely have a plan There's clearly maybe something there beyond the realm

01:04 thoroughly tested, ever last close-chested view. And the more we think we know the less we really do. Where would be without THC? Cause' we know they're lying to us just don't know to what degree. Where would we be without THC? S I chat show! Greg Carlwood and company

01:44 So say we all from the Sunshine State I'm Greg Carlwood and it seems like from nearly any time or place on this island earth if you dig hard enough You can find written reports or drawn depictions of mysterious experiences with strange flying objects that defy logic They might be put in a religious context or scientific one, or presented without any context at all. But it seems like something else has been alongside humanity for a long time and hasn't cared all that much if we understand it And it seems to be true with this puzzle as well as many others Sometimes humans struggle to get out of their own way We sift the data for examples that support our predetermined conclusions, we pretend examples that we can't explain aren't as credible and we grow to be quite close-minded about the subjects we once got into because our minds were so much more open than others. So what are these things? Advanced airships from another planet, chariots of the gods, demonic portals earth lights or maybe even leftover automated surveillance machines from the Atlantis age

02:43 Cherry pick enough of the never-ending and extremely varied cases, and you can make a decent argument for almost any conclusion. And really that's half the fun! Well, today's returning guest is the living legend of gold standard high level analysis of the whole UFO thing. Richard Dolan a military historian who caught the bug three decades ago and has written some of the most respected books on this subject with titles like UFOs for The 21st Century Mind A Fresh Guide to an Ancient Mystery AD After Disclosure When The Government Finally Reveals The Truth About Alien Contact Two volumes of UFOs in the National Security State, The Alien Agenda's A Speculative Analysis of Those Visiting Earth and his latest book a History Of USO's Unidentified Submerged Objects Volume 1 From The Beginning To 1969 which kicks off what will be a three volume study examining nearly 700 cases of these bizarre out-of-place objects in and around water.

03:36 Cases that, for many years were often left on the cutting room floor because flying things are weird enough. Add in an ability to effortlessly move through both mediums of air and water without much care at all and well some people just can't take it You can find him regularly blowing minds on his YouTube channel And his podcast The Richard Dolan Show and he has a very well-designed membership platform at wouldn't you know richarddolanmembers.com He's been here three times before, and I'm ready for lucky number four. The strange stuff historian saucer studier and now USO aficionado Richard my man welcome back! Hi Greg it's always a pleasure i'm happy to be back here with you thanks yeah definitely excited I get nervous talking to you you're just too smart It takes all of my brain power to try to pretend to keep up but

04:26 You really are great. I enjoyed the new book, I remember when I first heard about cases that come in and out of water and the suggestion that the real bases are in the ocean And I thought someone should really look into that! Here we are It's a good time to talk about this space because it has been pretty active Our last interview was July of last year or actually 2023 I think Oh wow That was when I reached out because David Grush had just hit the scene And now there's a lot of stuff. I guess, I'm curious what are some of the highlights of ufology in the last year or so for people who kind of have a hard time keeping up? It's been it's been a real ride hasn't it yeah So in the last two years you know that's funny thing about David Grush

05:16 For years and years, people within the UFO community and outside of the UFO community probably would have agreed on one thing which is if a high level government intelligence official were to come forward under oath to Congress in session and state for the record that he knew that we had alien technology and biologics or bodies. I think everyone probably would have agreed, that would just blow us all away. The news media would jump all over itself to cover the story whether they had been previously believers or skeptics would not have mattered

05:58 And I think if you were to go back more than 10 years, I think everyone probably would have been inclined to agree on that. And yet what happened? That exact scenario occurs and honestly practically none of the major media showed this slightest bit of curiosity. There's a little bit of coverage there were hit pieces for sure lots of pushback from the establishment media, obviously in bed with the national security apparatus. But really mostly just ignoring it and that was kind of an amazing thing at the same time that summer Grush's testimony prompted the creation and failure but the creation of the UAP Disclosure Act if people remember

06:43 That was promoted by Chuck Schumer and a bunch of other folks that had fair amount of bipartisan support. That was going to be a congressional initiative at some kind of independent UFO review board for the public, to have access to these reports that's not dominated by the intelligence community. But did not pass And then the following year it did pass, but in a very kind of weakened form. And by the way that act is up for discussion again this year and I do think people should consider writing to their local member of Congress about there's places we could go maybe talk about that later. But anyway so that's one thing that happened another thing has happened is that just the speed is picking up in other words whistleblowers or

07:28 let's say people who are being labeled as whistleblowers. We can quibble over what are they, what are they not? But people from that world the intelligence world coming forward and saying yes I have this information about these craft i have that information about this computer program Immaculate Constellation for example yeah that is tracking these things worldwide So that will happen and we just keep having quite a few of these individuals, frankly. So it's been a steady stream not necessarily a torrent at all times but a lot of individuals have been coming forward and again this is something that had we considered this in prior decades

08:13 I think that most people would have considered this would really be moving the needle. And it's really hard to say how much effect that these have had, but I do think there is a general ongoing more and more openness by the public to accept the reality of these UAP or UFOs But still, really when you get right down to it in our official discourse what really has changed not a whole lot. So it's all very interesting we had a big drones quote unquote drone A swarm last winter. That was quite interesting, I don't think it was confined solely to New Jersey we still do not have a lot of information about what that really was but to me i look at it looks and feels just like every other UFO flap or wave of the past you know whole bunch of unexplained sightings in one or particular areas and then it goes away and we have no resolution and that's what happened with the drone flap

09:13 So there's always stuff going on here. And of course, all the infighting where sometimes our own worst enemy chasing our own tails arguing Do I do? I agree with this person? Do I not like this person? Do I like this person you know it's it's like being in junior high school again The phenomenon is still there There are still a battle for Getting some kind of congressional forward motion on it and it's an interesting time. It is, it is! And you are right that...it seems like the goalpost for credibility or acceptance has moved people did say they want insiders to speak out and then insider speak out and say well that guys clearly not but I can't trust what he said

09:53 But I think one of the most interesting things that happened was the Miami mall thing. They say it was alien related, the official story is like new year's last year. The official story is kids got into a fight yet there's no footage of it and like A hundred police cars were lining the streets and there's just no footage of what happened. And witnesses said it was like some tall aliens, who knows? You know we're in an age where you can... I didn't really follow that one. Honestly i just kind of kept that one at arm's length. It just seemed a little goofy to me Yeah that's the ones I follow! The goofy ones Well, it got a lot of attention. Yes yes so in terms of the whistleblowers yeah I have a hard time keeping up maybe i get burnt out once in awhile and take long breaks and try to see you know what's bubbled up to the level of people's interest and I see the comments people will say about me that I think everything is a psy-op unless it is occult adjacent and then well now its legit disclosure and to that I say

10:55 Yeah, that is basically how I can be. I acknowledge that but you mentioned Immaculate Constellation and this is probably the most interesting of the recent whistleblowers to me this Matthew Brown guy he was on the Weaponized podcast with Korbel and Knapp And then after that interview, a few days later I believe he went on a big Twitter rant to Elon Musk saying as you know the White House has an AI system that can predict the future and we have not forgotten who is responsible for murdering the first sentient artificial intelligence. He also said You're about to realize how terribly deceived you have been by people who claim to love Jesus no less

11:35 and he included a few photos. One of them is a strange wheel of symbols that looks very much like John Dee's Enochian language it even says the word Logath along the top, and the Liber Logath is in Enochian grimoire from 1583 so clearly this lights up all the right boxes for me It's very provocative I don't know what to make of it but we have a Pentagon whistleblower talking about UAP including Enochian language from the 1500s. How could I not bring it up? What do you think about this Matthew Brown guy?" Yeah, what's funny about that is about a week ago someone asked me about that. I was doing another interview and I hadn't read the tweet so i was totally completely out of it and then I look at some of the YouTube comments and there were people who were incredulous that how could I possibly have missed a tweet well...I missed it

12:28 I did look at it. I did read it and I thought, that's quite interesting indeed. Sounds to me...I mean there are a lot of some of those more esoteric references that I still don't know if I truly understand where he is going with some of this but its clear that he is inviting Elon Musk First of all, he's indicating to Elon Musk look man you've been betrayed by a lot of people that you thought you could trust. They're not trustworthy but join the good side join the side of disclosure I think that was an open invitation and then there is some of these other programs I referred to I mean they seem like legit program so what surprised me about this actually was at Matthew Brown who I watched his interview with Jeremy and George

13:16 He struck me as very, very low-key. Very cautious. Not someone who I would have expected to take off the gloves and just go right into a public forum calling out Elon Musk of all people! That was kind of shocking, I have to say so...I don't really know what his full game here is But it's definitely interesting and I'm sure like, I will get asked about this again. So I'll have to do better homework and get truly up to speed but the fact is I just don't really know what I think he's all about on this one. It was very surprising. Fair enough! And this has been kind of one of the criticisms of ufology

13:57 In types of categories of shows i might do for example or shows coast to coast my new is that the occult people don't talk to the ufo people and they think there's just not a lot of. of communication across these different disciplines, really. Because just like you can study UFOs for 30 years from a certain perspective—names, dates, military organizations involved—there's people who studied the occult and like who wrote these grimoires? How old are they? From which culture do they come? What secret societies held them in high regard? And I really would love to see a synergy where those people talk because

14:34 When I hear some of these whistleblowers say, the truth is so mind-blowing you could not deal with it. I'm like try me because what could it be? We've all been thinking about this stuff for a long time since I was in high school What could it be that I haven't considered? To me, I don't know but for some people if it had an occult angle that would be a thing and I just want to throw this out too Going down this in Naki and UFO rabbit hole this week. I also found an old interview with Phil Schneider's ex-wife I know you don't dismiss the Phil Schneider case and consider his death to be a bit suspect Let's just say well in this interview She says that she was told The implants that Phil saw that were taken out of people's body had enochian letters on them so

15:23 I mean, these are totally disconnected people saying a similar thing. So again, I wonder if this is all demonology masked as aliens from outer space? All right, well a couple of things. So let me go to the first major point you made which is this lack of crossover because there is a lack of crossover between all the different like silos that we're in where there's UFOs or occult. You look at the history of UFO research and this is an old story. UFO research back in the 50s and 60s and 70s back in the olden times they already knew that they were out on the fringe. They already knew they were being laughed at by the establishment, it's not like they wanted to put another albatross around their neck and get labeled... I mean seriously like with all the occult stuff which would just only made it worse and so you know I look back over a lot of the old books in journals of that period and its crystal clear thats what they were trying avoid It was social stigma thing that they were trying to avoid. I found the same thing when

16:26 began kind of hanging out, you could say in the conspiracy crowd. Not the UFO groups but other conspiracies like after 9-11 for example right after 9 11 in the early 2000s I was one Of the very few UFO researchers who went all in on a 911 conspiracy which I believe to this day But I recalled I wrote a couple of fairly short articles on it, but I saw in certain bulletin boards 9-11 people were furious. Some of them that a UFO person dared to enter their field they were dealing with the same stigma It's like look we're already on the fringe We don't want this UFO guy coming in and wrecking it and ruining our reputation So I fully believe there is a lot of that going on when we silo ourselves And then also

17:15 A lot of the kind of occult or interdimensional researchers, in my own opinion don't really know an awful lot about the material history of UFO phenomenon. And that's just my own take on it. Some of them do a lot of them don't and so there is like on all sides of this, its very rare that you get a lot of really synthesized perspectives that can really work So I think it's inherently difficult. Plus, you know look we're dealing with a reality that probably is as you were just implying way beyond what we probably even grasp go back like 5 000 years and if you were to talk to some ancient person

18:05 of that society and ask them, how do you think the world is set up? What's reality? They would give you a certain series of ideas. And you'd be thinking yeah wow! You really don't understand so now here we are today and we think we understand but do we really? Do we actually truly understand this reality I have a feeling there are things about this in terms of spirituality or paranormal occult also in terms of UFOs or UAP And probably in terms of a lot of the things that we probably would have our minds blown if we were even able to understand. So I think you're right, it's like this is a very... We're explorers all of us! We're exploring the edges of reality as we understand it and honestly I don't think we know how far into the darkness at all goes

18:59 I agree. And, uh, I don't know if you also wanted to say something about Phil Schneider there cause a lot of stuff out well, I don't know what I mean. I'm not inclined to think that Phil Schneider did the things that he said he did do. I have all for many years. I have been inclined to think that he may have been murdered although I just recently spoke to someone who was looking into this and gave me at least his own opinion that, no I think Schneider was a suicide. I don't really know. Um...I was actually able to see an image of him it's gruesome to say but there is a photograph of him dead in this room where he was and looked to me like he was killed but maybe that could be a suicide method In any case the real details of Schneider like the things that he said

19:56 The fact that he lost his fingers and the way he said, he did. I don't believe that. In fact, I was just talking with Dean Aliato who is a filmmaker who had early images of Phil Schneider missing those fingers So he was a young man. I don't, I don't think that this was something that happened in, uh, in Dulcey underground and Dulcy. I think you said it was right for people who don't know Phil Schneider said he lost his fingers and, uh, basically a fight, a laser gun fight with aliens at the Dulcey base just for the people who need that context but But his wife saying there's a knock in on the little implants is pretty interesting though. Yeah, I don't know. I know his wife is still around and people have interviewed her. Um, I dunno if someone can present a really strong case for Schneider, I would read it right? Well, and I'm not even that obsessed with Schneider in particular but

20:51 I like to ask questions to people like yourself that don't get asked a lot because I think everyone listening loves the Richard Dolan interview has heard many. And a lot of times, you know hosts asks similar questions so i like to take in weird places uh you know and I will suffer the consequences of that So when it comes to two things that happened recently That I find to be Really interesting esoteric data points. The audience is probably sick of me bringing this up But I want to know if you have comments so I had Ryan bledsoe on and we talked about his dad's relationship with NASA and these interactions that his dad has had with people in government and Ryan's Dad told him that they said every astronaut who goes above a certain altitude sees angelic beings a lot like the lady that he sees or at a minimum

21:44 glowing orbs, we could say. The glowing orbs according to Chris turn into these angelic figures." So that's one thing that I was like wow all? Even if it's half and that's interesting and then this other thing so Diana Pasulka was on the Chris Ryan podcast and she gave some details about Tyler D slash Tim Taylor that I'd never heard before she said... And i have this quote here our space program today even has some really interesting rituals associated with it When it does certain launches at Cape Canaveral that Tyler was involved with, They had images of Roman gods and goddesses put on the rockets. They would use Latin on their mission patches, and they would also have specific rituals they would do sometimes involving U.S. presidents. They would position the presidents at a certain point where astronomical events would happen so they're like stand here Mr Obama and he would stand there with his wife and look a certain direction it was part of the whole thing and there were photos he has photos of all that

22:42 So this is obviously some type of ritual, and I don't know why they're doing it. I noticed that they were using Latin and I noticed it wasn't medieval Latin. I was like this is a particular form of Latin—it seems like Roman theology! So they're using the images of Roman gods, and I would ask them why are you using these images? Why are you putting them on your mission patches and also utilizing Latin phrases from that time period?! You're sending this up into space who in space is going to read Latin? And his answer to her was our sponsors. Well, someone should read Dark Mission by Mike Barra and Richard Hogan for heck yeah! Heck Yeah! Right I mean look those two they laid this entire thing out something like 20 years ago

23:24 So I'm really surprised. Maybe just people haven't read the book in a long time or if ever, but actually that's a really fine book and essentially what they do is...I think Barrow really took the lead on this if I'm not mistaken? I don't know! They essentially argued very very persuasively in much greater detail what Diana Pasulka here was saying and I have no doubt no reason to doubt a word of what she just said there So there's an occult element to NASA and Barra and Hoagland laid this out a long, long time ago. There are different elements of NASA that they talked about you got the rocket guys which but then you've got the let's say the NAZI is brought over and then you've got the straight up occultists

24:12 And one of the things that they pointed out regarding the occultists is launch times and locations to land, like including on the moon. All these things were very much mapped out in terms of a cultish appropriateness for whatever success they were striving for. So I think they made a very good case that a lot of these important decisions NASA was making Occult calculations, whether one believes in that or not is secondary. I think they made the case that someone making the decisions at NASA did and does believe that

24:54 So that's worth looking into. Now, the whole thing about the claims of angelic beings I like and respect Chris Bledsoe and I'm sure his son is truthful but I'm dubious about that claim there are many claims of astronauts both American back in the days of the Cold War Soviet who saw clear UFOs in space to me that's beyond any question I'm not aware of any claims leaking out of angelic beings. And, I find it a little bit difficult... This is the first time we're hearing it! We've had astronauts going into space for more than 60 years now and we've heard decades and decades of claims of astronauts seeing UFO's or UAP in space

25:46 When have we ever heard of a claim of an astronaut seeing angelic beings in space and yet now I'm being asked to believe that every Astronaut has seen them. And yet it's never leaked out So it's a little, I mean...I would like to hear more about how they explain that but it just seems a little It seems like asking a lot in terms of belief. I kind of agree But you know, I'm just the messenger here They say that the goal with this stuff is to or at least the manipulation of it is to lead us towards a one world government and a one world religion so maybe they are called stuff is just what manipulation by who. Well you know he's doing manipulating people seeing angelic beings are mr global yeah no well yes but,

26:35 I totally agree with that, but all right. Well anyway, I probably should not have interrupted you. No it's all good! I'm just saying that maybe the...I'm open to the fact that maybe The Occult stuff is seeded to get suckers like me to adopt some propaganda and there are different lenses for all kinds of different people but i do want to get into The Book because I did like it It is why people go on shows like this This USO book, you are going to be looking at 700-ish USO cases that cover three volumes. And I love the older cases because the further we get from modern technology the more puzzling it is and that's great cause this first one I think it starts the timeline at 1717 Is that the oldest case? It's the oldest official case that I put in the chronology There were a couple of earlier

27:29 I have a whole discussion on potential earlier cases than that. you know, have a discussion of the Christopher Columbus sighting in 1492 which is interesting and I talk about it. It's just not certain enough in my view that I absolutely felt confident including it so yeah the first of those was 1717 in the Caribbean and the first really spectacular one I would say was 1825 uh in the South Pacific and that's-that is an amazing case And there's quite a few that are really quite extraordinary through the 19th century. So they are difficult to explain in that way, as you mentioned because it's really hard to imagine technology that could do some of these things so it was quite fascinating I'll just mention uh The second volume I do expect To be out potentially a month from now So by late July, I think it could be out early August I think is pretty safe bet Uh, so i'm wrapping that one up and that covers

28:30 all of the 1970s and all of the 1980s, only 20 years. But God Almighty it's an incredibly packed amazing 20 years. Interesting so it seems pretty hard to surprise a 30-year vet in this field but did anything in this sliver of research surprise you when looking at just USOs? Quite a bit, yes. Actually it was... This was a truly mind-blowing project that took me three years of research and writing so I went really into it and found...I culled just under 700 cases but I looked at multiple times that I did not include. A couple of things really were shocking to me one was like we're all used to hearing how UFO's have been associated with

29:22 disabling certain nuclear missiles. Like we've all heard about the Malmstrom Air Force Base case of 1967 when missiles got shut down, and there's a variety of other cases similar to that where technology was disabled but we don't really hear about it much in connection with US or Soviet navies and yet it happened with them as well like aircraft carriers aircraft carriers being shut down. One of the cases that just is astonishing to me was in 1971, early July aboard the USS John F Kennedy aircraft carrier, it's a major ship and for about half hour, a glowing orange orb hovered above the aircraft carrier at 830 at night on July 2nd and knocked out all communications and apparently the weapons systems as well

30:14 And we have the testimony of one of the witnesses. We've had his name, he ran communications on that evening and there are cases in which has happened to Soviet ships as well. In fact in one case a major ship wasn't a carrier but it was a large warship was dead in the water. The engine was down for about half hour I think in the sea of Otkotsk way out by Kamchatka and there's a lot of cases like this where American submarines or Soviet submarines are reported being followed and sometimes circled under the water by objects that don't make any sense. They determine that they're being circled based on the acoustic signals that they get from these things, so it's very strange there is just a lot of this worldwide

31:08 It's historically, I would say very underreported these water-based encounters. They are certainly distributed globally. I don't think there is a body of water in the world where they haven't been reported. There is tremendous amount of military secrecy. They're clearly very advanced in their technology and then their intelligence and they are elusive as hell. So it's really quite fascinating, and you said earlier someone should do a history of it, and I'm glad that I did because there had been a couple of good works on this subject in the past but not many actually not much at all And what I wanted to do was something that I thought would be comprehensive and that would revive breathe life into some of these dead stories that have been completely forgotten

32:00 Just extraordinary encounters by military, by civilians, by ordinary people. Husband and wives out fishing in the middle of the night on some quiet reservoir or a couple of brothers or father and son or a woman driving along the highway with her daughter and seeing an object coming out of out of the bay I mean just So many of these types of incredible events that you just know the people involved it was like the most Extraordinary thing they've ever experienced in their life. They usually have no one to talk to about it and then the stories just sit there and Basically, they die so I I went around scrounged them up from every source that I could find I wanted those people who have their voice and

32:45 And I wanted to get those stories out there for others, others to read them. Yes and it is great! It's just case after case after case...I love it! I liked that one of the sources is Charles Fort. I was kind of surprised how prominently he made his way in there. Talk to us a little bit about some of the material you got from him because I'm a big fan of his collections of bizarre stories and damned facts in general really? Yeah Charles Fort some people know who he was some do not He was writing about 100 years ago before the flying saucer wave hit the world in the 1940s. Charles Fort was hanging out in the New York Public Library during World War I and in the 1920's, and he was just looking for

33:31 as he said, damned facts. And by damned he just meant they were dammed by the court of science and the court of society because they were too weird! Just too crazy. Frogs falling out of the skies and all other kinds of weird things like if it was strange in a newspaper Charles Ford was like yes I want that. A number of the things that he found where what we would call UFO reports basically. Essentially that's it. He sometimes One of the best sources for a lot of the 19th century reports that no one else would have known about. Charles Fort found them just through painstaking research in, um, in the New York Public Library so he found a bunch of cases that we could call USO reports and actually a couple of there's a UFO case

34:21 that I included from, uh, I think 1870. I include it because it was like in the dead center of the Atlantic Ocean like you could go for a thousand miles in any direction and only have water and there is a ship that said yeah above us this object and the captain even drew a picture of it which Fort reproduced and it was kind of like a semi-circle with which was cut off at the bottom with a tail and this thing flew over The ship, they had it in view for about a half hour. It was below the clouds. There's nothing supposed to be flying over the middle of the Atlantic Ocean in 1870 and that's just not supposed to happen so I did include that. I thought what the hell is it? It's not in the water but it's close enough. I wanted it but Ford also did include a lot of these very bizarre cases of what we might call the pinwheels or light wheels in the water

35:13 And this is a very interesting phenomenon, and I don't really think anyone's got a true handle on this one. Some scientists in recent years have tried to duplicate the effect. I don't believe that they have succeeded at all. What you get are these ship captains reporting that it is usually late night because they can see better but there's this glowing pinwheel effect under the water that goes for hundreds and hundreds of yards at times Each spoke, it's like you'd have spokes around a hub rotating very rapidly and it appears to be under the water.

35:53 claimed to have clocked the speed of the rotation. And I think he said something like 80 miles per hour, so pretty fast and I don't know how we got to that calculation but that was his way some of these are several hundred yards in diameter i mean really massive and sometimes the ships would have no choice but you just sail right over it or right next to And you read the descriptions of these various captains, they're clearly serious about it. A lot of them were in the 19th century but we have cases of them going through a lot of the 20th century as well long after Fort stopped recording, in fact after Ford had died so um...it's a weird phenomenon and Charles Ford recorded

36:37 Many of them. I thought, I want them in this book because people should really know about them. was always an interesting guy. He was very intelligent, kind of an unusual writer. He's a challenge to read I gotta say he's not not an easy man to read his style is not my particular favorite style of writing having said that he was very thoughtful and he um he was talking about these wheels and he thought you know hey look maybe some Alien civilization, I don't think you use that word but essentially came down and just set up shop into the water below the water because that's a good place for them to go. And in fact when i think about where would an alien base safely be made well under the water could conceivably be such a place. I think Fort was onto something perhaps

37:32 Yeah, I like the pinwheel case a lot. I could be crossing my wires but I believe that's a case where it happened two years in a row in the same spot or there are two reports one year after another? We had quite a few of the pinwheel cases so I think in my book I've got almost 20 of them that I collected in place called The Strait of Malacca or The Malacca Strait that is very And the Persian Gulf also, there's actually a few places particularly in Eastern waters where these things seem to recur. The Malacca Strait is very important to this day and extremely important shipping choke point right by Singapore all of China is shipping to Europe and other places in that area go through that it's a major area even back 100 years ago was very important

38:22 And that area has had a number of the pinwheels reported, the Arabian sea which is off the coast of India there. and the Persian Gulf, all have seen a lot of these pinwheel cases. South China Sea as well. I love that you cover these cases with 15 data categories time of day types of bodies of water number of witnesses proximity size and shape what are some of the major patterns that come out of looking at the data this way? Yeah, I'm very glad that ended up happening. That was a suggestion of my wife. She just said we weren't thinking of data collection initially she just thought you know would it be nice to have this kind of overview for each case so people could scan it and I thought yeah thats good idea So I did that It took a lot of time had to go back over all of them And then I though since I have this data why don't we put this into a spreadsheet and see if we can find patterns? I thought it would be a complete waste If didn't do that

39:20 So I did and yes, there were several things that were really quite shocking. The first one that i would mention that is significant is the day versus night breakdown What what I found was that right up until the late 1960s Day versus night were roughly 50-50 almost exactly 50-50 in fact Up to that point after 1968 it went almost immediately, in fact I would say about immediately to three quarters at night which has been to this day. So it was a very definite transition and I have asked myself many times like do I just have too small of a data sample? You know UFO and USO cases are notorious in the sense that you really don't know how many are out there that you're not getting access to at all or people aren't reporting so there is that possibility

40:16 But I just thought the changeover seems too dramatic and too consistent that i suspect that something's going on. So it seems to mark a change in behavior, to some extent going more consistently over to nighttime operations. And by the way, there's another distinction between civilian and military with day versus night whereas military encounters since 1968 they're at nearly 90% occurring at night with USO encounters I mean it's really quite extraordinary whereas with civilians it's not even remotely like that It's much more likely to happen in the daytime So it seems to me that the intelligences behind this phenomenon can definitely distinguish between military and non-military, and there's a change in behavior.

41:02 That happened right before 1970, maybe that's some because of something we did. Maybe by then our satellite coverage was better or electronic coverage was better. Maybe they wanted to be more stealthy maybe someone new came into town like I don't really know but there is a statistical correlation here that I think is worth studying. A couple of other things I noticed, one thing I tracked was were there instances of electromagnetic interference reported by the witnesses? And indeed there are a minority of cases. About 10% from the first EM case that I recorded which is around 1951

41:43 Almost 10% of all cases since then have had some kind of electromagnetic interference. It's like one out of ten, I think it's nine and a half percent but what's interesting is that percentage is double for military cases so that's a 20% likelihood of electromagnetic interference that does not seem random and then it's a four times likelihood if someone claimed that they had missing time or if they claim that they saw a being in connection. So, in other words the stranger the event was and especially if you had missing time like potential abduction let's just put it out there they were four times more likely to experience electromagnetic interference like radios static or clocks went dead things like that so to me that struck me as

42:39 I wasn't expecting that, but it makes kind of – it makes sense to me. So there were a number of things about these statistics that when I looked them over, I thought this gives me confidence that the cases that I've got actually are legitimate because they're displaying patterns some I would have expected and some I would not have thought to expect but all kinds make sense So I was really glad that I looked at some of those, uh, statistics. Yes. Those statistics are kind of my favorite part of the book because we're still trying to figure out what this stuff is and one of my favorite ways to approach it is to take one of the various conclusions people come to because there are so, so many cases and then from that conclusion being like, okay, working backwards well

43:25 Could it be this? How many cases conformed to this versus how many cases break this model of thinking. A good example is the whole idea that ufology was created to hide black ops projects or the CIA invented it, and it's like okay well we can break that pretty easy because you just go outside of the existence of the CIA and see no, this stuff was still happening so that's a pretty easy one to break but Some are a lot harder, but I do like looking at the data for those patterns to try to see what emerges. We're just hunting for clues. One thing that I liked about the categories was size. I'm curious if you recall what might be the biggest or smallest example? Oh yes! There's quite a bit of range. I broke those categories into three large, medium and small

44:17 Looking back, it might have been a good idea to have very large medium-small because the way I did it is small. I dubbed anything that a human being could not get inside of. If it was too small, I would call it small. Medium, I surmise anything that one to like a couple of people could fit inside. It's like up to a diameter say 50 feet I would consider medium and then I basically thought anything beyond 50 or 60 feet I just called large but there were a few that I should have created a very large category for like things that were just gargantuan because there are, uh...there were a few of those that were reported and i haven't broken that one down by certain percentage. But no some of these were quite small like particularly um these little orbs you know? A certain number of these cases are described as spherical objects sometimes

45:16 like a metallic spherical. So, you could see a reflection off of them that are solid objects but in other cases they're these glowing orange-yellow things and you really don't know is this a solid object or is this some kind of orb that has its own intelligence? And it's not always easy to know that so some of those are quite small and a number of them would be seen emerging from a larger object That definitely happened. You know, a lot of those little things strike me... I mean, I'm just speculating here but they seem like they're intelligent observers maybe gathering data that's what it seems like. I could be wrong but that's what it looked like But some of these are absolutely gargantuan They are described as such by the witnesses well basically a small town or small city emerging

46:13 from the oceans of this world or going into the oceans of the world, some very large objects. And even if they're not that large they could be described as like football field size which is pretty darn big. Yeah yeah indeed! It's pretty darn big So while we're still in this first hour here do you mind if I read one of my favorites from the book? Sure. Okay, so you give this case a nine on the evidence scale and say it had two to ten witnesses? We don't really know but this was late January that's 9 out of 12 I just want to point out so that's yes a solid case Yes, yeah strong case

46:50 And it had two to 10 witnesses. We don't know exactly, but this was late January 1892 Baja California Mexico you write the U S steam ship Thetis I think set sail from San Diego my old stomping grounds on January 11th 1892 headed for the West coast of Baja California in Mexico The crew was tasked to perform a hydrographic survey of the area. Hydrographic surveys were often carried out using small boats or steamships equipped with the latest surveying instruments This particular mission lasted about three months. One member of that team was George W. Crusel, a young intelligent man of 26. Several months later upon his return from the project and back home in Georgia, Crusel wrote a detailed account of his experience for the Atlanta Constitution. He described what he called a perfect

47:44 puzzle and indeed it is no surprise that he would consider it one. One afternoon, he went with a companion, a Mr S L Cutbrill to head into a large lagoon for bird hunting suddenly they saw what they thought was a large flock of birds but almost immediately upon noticing it whatever they were looking at changed its appearance from dark to a bright even dazzling appearance similar to the intense brilliance of quote reflected sunlight from a mirror or polished surface. Whatever the two men were looking at, it approached from the sea and traveled inland. It was difficult to make out what this was. At first he wrote it was shaped like a large balloon 50 feet high and 30 feet wide.

48:24 Unlike any balloon however, it traveled quote very rapidly. As it approached them It took on the shape of an hourglass and made a most terrific swoop down onto the surface of the water in the lagoon And spread itself out over the surface covering it with a most brilliant halo of light. It stayed there for a moment only to rise and form itself into quote several fantastic shapes in quick succession Crusel wrote that this object moved, quote, This was not a brief sighting. Crussell and Cutt Burrell observed the object's particular antics for at least 15 minutes until it disappeared inland The reader must remember that in 1892 there was no talk anywhere about UAP or flying saucers Crussell seemed mystified by what he experienced He wrote that the object seemed like quote, a sack of phosphorescent gas

49:26 for it never showed a ragged edge, but smooth edges. Just a rubber sack full of air would be mashed into different shapes," he says." I mean it is hard to get weirder than that. He says phosphorescent gas? I think our friend Kosh might say plasma but that's a hell of case! Absolutely. I'm glad you read that one when i say two to ten witnesses, that's just one category so i had three categories of witnesses one two to ten or more. So there was just two witnesses to that case yeah i read cut burrells uh k a cursell's case excuse me i have a link to it you could uh you can read the whole account there in the newspaper at the time the thing about it is he's

50:10 Clearly, like because he describes all the rest of their of his hydrographic survey work. Like that the whole article wasn't just about that 1 thing most of the article was actually just about much more prosaic. activities of this interesting thing that he did on the coast of California there. And he was just writing to his local newspaper about it, but then he thought well is this one weird thing happened and that's what you just read? It's very bizarre! You could tell like he's a very serious minded person I could see no reason to doubt or dispute the account itself and now we're left thinking what the heck did he encounter

50:50 It came in from the ocean. Maybe it wasn't actually in the water, but when you look at that region there's no land for it to have come from so just came from the ocean if it's some natural form of bizarre ball lightning which none of the conditions match for ball lightning I don't think even so like it lasted for 15 minutes and acted In such an intelligent manner and also blindingly bright you made a very big point about how incredibly. Write this thing was just moved inland as if it had intent so it's very bizarre it doesn't fit the normal narrative we have like a metallic craft exiting the water,

51:33 But it's strange as hell and I thought this has to go into the collection. Yes, it is great and yeah the two to ten thing I might have missed where it was a category...I just thought like if you have named witnesses and they're on a ship who really knows exactly how many people are on the ship but? A lot of times you don't know! Yeah. And that witness category that I put in there on a few occasions, I just had to make my best guess as to what it was. Most of the time—I'd say more than 90% of the cases—it's clear how many witnesses there were but sometimes it isn't. But in that case, it's definitely two. Yeah, I love that one like I said about looking from... We have an illustration for it as well and we're going to… Oh yeah! We got video so let's take a look. It's in a book. Reading Rainbow. This is from

52:24 Alan Levine did it. I don't know how well is coming across there You can see he's got his face looking at it and that might do it Yeah, maybe come again It's not the hourglass part of the sighting which is what? I want an illustration of but it is very interesting Well, apparently it morphed in its shape at various times. So very strange. And that's why I like cases like that because they don't fit into any box and you look at this stuff long enough for as many years as you have and you start to try to come to a conclusion then you say wait well what about that case? How do we make that case fit with this hypothesis? That's one of those ones Charles Ford would've loved! It just doesn't fit in any box

53:06 But now, so obviously I love talking to you before we run out of time. You know, we are able to have both conversations and you are knowledgeable about both realms. As you mentioned the 9-11 thing people didn't like you going into that realm it's like sorry you're a military historian you're gonna talk about many things that have to do with military and history and geopolitics And you know a lot of UFO shows probably don't want you to bring that stuff up I'm one that is...I'm comfortable having either conversation but right now... I'm happy to go there It really seems like

53:46 You know, the news runs on fear. Obviously you got to keep people tuning in so you can sell more ads make more money and so they run on fear and they're telling us that we're inching closer World War Three maybe we are I'm just curious with all your knowledge how different our current events really? I mean are things as unstable and volatile as they're made to seem how unprecedented are some of the Trump administration's actions in a historical context How concerned are you that we might be in a geopolitical conflict maybe before this show goes out to the people? I wouldn't call myself a proper military historian. I just wanted to say that, I've studied the lot of military interactions with UFOs. I have a good handle on a lot of military history but there are pros who are vastly more

54:36 qualified than I am to be a military historian. I'm a UFO historian is what i would say but that's minor thing geopolitics so the last time you and I met talked Biden was president and was leading the U.S into what I think was a kind of fanatical obsessive posture relating to Russia which I thought was foolish in the extreme now we have Trump in office where I would say in that relationship, he has a much far more sensible attitude toward Russia which i think is a very good thing. On the other hand he...I was always worried about this like his attachment to defending Israel at all costs in the Middle East have always believed was a real liability and we've seen it

55:35 Now, the real question is what will happen with Israel Iran and the United States moving forward. I mean the fact that he allowed Israel to attack Iran while they were in the middle of negotiations... They had five rounds of negotiations US and Iran And that's when Israel attacked Iran That's what we call duplicitous This is why nations do not trust the United States You know, you're in the middle of a negotiation and you allow your attack dog to try to decapitate your government's leadership. Which is what that was. That was a decapitation strike and to a large extent it succeeded against some of the Iranian military and their scientists. It did not succeed against their leader but still like this was

56:23 Obviously, a gross miscalculation by the neocons and by the Israelis and by Trump himself. It was very bad move in my opinion because we know what actually happened. They miscalculated it so they could switch out the Iranian government. They failed. And Iran has vastly more missiles than Israel does And Israel's Iron Dome is not impervious as they had all told themselves. Maybe it's okay, but it's not perfect and Iran has tens of thousands – we don't even know how many more missiles that they could fire and they were getting through! Yes, Iran was taking damage as well but Iran is like 90 times the physical size of Israel

57:11 and they've got 10 times the population. They've got the ability to handle this in a war of attrition, Israel does not." And the word was that Israel had maybe a couple weeks at most left of air defense missiles so they had to sue for peace once it became obvious that uh... The attack by the B-2 stealth bombers with bunker busters on the Fordo nuclear site probably has not succeeded the way Trump says, probably not. I don't think anyone believes it. I think the Israelis realize like they got nothing left and they had to go for a ceasefire and the Iranians have come out of this as winners so the real question... And the other thing that Trump

57:54 As foolish as he was to support this, or maybe incapable of restraining the neocons. That's also possible He also realized that Iran had the ability close the Straits of Hormuz and if that were to happen oil prices would skyrocket And that is probably the last thing he wants because that would be disastrous for him politically Also his MAGA base is furious with him over this I mean they're furious He took a lot of hits on this and to say nothing of the reputation of the IAEA, the International Energy Atomic Administration which i think has lost all credibility about this now for a whole bunch of other reasons. And now the result actually is that no one knows where Iran's nuclear material is in the past Iran had probably been the most inspected country in the world as far as nuclear materials went and

58:47 They've totally gone dark and they're basically flipping the bird to the IAEA, which honestly you can't blame them. The IAEA is run by incompetent people and there's talk that they even gave intelligence to the West. So it was a bad decision all around by the Trump White House and Israel to make this attack. It was foolish It was typical though of the West where like these people are always convinced that they have all kinds of power that they actually don't have. They overestimate their own ability, Wests military I think Ukraine has shown that it's a paper tiger Western military is paper tigers you had the entire combined force of NATO arming Ukraine with hundreds billions of dollars in weaponry and they're burning on the field of Ukraine and they're losing there in a state of catastrophe right now

59:40 So I think the world is starting to realize all this Western power is actually not what people had recently thought it was. And that includes America's ability to strike Iran, so the B-2 dropped these 30,000 ton bunker buster missiles, 30,000 pound missiles incredibly heavy and I don't think that they took out the Iranian capacity to operate their nuclear refinement Where will this go? Really good chance that this could expand into another attack. Israel, I think would not be above trying to assassinate the Alita Khomeini of Iran and if that were to happen who knows where and right now like you know that Russia and China are trying to convince Iran to accept their air defense technology as well. The Iranian's rather foolishly turned that down last year but they may they may accept that now

1:00:37 So, if World War III were to break out you're really looking at the US and NATO and Israel probably Japan in South Korea against essentially the BRICS alliance. Russia China I don't know where India or Pakistan would be. Pakistan is very close with China and with Iran so... And then of course Iran. Iran is no joke they're very capable not as capable as they would like to be or could have been. Their intelligence apparatus, I think is very... showed a lot of holes but we do not want this. This is the Thucydides trap in ancient Greek historian Thucydides it refers to the dilemma

1:01:27 of a rising power threatening the status of an established power. And when that happens, conflicts can occur. Sometimes the rising power will do a preemptive strike or sometimes the dominant power will try to do a preemptive strike to maintain its position. And we're definitely looking at that. The US dominated world of like 1991 after the Cold War ended, when America just sat like a sumo wrestler on top of the rest of the world and it was America's World 30 years later and America just pissed it all away. Like all of those advantages have just been basically pissed away so that's not that world anymore.

1:02:11 And just going back to Biden for a second, why I think his policy was so ruinous internationally is that his people refused to recognize that the world had changed and that they could just do regime change in Ukraine back in 2014. And then bring Ukraine into NATO and arm it with nuclear weapons like over Russian objections like this isn't 1992 anymore. You can't consider that And Trump and his people, I think are making the same mistakes unfortunately. And I think that is a great objective analysis it is so hard to know what to trust these days because Trump's people say we did get the strike done right and the media hates Trump so much that of course they're going to downplay anything he does and say he failed. Right! That is a true paradigm So its hard to know you mentioned the Strait Of Hermoos? I heard that they actually are kind of geo-fencing

1:03:06 the Strait of Hormuz and that their Western vessels can't use their radar or really can't go through at night. And it's starting to stack up the costs, but you know people who are in The BRICS Alliance they're getting through just fine and it's all done technologically that could turn into something intense I also read that the Tehran newspaper again You don't know what you can trust but they said that Iran uncovered an Israeli plot to cause explosions on US soil Through information shared by a friendly nation, upon learning of the potential attack Iranians sent messages to U.S. officials and prevented the planned explosion from occurring

1:03:42 Don't know, you know. But that false flag I assume? Right yeah they were going to try to garner up American support to protect Israel by doing a false flag and that's something we need to watch out for i suppose so last question because this is when it comes to international stuff I want to ask you about China because I hear again two totally different stories one Is that the new silk road is going to become the new economic powerhouse in the US is gonna be left out and we all need to worry about China's emerging dominance into. Is that China's economic growth is all fabricated. It's a house of cards, it's about to fall they've got ghost cities and huge poverty crises And the chickens are going to come home to roost any day now I could see The first one as being fear-based I could see the second scenario As cope for people who don't want to confront the reality That America isn't number one anymore

1:04:38 But countries lie, countries represent themselves as having more power than they do. What do you think about those claims that China's economic growth is largely fabricated and highly controlled? And it really isn't this powerhouse that's emerging that is claimed to be? I think that they are a powerhouse. I think there absolutely...I don't like...I think that the United States though is very well situated always to be an economic power. Like You'd have to change the entire US geography. I mean, look we have two massive coastlines that have deep water harbors where we're perfectly situated for shipping. We've got the Mississippi River system which is probably the most profitable lucrative river system in the world like you could be a farmer in the middle of Iowa drop your agricultural product on one of the tributaries going into Mississippi float that thing down and go out the port of New Orleans and go out to the world

1:05:36 And that's a massive economic powerhouse right there. The United States just has been blessed with incredible natural resource riches and geo positioning, like we're just got lucky man! We've got a great place so America will always have an economic engine So to say that we'll be left behind, I think is no. That's not likely relative to other regions yes, we can lose ground that's not impossible. As far as the China look the entire world is looking at a demographic crisis. China? Yes absolutely! Look at Korea my god look at Japan

1:06:25 The entire Far East is looking at a massive demographic crisis. Look at Europe, Russia! They're not in a great position. Canada is bad, bad shape demographically and the United States less so for two reasons A we've got kind of religious Bible belt where people still make babies thank you guys but also we do bring in a lot of immigrants both legal and otherwise and so that keeps that happening. But even like other regions where population growth has been always very high, like Africa it's lower than it's ever been South America lower than its ever been there are global demographic issues here that I think are just happening and so That potentially could lead to a real crisis in a place like China sure

1:07:15 Of course, the other factor though is how will that mix with the AI revolution that's happening right now in which what you know take your number. What percentage of the workforce is going to be displaced within the next one year two years five years whatever it is? It's a lot I think we're gonna have another generation at least of very very tumultuous difficult times at least another 20 years where there's going to be too many people for jobs And you're going to have a very potentially large underclass of people that are just, they're not employed. And is UBI gonna fix everything? I seriously doubt that. So this is a real problem but it's not going to be unique to China. Yeah they do have ghost cities absolutely like they've made a lot of mistakes in their development without a doubt

1:08:13 But they are having economic growth. I don't think those numbers are fake. Well, I'm glad you could talk some sense into me because I just don't know. But yes, I love talking to you. I'm glad we can talk aliens and then also practical stuff and I think it's pretty clear nothing is going to happen in the US because we got all the alien bases out there in the desert so we should be okay. They won't let us falter but this has been really enjoyable as always. Let people know what they should know about following your work or becoming a member of the site! Yeah thanks!

1:08:53 I got a YouTube channel called Richard Dolan Intelligent Disclosure. Pretty easy to find. I have a membership-based website, as you mentioned, richarddolanmembers.com There's a lot of free stuff on there. There's firewall material that I put up but there is a lot that I just put right up there and anyone can check it out to see what I'm up too. I've got social media presence on TwitterX Even Instagram. I have people who do that for me, but they do put my stuff out there. I'm very grateful so um...I will say that the follow-up to this volume of USO History i do expect will be out I'm hoping in about a month. I'm in very good wrap up phase for the second volume and I'm hoping that will get out before long and then Volume 3 also this year

1:09:45 All three volumes. Alright, well thanks again! I am so lucky to be able to have these conversations with you every so often. I look forward to USO's Volumes 2 and 3. Keep up the great work and take care! Thank you Greg it's a pleasure You know him, you love him. The great Richard Dolan and he brings it like it's always been brought and I expect no less from the best in the game And I guess I do need to stop calling him a military historian but my understanding is that that was basically his formal education before He found the UFO rabbit hole and I just think it's good context for why he's well equipped to do The False Flag Series 2

1:10:31 But 30 years is a long time. Probably should just call him a UFO historian like he says, and I'm glad he just likes talking to me enough to come back through every year or so. I'm sure the interview requests never stop coming in and it's a special club that i'm happy to be in where we've had an easy time setting this up every so often since we started in 2020 And I also know that I need to maybe do some work on my home setup here. I didn't think I was going to go down the big key light stage lighting, home set up rabbit hole just to do wrap ups but this is what people expect so halo lights? I guess...I don't know we'll see

1:11:14 But I really was just kind of joking around to content wise when it comes to the people who tend to say that. I think everything is a PSYOP when it comes to the ET disclosure thing, except when it reveals something through an occult lens and then I'm hook line and sinker you know? I don't actually think I'm that bad but I do understand why people have started to say that about me It's obviously clear that I'm fascinated by this topic and. I wouldn't say that I have completely discarded the ETH, and yes, I know who am I to even assess this topic with any kind of authority or high level analysis? But I've read a lot of accounts and it's harder to see these experiences in sightings and even the crafts in that ETH context

1:12:00 Even with something like USOs, crafts that operate through water and air as if there's no change at all. That seems very metaphysical again yes with advanced enough tech maybe it defies categorization and again it's a big flowchart of your worldview, really. It kind of depends on what you think about many different things along the chain can disembodied intelligences or consciousnesses bleed into this world from the formless realm of spirit? That's not everyone's model but if you adopt something like that or even a simulation model all material might just be the same for some being that comes through like that

1:12:43 They can drift in and out of water like they can drive through buildings and through closed windows as I've heard reported before. It's all just material! I spent a lot of years with the alien hypothesis, but just after some deep dives into the occult and even shamanism context that i didn't have in the early years you listen to their experiences and you listened to shamans in Peru actually say those aren't spaceships there are spirits and I guess i've just sort of learned to trust that the whole summoning of UFOs as well whether it's Steven Greer or TheBloodsoFamily when you're hearing these accounts even where people just are if not in a heightened emotional state, just thinking that they want to see one at that moment or suddenly feeling like they should look outside.

1:13:34 I don't know. I just don't see a connection between those layers of the experience and a spaceship just operating as a transport vehicle or something mental going on for sure it even seems individualized in most cases really, I should just stick to asking questions and letting the experts make their case but if you like The Free First Hour, You Know The Second Hour goes deeper and gets stranger It's Just How Conversations Go sign up at the higher side chats dot com It actually got a little spicy in the Plus show when I brought up Matthew Aritz, The Hidden Hand Behind UFOs documentary series and his work on The Aviary. Richard clearly gets a bit frustrated by the excessive distrust of everything and i do understand

1:14:19 Because I drift in and out of that mindset too sometimes if we have a bar, that's too high to clear. Why should anyone on the inside even try? And are we really going to learn anything more than we already know if we don't get the insiders to speak so do we hurt our own quest for answers by being too skeptical it's a fair question It's intellectually lazy to just say that it's all bullshit. And it's also kind of disrespectful to those who do the hard work, separate the good from the bad, but it's a tangled web. These are muddy waters. It's hard to conclude much of anything. It feels safer to just default to skepticism. I understand that too. And I do wonder about this photo though, then I'm going to throw up on the screen and let me tell you what this is

1:15:08 This is a meeting of the minds from September 14th and 15th 1993 at the Rockefeller's Ranch in Wyoming. And from left to right you have Henry Diamond, Dr. Steven Greer, Dr. Bruce McAbee George Lamb Robert Bigelow Linda Moulton Howell Dr. Leo Spinkle Keith Thompson Dr. John Mack Lawrence Rockefeller, Dr. C.B Scott Jones, Johnny Jones, Robert Tietz and then behind the camera is apparently Mary Bootsy Gail Breath and Richard Farley I don't even know that much about several figures in the photo but it's kind of interesting to see where the careers of all these people went since 1993 in this particular meeting

1:16:01 What do people think? Well, there are those who say this is a photo of a meeting of many of the players that were tasked with creating this subculture or steering it in a certain direction. And there are others who say Lawrence Rockefeller was just an individual with an interest in this and he used his family name and resources to carry out his own investigations. And as much as the Rockefeller name on anything seems to be kind of a red flag that is possible isn't it That he just was interested I just think it's a provocative pre-internet photo that maybe they didn't expect to be combed over like it is today and I wish I could have just heard those conversations because, I'll always wonder. Either way the free first hour was good but the plus show is better thats where we covered some of the claims about undersea bases and got into the aviary material and role of disinformation in the discourse

1:16:55 I did get him to talk about the occult a bit. He asks why can't both things be true and separate even though there might be some overlap? And i say that's fair, cheers! I'll meet him there. The Enochian stuff coming up in those two different contexts... You know I like that though can't deny it but I did love the book going through all those cases is pretty mind-blowing he did a great job and I look forward to future volumes In THC news, I think today or tomorrow plus members should see a button on the website to access that clip genie thing. It'll be on any episode page right under the video if you're in the $12 tier, you'll see the searchable transcript archive button

1:17:43 and that's where you can really dive deep. Take any word in this here English language, and search for it in the Clip Genie archive and you will be served up every moment in THC history going back 15 years where that word has been used You can click the link to instantly be brought to that part of the interview or you can just see the words in the transcript It's a beautiful thing. Other than that, THC TV is heating up there's a fair amount of signups and upgrades to the $12 plan on the website A little less than I hoped but i really can't complain It's funny that the Patreon has always been such a small portion of the THC memberships. But when it comes to THC Plus TV and adding this $12 tier, we have one guy! So I am uploading the video versions of these shows to Patreon for one man. Thank you Bob G., I do it all for you. Hopefully some people will be added to that category soon but

1:18:45 We shall see. I also have to throw out a big thanks to all those who have said that they still really only care about audio, but are going to sign up for the $12 tier anyway just to give me a good little attaboy that is super generous of you can't thank you enough and as for the last episode review we are talking about Jay Widener dusting off his old Cross of Henday work I thought it was pretty true to form for us and fit in nicely with our very wild archive, but i'm not alone the plus people agreed 4.7 we are back baby gotta love it

1:19:22 That was a good one. Jay is a pro, he did a great job and that subject matter is both unique and ties into a lot of other things broader perspectives brought up by many guests about plasma encyclical cataclysms and the cathedrals being something much different originally I loved it Alright, meetup calendar time. Next on the calendar are two events on July 16th we have one in New Haven Connecticut and one in Ontario Ranch California and then the next one after that is the following Sunday July 20th in Centralia Washington at Bub's Pub Sports & Grill

1:20:03 Also, July 20th the crooked Q in Colorado Springs, Colorado and then the following day after that July 21st Monday Gail Bratz alehouse Auckland New Zealand It's been there for a while. And then we have danger Dave shit talk circle and Benningville Arkansas on August 1st and Astoria Oregon on August 8th So alright Seems like there's new events added all the time. Hiresidemeetups.com to get more information on any of these or to make your own. Let a mutual love of THC be the path to connecting you with more like-minded individuals because that's what life is about, right?

1:20:48 Alright, that's about it. Get more Richard Dolan at richarddolanmembers.com or check out the Richard Dolan show on YouTube always a good time Thank him if you enjoyed listening to this and you want them to come back I'm getting out of here your move disclosure directors deep corporate cabals in USO secret keepers your fucking boo My mama used to tell us stories about playing outside That thing that we never had to do They say life is better since they covered the sky And got rid of all that pesky heat They had no protection from the sun back then Just scary exposed out there

1:21:44 I hear they fight over what they eat each night A burden we don't have to bear Because our factory meatcake Comes every morning Always tastes just right And we never have to get dirty in here Cause the pot is always white Just imagine the trouble of finding some job to do Or finding your own The implants weren't made yet, they aren't as connected You sometimes had to be alone He didn't yet know. Trust them and let them care for people We have answers now for every back then they had thinking

1:23:11 I get nuts, I wake up. I dreamt factory meatcakes didn't come every month almost fell apart I dreamt we sometimes heard the outside wasn't always white

1:24:27 Oh, you're still here. I thought we were done well there you have it another great entry into the deep and robust THC archive that goes back over 15 years at this point peruse it all at the higher side chats dot com and take advantage And now that that interview is over and we're winding down, I can talk to you a bit more casually about what it is we do here. Because again, you just heard or watched the first hour of a two-hour interview on a show that has gone to great lengths to stay outside of the ad sponsor monetization model and instead opted to maintain true independence through subscriptions only

1:25:08 Over time I've done a lot to improve the Plus Member experience and tried to keep convenience and quality of life in mind, which many paid offerings sadly do not. But let's talk about some details that tend to be on people's minds when they consider making the leap So if you are someone who just listens to the audio, as the show has been for many years we have the same long-running THC Plus subscription for eight bucks a month. Five new shows a month and the full archive no seasons or breaking it up in weird sketchy ways We have a great on-site player with all the bells and whistles, you can download full episodes and listen offline. And there is a lively comment section and 5 star rating system on each episode page so I can see what Plus members tend to like best! We also found a way around the annoying need to put in your username & password when using the private RSS feed in many of the podcasting apps

1:26:04 Now, we have your subscription data built right into the link on the My Account page. Just copy it and paste it in pretty much any podcasting app and you are done! If it ever freezes up on you or stops loading or anything, you can even regenerate yourself a new URL on this same my account page. It's an upgrade that truly does make it much easier than it used to be and we even take it one step further. When you first sign up for a membership, we send you a welcome email that includes that link again. You just copy it paste it boom your in And I know accessing the main show in an ongoing way is really just the only thing 90% of plus members want. But if you do get into the website, you will find some old bonus episodes and live events on the bonus content page. The old cover songs I used to close the show out with as well as some of the new ones I've made recently. And you also get a lifetime forum membership where we have all sorts of interesting categories and threads including the best place to get a guest request to me

1:27:08 People ask me about that pretty regularly, but how could I not put added weight to plus member recommendations? So there you go. Hint hint now in June of 2025, I made the big leap to video it seemed like that's what a growing number of people wanted, but the fear was over being able to deliver episodes in video conveniently behind a paywall because it's a lot more challenging than it is with just audio though we did figure it out Although streaming video does have a lot of extra costs to it, go figure. And that is why we added the new tier of THC Plus TV for people who want that video without changing the price for those who don't really care. So for 12 bucks a month you can get the full shows in video with captions and a nice word search and all the features of the audio player as well as Android and Apple casting from your phone to TV. That's nice!

1:28:01 I also sweetened the $12 tier with one other important feature that has ongoing costs to keep updated and that's a Clip Genie archive of all THC episodes going back to the beginning. And what Clip Genie does is allow you to search by any word and be served up all the transcripts of all the episodes that have included that word, and a clickable link to start the episode right at that point in the show it's very slick People have asked for transcripts for a long time because episodes are so information dense. And this was a way for me to not only provide that, but make them all searchable with the system that provides everything a person could want for finding exactly what they're looking for with the hundreds of episodes there are. All right? So if you think I'm good at what I do and you appreciate the extra effort I make to try to come prepared and lead our guests through the most compelling parts of their work

1:28:55 I'm not asking for a handout. I'm asking for you to get twice as much of the content you already like, for eight bucks or 12 bucks a month. I've used this analogy before but we tip $8 for all sorts of services these days without even thinking about it especially in this new world of the dumb tablet checkouts where they pre-highlight 20% and make you feel bad for switching it to anything else and when you tip eight dollars because someone brought you a sandwich from the back nobody brings you a second sandwich I know ad supported podcasting makes it seem like it should all be free, but independence is worth something especially in this counterculture field. And there's no way to make a viable career out of it otherwise

1:29:37 Some people will say, well what about value for value? But I tried that first and big donations came with aggressive guest suggestions. And that just doesn't work for our type of format though it may work for other formats either way the subscription model has not let me down in 15 years and i thank those who sign up and i hope more people do! As for the typical questions I get that might help you decide or speed up your onboarding, usually I get where is the second hour? Because unlike other shows. I don't split each episode into two files because I find that to be inconvenient. You've got to find the other one and then load that up and it stops in the middle and you might have to hear 2 introductions and 2 wrap ups... It's a little bit

1:30:22 Clunky, but no. Plus members get the full two hour conversation just as it was had in a single file I always ask for the promo stuff last so I cut right before that and splice it on to the first hour And that is how the free hours made and I just strip out the rest So it still sounds pretty whole for free our listeners as you just heard and I do prefer it that way And when you're logged into the website, all the shows magically switch over to the plush shows. So it's seamless and that seamlessness has caused confusion before, but just look at the show length if you're unsure and know that you cannot be logged in and be seeing the free first hour episodes trust me

1:31:07 I spared no expense. They call me the John Hammond of conspiracy podcasting, and I don't say that other people say that so yes if you just signed up and you want to go back and listen to older episodes you do have to skip ahead about 50 minutes to hear the new content but once you are a member you'll be much happier with the full show in a single file and not maintaining two feeds and jumping from file to file just to hear one interview Another common question I get asked is if Plus members have to listen through the website. And of course, the answer is no we have that custom tokenized RSS link that works with many of the podcasting apps and the site is built to have some nice tools included to make it easier and more fun to listen but not necessary.

1:31:51 Spotify is the only weird one. To get Plus on Spotify, you must sign up through Patreon because they have a corporate partnership together! Honestly we know how the game is played I don't have to go too deep into it here but yes major corporations have taken over the internet they get everyone reliant on a handful of convenient platforms and then they push out the controversial content Even though I try to stay integrated for your convenience as much as I can. But some of that stuff can change at any time and that is why i always prioritize and maintain my own independent website but that's it really, I don't want to front load the show with too heavy of a pitch because then it sounds like an ad when I like to say we're ad free sponsorship-free and independent is little more accurate

1:32:36 But because the video is complicated, some things it just seemed best to run through all of it and slap it at the very end of these episodes. So your questions and concerns could be answered. And hopefully I've convinced you that it's worth it sign up at the higher side chats dot com or write in a show notes or the episode description Again, we send you that welcome email with the private tokenized RSS link right there. So you never have to log into the website if you don't want to and if you sign up for video, We are going to be sending the new episode notifications there too where you click the link and it logs you in automatically and your right there to stream it so I'm doing what I can help me help you double your pleasure double your fun and get twice as much with THC plus And that's all there is There isn't any more