RamX | Fortean Winds: High Strangeness, Ufology, & Old Money

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03:44 Serenity now, dear people of the internet. From the Sunshine State I'm Greg Carlwood and while we play politics absorb entertainment and silence our internal screams for a more meaningful existence right on through our morning commute might it be possible that on a hidden level of reality that humans rarely see were being watched studied and maybe even farmed in a curated free-range environment for some para ultra crypto terrestrial higher order of beings? Few thoughts are more unsettling than something else out there so far beyond our own ability that it might have even engineered our own limitations, spawned religions for fun with dramatic displays and toyed with millions of people over the culmination of the human story while the rest of us dismiss their experiences en masse.

04:29 Might we be food, energetic nourishment or just playthings for advanced shape-shifting sentient light beings living right alongside us undetected and unacknowledged as we obsess over a 24 hour news cycle and never ending string of distractions? Well few people have done more to advance these ideas as well the wide range of bizarre anomalous happenings throughout history than Charles Fort. Even spawning in entire field study in high strangeness category all his own and today's guest romex knows this all too well as he has been engaged in such research for years much of which is talked about on his website and podcast aptly titled forty and wins.

05:08 The 40&Wins podcast ran for four years and concluded not too long ago with some very interesting insights from Rom X that I asked him to come here to talk about. And wouldn't you know it, here we are! So let's go people the 40&Wins researcher ultra-terrestrial investigator and high strangeness sleuth Rom X welcome to the higher side my man Hey, Greg. Thanks for having me so glad to be here. Yeah thank you for doing this as you know I went to pop on the most recent episode of 40 and wins one day and was surprised to hear you say it was ending but that last episode would be a deep dive into your own final conclusions about ufology in all things related And a lot of these conclusions were similar to my own but went much further and contained provocative comments here and there that i just wanted to hear more about

05:59 But one of the big things I think we both agree on is that we're dealing with something much closer to home, maybe something that is a form of sentient light or plasma at its core. Is that right? That's correct yeah so the Russians think that you know I mean their science team seems to think that at least one form of this is intelligent plasma and it's a good guess what we see is uh or what people report as a ball of light And then that ball of light becomes something else in many cases you know not all sometimes things show up better looking physical it is funny how people try to logic out what's happening but for example and a lot of big foot cases y'all have people who write entire books where

06:48 a UFO is present during Bigfoot encounters. And so then people think, oh well, Bigfoot must be flying this spaceship from somewhere else out in space and it's like no no no maybe it's a projection maybe it's a shape shift of some kind and maybe they're always present but are only noticed in a handful of cases It becomes so apparent at some point in the research I think as you're going into I mean, I would love to see a race between the Mothman and Bigfoot in UFOs. I'd pay lots of money for that. The fact that these beings are cryptids or sometimes they're just crazy looking euphonauts right? The case of Carl Higdon i think is a great example of something that showed up looking like a five-year old druid like oh I want a hook for an arm and I want another arm on here and it was like something having a good time

07:44 And I think, I like Kiel's work best when he really identifies that. When he really dives into that and when he notices the absurdities just like Valet does but Kiel takes it a little bit further and says okay this is what this phenomenon is. I think we often get lost... A phrase that I really like to use with the phenomenon is simple definitions and that something police officers use they say simple definition And it's a problem because police officers are always saying, well that guy looks like he criminal and maybe harass him. But often they're right. That's why they do it and let's not say any of that is correct but simple definitions is what police usually operate on and they do that because it's usually correct right?

08:36 It's not a bad idea in this case because I found that the more i try to narrow in on a tighter definition, the quicker someone throws a case at me that's like well what about this it didn't happen over here and it's like yeah okay sure let's broaden out a little bit. Exactly we could find 25 different reptile soul sucker cases and then we go oh there's gray huggers! It's all over the map One thing that people will do, that researchers will do is cherry pick. And then they go oh well only the reptile ones are real and the greyhuggers are all just people making stuff up so we tried to really avoid that at 14 wins since we created a standard of evidence

09:20 And that's in our about section if anyone is curious. But that's how we went about evaluating cases because I think you have to start using common sense, simple definitions and common sense. I don't have to worry about harassing anyone until the phenomenon sues me or something. I do not know. So I can use the simple definitions when it comes to the phenomenon. They are often correct. I think like in the case of say the Nimitz encounter in the Tic Tac, right? And I think that that one's really important because for me that was the extraordinary evidence case. Carl Sagan used to say, right, extraordinary claims take extraordinary evidence. The extraordinary evidence is all there in the Tic Tac case you have instrumentation lots and lots of witnesses multiple instances. There was no more than you could ask for and it wasn't until 2019 when the Navy admitted that video was real

10:17 that I finally said, oh okay maybe you know and then looked into it. And when i looked into it I took about a month to evaluate the TICTAC case let's go through the math let's go through the witnesses let's start asking questions of people from the government. And you do have a background as a data analyst and a technologist you said which you know maybe needs further flushing out but Why do you think that you might be someone who, because of your regular professional background might have a deeper insight into analyzing material like this? Yeah it's tricky. I don't like to talk about my background the main reason that we don't talk about our backgrounds at 14 wins is to keep our egos out

11:05 And there's so much of that in the ufology field, right? An influencer is someone who oftentimes gains the confidence of the audience and that could be appropriately given or not. So we said we're not going to be influencers when people come to 14 wins We want you to focus on the information I'm pseudo retired now as you pointed out so i can share a little bit I do have a background as a technologist I have worked in private and sometimes public. I have some background of working with classified material, but nothing UAP related so otherwise I couldn't talk about it but that was a long time ago however it did give me those two things together like having some government knowledge and then having a lot of technology experience

12:01 This landed me in a lot of different places and gave me some context. And I think it gave me some of the skills to help, you know take this on in my way anyway there's a lot of different ways to look at this phenomenon as you've had some great guests on like Pasolka and you've had Miguel Conner on looking at it from completely different directions Peter Lavenda Like none of those people could care less about the propulsion of these craft, which was what really drove me at first. And that was going to be one of my questions for you because You start off that podcast talking about light beams that need

12:45 physical matter to interact in our environment. They can change things around, they can shape-shift themselves and then you go into how they fly and you say it's counter rotating magnets which is a common conclusion around here even Gerald Pollack the water scientist towards the end of our interview made some comments about the Earths negative charge that just there naturally and that you could use that as a basis for creating technology that counteracts that charge Which is essentially we're talking about magnetism so that's there but you know when you talk about light being and then moving to how these crafts fly using magnets now getting into technology. And i guess i don't see the job because it seems like these beans dont need any technology as we know what are you talking about our own craft when you say that some of the reverse engineering that's been done

13:40 My theory, and it's backed by the evidence but as you know we always have to be careful with the fact that we can make theories fit the evidence right? But my theory it echoes Valet and Kiel's which is when it wants to play in our space. It's creating things its creating physical objects And those physical objects I don't know what all of the rules are in terms of those objects, but I know that in terms of the magnetism...I'll share a little bit about how I came to that conclusion because we didn't get into that. And it's really through the medical evidence and there are just a lot of bodies that have been affected by craft that were too close and so analyzing the medical evidence and then analyzing against all the different types of propulsion that we thought might be the case

14:38 That was the only one that matched up. And that's how we came to that conclusion, if you were to peer review with your Harvard astrophysicist they would throw you out of a bus. Affect the human body because we often hear radiation associated with this stuff that that is the cause people even going to biblical stories of people being turned into a pillar of salt and not kind of thing. And they speculate that well that might have been an interaction it was too close to one of these light beams or something but i got magnets were fairly harmless i mean i know in mri, is using magnets but talk to us little bit deeper about that

15:19 Right. There's a couple of things going on here, one of the things that when you talk about radiation in relation to this the one anomaly among the anomalous energy signatures that were left on people from these craft is gamma So I'm theorizing, and it seems to be logical that it's some form of fission that's powering the magnets. And it's a unique form of fission that we don't understand or the public doesn't understand. That is how people can get irradiated by standing too close but then Kiel had a theory and it's interesting

16:02 And there's a couple of interdimensional ways that that might be happening. But his theory was that once you brought these things into physical reality, that they would begin to decay because they're not physically real. So as they decay, they would give off radiation. i make sense so you mentioned to me mac tony's the author of crypto terrestrials and it's funny cuz when i started this show like. Thirteen years ago at this point one of the first time someone was brought up who i was like oh man i'd love to interview them but their dad it was mctonie is an interview with nick redford then he got me thinking about why should we,

16:44 trust these beans that point to the stars and say that's where they're from when maybe it's the exact opposite and they are from underground. And i was like oh man this is right up my alley but of course he passed in i've read the book its been about a decade now but what did you get from mac tonys and that crypto terrestrial book that u fit into your overall puzzle Part of it was the timing of when I encountered some of these things. And it was in the course of their research, and we had just been finding tunnel after tunnel near sites with high UAP activity. So naturally you're like are they living underground? That's not a crazy question. Even the ET folks have all sorts of underground lore there is a possibility there and it doesn't really matter at their point of origin to me

17:36 I think that that question gets in the way of the research. So, the point of origin whether they're from another dimension or from the inner earth or from here maybe they were former humans The point of this story is their capabilities so when i sort of redefine ultra terrestrials for 14 wins which is we're referring to the capabilities they have and so they had these capabilities and they had these tunnels And then when I found Tawny's work, it was just so much parallels between what we were finding and what he had found 15 years ago or 20 years ago. And he had done a really good job of, I thought taking Vallee's work further and really challenging it and doing it in a very respectful peer-driven way because Vallee is probably the greatest UFO researcher of all time but he doesn't have it figured out

18:37 It's up to the rest of us. He's got some stuff figured out, but in terms of Tani's work and specifically what speaks to me is that frequency of the tunnels, the frequency of the craft, the frequency of the population, the UFOnauts... These things are happening every day. UFO instances are happening every day If they're here that much, they're not visitors. So they're here in one sense or another." And then we find physical evidence that there was traces of a civilization underground the Nazca mummies... There's tons of tunnels in Peru and we've been diving into that more connection between megalithic structures and tunnels and non-human bodies

19:24 Yeah and in that last episode you even said don't fully discount the things tom de long says which was a bit of a head scratch for me i mean. The reality is that he's gonna have some good information i don't know what percentage of it is good information but no him and a couple other guys have this carnival barker personality type or something just doesn't strike me as uh, Resonance but he did say in the joe rogan interview is like well you wouldn't even believe the real story and is that will just tell it to me and then which another thing is i was like i can even say because people are gonna be able to deal with this information i really hate to be baby like that.

20:05 He said well it goes all the way back to atlantis and advanced civilization after a big cataclysm got off world or went underground and they were so advance that they just broke off in then you get into richard dolan's breakaway civilizations stuff. And i don't know if it rings true to me but the hope be in a lot of cultures do have legends of hey its time for a cataclysm some advanced being came and took us underground so we could survive And that stuff's interesting. But when you mention former humans and then also light beings, it's like well there is this trope of humans being able to advance themselves to a degree that they become pure light It's always been in spiritual stuff and the mystical stuff...and that's just curious! If advanced civilization did crack this code of becoming light

20:57 Well, maybe they're still around. They still consider this somewhat a home but they're so far removed from humanity that we interpret them as something so bizarre they must be from outer space I don't know but it's like there's not a lot of other things that... We have this mysticism tradition of you can advance and become green slime You know? It's like- it's light! So it is interesting that there's a hit there somewhat. So two things here DeLongue and then we'll get back to the inner earth part of that So DeLong, he is an asset. That's the definition of an intelligence asset and I think even in Pasulka's American Cosmic she clearly recognizes the fact that she's being recruited by Tim Taylor as an asset they're assets right? And they can be aware of it but then their fed information and we don't know which part is true and which isn't and they don't either how would you

21:58 So when it comes to DeLong, I think the things that he's saying match up with what we found in Forte and Wins are the same things that Gary Nolan is saying because they're based on evidence. Those are evidence-based ideas and that's the same evidence that we're looking at so they start to deal with nonlocal consciousness which other people don't want to deal with and its part of the phenomenon And then they wrap that into, okay how does that fit into remote viewing? How does that fit into things like astral projection and that is where the research goes. I think it can go there scientifically It's a blending of ancient ideas and modern science because our ancestors were having contact with this thing They didn't understand quantum physics so The methods and ability to contact and manipulate this thing

22:54 may not rely on our scientific acumen. And so when DeLong and Gary Nolan and his crowd, you know, Vallee is part of that crowd too right? They kind of take their cues from Vallee and then apparently the... From what I understand the government does as well. That should scare the hell out of everyone because if they're teaching Vallee in the CIA that's as far as they got So, that's concerning. Right? It's not that I think anyone has got it all right including the government. It is the fact we are clearly sipping from the same spring so Tom DeLonge is getting good information Gary Nolan is giving good information Jacques Vallee gives good information That crowd is tuned into some good stuff To that extent he is correct When he starts going off about Atlantis how would you know

23:55 Right, right. That's probably just the stuff he hears from these guys who also are heavily speculating but Gary Nolan obviously you knew I was going to bring up Gary Nolan for people who aren't as familiar He is big in the current scene He is an immunologist oddly He seems genuine to me He says he is fueled by his own uninvited experiences with these ultra-terrestrials As part of a family of experiencers He confirmed that he is James from Diana Pasolko's American Cosmic. And I watched an interview where he gave some more details, so for those listening... He once saw a UFO fly over as a paperboy—you know paperboys are out there at twilight at 4 or 5am doing their thing—so he saw something there. He once woke up with a buzzing message in his head that said this is how you connect and he asked it to stop and it did.

24:49 He saw little men in his room as a boy, and when he saw the book Communion he recognized that as a match. The being on the cover. And then this is where it gets weird with his work as an adult. He says he was asked by the CIA to analyze blood from UAP experiencers because he had some of the most advanced and sensitive equipment for doing so. That made me wonder about blood plasma but But he also mentioned some research about white matter in people's brains seen on MRI scar tissue. He speculated attempts to dampen parts of the brain to allow for more sustained contact, maybe something these beans are doing to the people to be like, Hey, The signal is not very strong. Let me get into your head and make some changes and now this signal is much stronger that's freaky

25:41 He also mentioned ufo's spilling out molten metals and plasmas. And in one case he said if it hit with terahertz frequency it levitates and then the interviewer said well tell me more about that, specifically I cannot say more about that is what i can say. And so you call him saint gary which i like alot cuz there is spirituality to all this and its almost like religion but When it comes to Gary Nolan, talk to us a little bit more about what you think his role is. How trustworthy is he? What does he say that really lights you up? So Gary is that gift to the UFO phenomenon or to the public disclosure efforts around the UFO phenomenon because as you point out, his credibility is through there. He's a brilliant scientist who's from Stanford so he's got that Ivy League cred.

26:39 So he's got context that we couldn't even imagine. And that's enough to piss me off, right? There are a few of those that it is enough to piss me off but I try not to be resentful. I'm just happy that each shares the information but with all these folks too...I just want to caveat this before I go on some effusive praise at him is like when it comes to all these folks if they're not telling us everything then let's move on let's go find the information ourselves. Like, if that's all you have to say I appreciate you saying it Bob Bigelow Gary Nolan Jacques Vallée himself If that's all you got to say i appreciate you telling me let's move on so That's kind of how I feel about that effort going on there because like this whole foundation is trying to influence the government On our behalf and God bless them

27:28 But I'm more interested, and I think the real information is going to come from us doing the research ourselves and sharing it. As far as how great he is... You know, he's done so much important research that I think supports Vallee's conclusions So when he did some material analysis And put out some scatter plots of inhomogeneous mixing of the materials Normally, we build with Legos and someone uses Legos like they're finger painting. That's not bad I just that was a Star Trek moment. I like that analogy! Yeah it's good. That's what they're doing there and then when he talks about the materials and the materials left behind...that's interesting but they're not sharing that material data and i also don't know the provenance of the materials so if i don't know the evidence i'm not going to take any face value from anyone even St Gary

28:27 Kiel thought that though. Kiel thought that when cryptids cases, when the cryptid was done being physical that they would degrade into something resembling silicon carbide but I was never able to prove that either let me couch that a little bit because Kiel was something of a trickster and he would often say things that were sort of metaphorical, but he knew they were in the right direction. He would say them with confidence and they turn out to be wrong, but you end up learning they're in the right direction which might be the entire Mothman process when it comes to Gary and the bodies I think that is really impactful so he's talked about the caudate putamen being a key to determining who gets affected by the phenomenon

29:19 And people who he tested had an unusually large caudate putamen. He'd had a very small sample when he did this, but these are the results were statistically anomalous and so it felt pretty solid to him. But they said that caudate putamen...and we don't know why certain people get affected by the phenomenon and others don't And I think that is so central to us trying to understand what this is fully, is that two people can be in the same location encountering the same energy and come away with completely different experiences. The experiences are solid you know? The provenance of information is solid they seem to have both experienced something different in the same location So how the hell does something like that happen scientifically

30:16 Yeah you start to wonder but it's like people say just with consciousness they say well it seems like consciousness is primary in our bodies are receiver of consciousness and so if you're talking about a signal, any receiver will there can be all kinds the different aspects of that signal how strong as the signal we've all gone through a tunnel on our cell phone obviously that affects the signal so when your talk about things in those terms. The signal can be five times stronger for someone else it can sound completely different it can look completely different so I do think that's the right context to talk about this stuff and maybe there is a physical part of a persons body, the wiring of their brain that changes the antenna and what it can receive or how strong the signal is. Well put! I think all those things are well supported by research

31:10 not just the anecdotal cases, but even some of the physical evidence. We've seen this happen repeatedly and it also ties into the hitchhiker effect so for those who don't know what the hitchhiker effect is... The most common example and I think the best one is when people have a UFO sighting and they go home and they experience something like poltergeist activity And this is not uncommon It's the norm It's uncommon for you to go out there and see a UFO and go home, and not have something happen. You know if you're seeing it in close proximity and it's an intense encounter, you're very likely to go home and have some weird stuff happen

31:54 Yeah, and it's interesting to think about it in the receiver context because if these are conscious entities they might have a mechanism to once they grab an antenna. They don't want to let go and they don't have to let go perhaps were you marked where you branded that ultimately where that goes I agree and I think when we look at abduction cases with that in mind and we hear what Boy it sure sounds like another form of confirmation that's true agreed so i sent you this list of some other comments you made that i wanted to have your lab rate on just so that you have time together your thoughts but u also send me one year articles in response to that lots a great ones on the site but this one starts with the author's note

32:46 We've been sitting on this observation forever didn't really know what to do with it still don't but here's the search there was mysterious megaliths enigmatic, elongated skulls and human sacrifice in malta. Add nasca at a time when humans had somewhat abandoned the practice than the nazis came along and built a crepe suspiciously similar to the one in malta what does that mean not sure yet but the fact that All of these things involved UAP, occult or shamanic practices and two out of the three sites involved human sacrifice. The third involving mass genocide so I do say that counts but it is weird and i agree you said its very weird and... ...I would like some help in trying to understand what your seeing with these similarities? Or what do you think the connective tissue is there?"

33:37 Let me go back one further to the Alien Abductions, The Switch article. And that one discusses the brain effects of people who are in a shamanistic trance state where they have been measured and then they have been studied and they are all saying that they're experiencing alien abductions. There's a paper written by Norman Donn and Gilda Mora that we talk about a lot Again, it's a small sample. I think they surveyed 100 people in Brazil who were experiencing that effect right so they have this 40 Hertz signal appearing on their prefrontal cortex and are in this hyper aroused state that is also hyper focused all of those things are super important and That ties right into the occult because

34:28 This is what I think the mechanism is, the connective tissue between say shamanistic practices religious people who experience this and the occult experiences. Because I think that connective tissue is there it's that 40 hertz signal that's happening in the brain where you're in this hyper aroused state and you're also super focused so there are multiple ways to get into that state There's meditation, there's psychedelics and then binaural beats, we talk about a number of them. And I would assume that there's a technological way to do it. And if you were the government and you figured that out, you'd be working on that right? So that i think is the connective tissue. That's one of those things...I'm not like Kiel, I won't tell you that that's the exact right answer. I'll tell you I think that's in the right direction. I'm quite sure

35:22 And that is where the switch is, because we've seen abduction cases that are physical and we've seen abduction cases that are psychic. Why would we believe a psychic case? Why would we think they're not just having a bad dream? It's because they have PTSD after and the PTSD is the same as someone who was physically missing and was the victim of a physical abduction case. This has been noted by John Mack and a Harvard psychiatrist who did all this research too. So it's not just shooting from the cuff, that really happens. So in that state you could encounter something. You're far more likely to encounter something. One of the things I mentioned in that last episode is that I think that's what happened with Mormon Church and that Joseph Smith was staring into a scrying stone or if it's like crystal like being a crystal ball gazer right for those who don't know

36:19 It's sort of like remote viewing. You stare at it for long enough and something shows you something, in this case Smith was looking for treasure which is self-serving by the way and he ends up running into an entity and it's a very weird story. The entity keeps telling him to come back and keeps playing with him. It sounds more like what we find in authentic anomalous Fortean cases so I think he probably did and it was something to do with that state. In that state, you're receiving a signal and that's the exciting thing to me because now we've found what might be the antenna all we have to do is shut off the signal if we wanted to. Or turn that baby up!

37:10 That was another piece of information we sat on for a while because we said, well if we tell people how to turn it off they're just going to turn it up and you're probably going to get seven people turning it up for every three people that turned it off. But I'm starting to wonder if that's a good reason to hold anything back? There's some other stuff that we just been sitting on it's not that we don't tell people the information is just maybe we don't give them all of the means to go find more than on their own because we don't know what people are gonna do with. Really is a arms race for this stuff yeah but that again gets back to like I don't like to be baby and i dont like to worry about what other people are gonna do with, information comes from just a conversation were just a couple guys talking

38:00 if someone wants to hear the word human sacrifice and go off and do some crazy stuff how could that possibly have anything to do with us. What would you say you might be sitting on what's an aspect of this that people who have been looking into it like myself in yourself and a lot of this audience is familiar with the field of ufology through the eighties and nineties and so on read several books on it what do you think that you might be sitting on that you just don't hear talked about all that much, but you think is important. I think the tunnels recently that's been something that has really jumped out at us The fact that these tunnels these ancient tunnel systems exist they exist in Europe They exist in South America. They exist in North America And then there's probably a bunch that we haven't found so I think that could use more attention and

38:53 And then I think that there's ways to communicate with this phenomenon and that if we're going to get serious in the public about us understanding it more, the only way to do that is going to be through communication. As you say many people have read books on this subject and if you've read Valet like one of his bigger ones is Messengers Of Deception And that's a really good one to read and it's super important point because these things are deceptive. We just don't know where they're from or what their agenda is, because they're always coming in and saying something different. And I think it's a huge problem in the UFO field right now where people just grab on to one of those things and they say okay this is the answer. It's lazy and its misinformation we don't know

39:42 Yeah and that's why i said turn up the signal i don't personally wanna do it but i want people to do it so that more communication comes through, you mentioned the elongated skulls. I'm curious about that so greg little and andrew collins have a book called denis oven origins and thats really interesting because they think the dennis ovens were more of the shamanic race of humanoids that maybe their brains were wired to get to that place easier and then we just kind of observed what they were doing and then they died out are you kinda saying something similar like the elongated skulls was, maybe not aliens thats usually what people say the practice goals or aliens. Or hybrids but your saying maybe there just another type of human and may be there wiring was such that they were more connected

40:32 It's going to get a little confusing, but they all have elongated skulls. So going back to that article you mentioned about the megalithic structures and the elongated skulls. At Malta, elongated skulls were found and those were another type of human. Those were the Halsapheni Skulls and they've been shuttered away for about 10 years but they were studied and a scientist came out and said it's very dry short paper we put in the article It says these are real. They don't have cranial metting or head binding, which is how we would elongate our skulls and how native tribes do it today. They don't have any of that and they're elongated and they're still another type of human. So those were found around Malta right? And then there you find

41:21 a bunch of human sacrifice at the time when people weren't really doing a lot of human sacrifice. Human sacrifice kind of was shut down around Mesopotamia and Sumer, and one of the reasons was Zoroastrianism so you know we came out with this monotheistic religion... This god doesn't want you to do that so you don't have to do that anymore! And that's probably something that Hebrews were inspired by when they started their own religion I think that history is a little bit important because if human sacrifice and the phenomenon are related, and that is a way to develop some sort of contact or manipulation of the phenomenon. Maybe that's what was happening all the way up until Mesopotamia and Sumer?

42:11 It's possible, we don't know. But what we have is evidence of human sacrifice, evidence of these sort of occultic or shamanistic-like traditions and then we have elongated skulls and we also have an incredibly high amount of UAP activity at those locations even to today so We have different elongated skulls though because the beings in Nazca, which there was just another DNA test done I think two weeks ago. And they look clearly manufactured and we were kind of hypothesizing about that on the 14-Win show when we did our Nazca mom episode and said I don't think these beings any of their DNA will match but they're all going to look similar

43:02 And it's telling you that something just makes stuff on the fly, right? And it uses whatever it has around to make it. That's what it looks like to me. I agree and I've said for a long time that the ufologists and the occultists need to have a powwow together because in both cases you're talking about people who see things either Directed or undirected you know ufo logists and people who are experiences it seems random to them but then you have people who can trigger it by making a pentagram on the ground in what shows up usually something very bizarre that defies any category.

43:45 And often times is a being of light at its core shows up in that form. Often and it probably gets right into that forty hertz range of you work yourself out with the roads and the chanting in the rituals and use somehow get there, can you say well this is more real cuz i didn't take mushrooms while i mean there's again many mechanisms to get you to that state and It's directed so obviously it easier to study but there just some kind of blockage there but i think that there is a huge overlap and that kinda leads me to the other thing i was gonna ask about which is. When asked the question who controls this stuff who really knows what it is at its core you said something i didn't expect you said old money and thats right up my conspiratorial alley but again with old money like

44:36 Even if you're studying the occult these people they look at the old money and they see whispers and illusions that you know there's something out there some kind of science of magic that these people. No and preserve in don't really share and so it just again speaks to the overlap of this phenomenon with old school families, you know the richest of the rich. But talk to us about that connection when you say old money very provocative but what did you mean by that? Yeah it's possible they have some sort of secret traditional knowledge this idea does run adjacent to those conspiracy theories You could look at it as one more possible form of confirmation but what I can say for sure is that these families have more knowledge of the UAP phenomenon than the rest of us right

45:28 Who are those families? It's big money and big science that really gets to see this stuff, and really gets to dive into it. And Big Money uses big science to get there. So big science is NASA, the NRO Department of Energy, and then it's also these labs so you have Oak Ridge National Labs, you have Radiance, you have Lockheed Skunk Works and Northrop. Those are places where I have seen evidence that there's some UAP activity going on, so who owns those places? You know how they start who owns the process right and the process is owned by the CIA of course Matt Ford and some other folks put out a pretty good article awhile back indicating that it was the Office of Global Access that had a lot

46:21 power associated with UAPs. So, some of these big money families were around when the CIA was founded. David Grush brought this up right on the floor of Congress. These big money families, the mafia and the Vatican were all around when the CIA was founded and that's important because they all knew Without getting too deep into the conspiracy side and saying they're all dressing up in robes or something, look. They all knew that UFOs existed all the way back in the 1930's and they have known now for almost 100 years so what they've been able to do with that knowledge we can only imagine and they're the only ones with access to it

47:07 Big money and big science are the only ones with access to that knowledge. So if there's something in there that can save their grandma Doris, and not your grandma Doris... I guess their grandma Doris wins! Or zero point energy or any number of things time travel has been brought up as a possibility i mean do you trust these people with time travel? I don't no So who knows what it could be? The point is that it's advanced technology and they're the only ones with access to it. And then they have access to something else, something that Carl Nell who was David Grush's boss brought up during a salt conference he did and that's an excellent piece of video there if you want to look at on YouTube, Carl Nell Salt Conference. He talks about a couple things in there I think are really important

48:01 And for one, he says that everyone has a right to know this because this is your reality. So someone keeping it from you is just wrong like if you have morals that's just wrong. That's one number two is this can advance our science and advance our species so to keep it hidden as its insidious And I think big money keeping this hidden for their own benefit, obviously. And then there's religion that gets involved. So who are those families? Those let's name names the Rothschilds, the Bushes and that's George HW and Jr., The Rockefellers, it's The DuPonts. And the last one I think is most important its the Melons. And so Chris Melon is obviously a big

48:57 influential figure in the UAP field, he's pushing for disclosure. And he may be the chosen one from their side. The guy who is coming over and says hey this is wrong our little clique has been keeping this amongst us for too long it needs to come out might be when it comes to like Elizondo and Mellon and Jay Stratton and all those guys that are coming out of Intel and then telling us stuff I think we should take in stride. We should say, okay as long as it plays out is true they're telling the truth

49:32 Because we've been waiting for people like this to come forward from the government. So it's only natural that people attack them and that they're critical of them, but we just need to be measured as we do I think so far Mellon and Elizondo and Stratton And that crowd have been honest To the extent that they can be and that annoys the hell out of people because they're not being honest about everything I think that's a pretty good summary and i know you have another article where you talk about the jackpot of the right person meaning that there antenna is tuned to receive and then the right time, add the rights base and we know that it seems as if.

50:17 There are areas where if you have contacts repeatedly it becomes easier for contact to occur at those places so i think about the whole lineage of a call to orders and. Rose accretions and free masons in this stuff and if you have rooms like even the skull and bones if u have rooms were people are calling these beans, For a couple hundred years like it probably gets a lot easier for them to be called in these locations and that's why i think there is this occult stuff with the elite families as that has been their mechanism of contact, that's how they've dialed up the phone and they maintain this contact for a long time the speculative bit.

50:59 I'm curious what you think about this is, what could be gained from that communication? So you mentioned technology. Sure they might be able to through seeding ideas to the people giving them all the keys to jailbreaking reality through science and different avenues and different methods of physics that really don't get advertised publicly free energy all that kind of stuff but are there more like Could they know about things that aren't technologically based like.

51:35 the real origins of humanity. It seems like we can get into the religion stuff, it seems like they might seed religions but do you think that there's other mechanisms of wealth preservation for these families? How much can these entities affect our reality and would they even do so on behalf of elite families who maintain some kind of relationship? What do you think the give and take is between these people at the highest levels?" That's a really good question So I think that first of all, when it comes to the entities let's talk about the NHI first. They don't seem to be manipulated easily and when people think that they're manipulating them they're being manipulated so do i believe that these rich and powerful people have figured out a way to get around that? No! I don't. I think the entities are too powerful. So they're probably having contact...they're probably

52:33 say that with some sense of certainty because they have the ability and they've had 100 years to do it. So, they're probably having some sort of contact but we've talked to people both of us who had contact with this phenomenon and I had some sort of experiences they were subtle you know, people talk about it being a feeling and a download. And information just comes flying at you and that's more what I subjectively experienced. It wasn't something that felt physical and it came with an emotion and feeling. It didn't come just as information. It was all of the above so

53:18 Are they experiencing that? Have they found a way to tap into that? Probably. And does that give them an advantage? I think it certainly would, but it also puts you prone to manipulation right? Puts you prone to manipulation these entities who's manipulating who That was one of the reasons when we put down 14 wins and said I have to walk away from this for awhile It was starting to happen more frequently and I said I don't know what this is. I have no idea And I don't know if it's good or bad and all the things that I've researched about intent. And, I had to take a big step back and find that connective tissue that you appropriately brought out today get it back to science somehow with the 40 Hertz in brain activity being consistent

54:09 I had to understand and go, okay well this is probably what's happening. It's not magic words it's nothing like that you know? And i don't think it's the ritual itself in any of these cases but some of the process involved in the ritual is super important like Pentecostals so we interviewed a person who had witnessed a possession supernatural possession and that was the weirdest week of 14 wins by the way people talk about how your technology starts breaking and stuff when you're researching that. It happened! Some of the subjective things that people talk about, I can say they happen to us like synchronicities and certain things like that but the possession stuff

54:52 it's operating on that same level. And so this guy was in a Pentecostal church or Pentecostal meeting when it happened, and all of the stuff that he had seen was around Pentecostals. Chris Bledsoe who is the most famous UFO contact to you today is a former Pentecostal too. So I would look at Pentecostal as just another shamanistic tradition right? So the way I sort of simplify this There's a great haunting setting that was done by the editor of the Journal of Scientific Exploration, Jim Horan. And they had 20 papers that they put together and tried to find similarities between people who experienced haunting stuff. They found four core characteristics I would recommend reading up on that but we've simplified that into three so it is person place in time and To be the right person

55:49 it can be a variety of things. I look at this more like SEO on the internet, do you have a lot of pictures and videos? Google will rank you higher or your keywords right okay Google will rank you higher for that so it's a scale that can take in a lot of different inputs but as long as those inputs reach a certain level person place and time inexperience happens So as you point out you can create a space where it makes those things more likely to occur. And you can become more the right person by continuously putting your brain into that 40 hertz state, and now it's easier for you to get there. And then time boy that's an interesting one I'd love to figure that out we've been doing some work on that That's right up the data analyst alley

56:41 A funny little story was when I first started, within months. I figure out the Tic Tac encounter is real and then I start talking to some people and they wouldn't tell me anything about the UFO phenomenon they just said dude there's something there I was like, are you effing kidding me? UFOs. It blew my mind! I went into the ontological shock of my life years ago and completely did a 180 in my life and it changed me drastically. And I think that's an interesting feature of this phenomenon. We've been recently writing about pattern maintenance and pattern disruption because I think that's why it gets involved in religion

57:26 Religion can be used as both a pattern maintenance and a pattern disruption tool. And even this UAP phenomenon, it echoes religion at times and I have to be very careful that I don't allow it for me. Right? Yeah. That's what Diana Pasulka is all about you know that this ufology thing spins off into basically religions It is interesting because if i think back to the elite having this kind of knowledge and how that would work. It would be something like let's say skull and bones has it you know there is a kid is the sophomore they give him the letter he gets to come to ritual they say look man we got this thing. Where are we have been communicating with these beans for generations and generations were gonna bring you in because your family was so and so i think your bright guy all it takes is for us to sacrifice, if u of the lonely masses that nobody cares much about

58:23 Maybe we can have some people at a party bring him here and i will sacrifice in these entities come back and they keep us plugged into. The akashic record the ultimate supreme knowledge that we've been trying to maintain and stay connected to for such a long time And then i think that could be the mechanism of preservation cuz as you say so many people experience this as a download of information will imagine a more sustained communal, download all cosmic information and what u could do with that and how each person can just say well my career i guess im gonna pick something out of this. Cloud and maintain that post and that could be something but then when i was gonna say is the timing aspect so

59:06 If you start to study the occult, it's all about timing. It's nauseating how much of it is about timing about moon cycles and moon phases and astrological alignments and things that just my eyes glaze over I'm like well I guess I'm not doing the ritual at the crossroads because I don't even have time in the day to sort out our modern timing with this cosmic timing So you would remove all that kind of knowledge all the mechanisms of knowledge from society the psychedelics the ritual timing put us on this linear gregorian calendar where we don't know what's up and down. Create religions are perpetuate them to be like oh it's got me angels in maybe should pray more like totally

59:49 Create the vatican is a big power center and all the while it's really this connection insurer some of these beans probably reach out. Can you can't control humans you can't control or influence all these being so they reach out to random people in given the downloads and stuff, and that happens and that's where we see the cracks in the secrecy because regular people on the woods like hey this thing happened to me but our system that controllers have society They've kept us away from knowing about this kind of timing. They've kept us away from these kinds of places where these things happen more often, and they also keep psychedelics and magic out of the culture and in previous ages would kill people who were going down those roads so there's the people place end time stripped out of our society for the masses but not necessarily for the chosen few

1:00:43 Well put. Yeah, that is one scenario that could be happening certainly doesn't have to be happening to that extent everything you said could be happening on a much more subtle level and then it still influences us I think one of the things about Peter Levenda's work that i find very interesting Is that he talks about occult technology and he removes the supernatural sometimes you know, he talks about the brainwashing and how those occult brainwashing techniques work and how the CIA adapted them and how Leroy Hubbard adapted them. And that to me is very interesting because those are things we can see improve very easily but as far as that time place in person and how that's been controlled so first of all person place in time

1:01:31 It also impacts how people perceive the phenomenon because if you're not that person in the right place and the right time, you don't believe it ever happened. So that makes it easier for the phenomenon to hide certainly by having those restrictions and then it also as you point out becomes a means to contact it That is definitely what people try to do like with CE5, too. They're going out in the desert and they're going into certain locations and they're engaging in exactly what we're talking about there are like binaural beats, there's meditation... They're trying to get their brain into that state so they're trying to create an antenna And then there's gonna be a signal and I think we can find that signal. I think we can enhance it and I think we can turn it off. And I think we can do that in the public We can measure waves

1:02:25 So we know what state your brain is and then we can measure what's coming in. And we can also tell what state your brain is in, and we could send out an EMP or we could disrupt that signal in some other ways if people are having some of these torturous victimized by some of these abduction experiences. I think if the Vatican was serious they would look at that and go why not try it with someone who's possessed? Hmm. They have right they have a science wing and We're pointing to where on the brain these alien abduction experiences happen that become torturous They think it's demonic Let's blast it out if all the prayers didn't work fast enough and someone's really suffering Why not God created science too, right? Let's give it a shot so

1:03:23 This is been awesome i guess i gotta let you go eventually but it was great to just dive right into the deep waters cuz this isn't our first rodeo. And in terms of what you got going on fordian winds that still archive the website is full of great articles if people wanna go back after listening to this and be like well let's follow the guys journey through all this and all of his ideas and conclusions about it. Is there anything upcoming worth promoting while we're still in front of people who are interested in follow-up? Well, being focused on my good intentions and all that I make everything public unless I think it's potentially dangerous so that's where you'll find it. You'll find it on 14 wins at this time and I'm gonna publish some stuff that I've been sitting on

1:04:11 Like I mentioned how I did that regression analysis and found that latitude is the most determinant characteristic. I think that's a super important find because it also points heavily towards magnetism, and you could take that one insight and take it much further. And that's what I hope people do with my work is... A lot of it on there is hypothesis formulation and finding resources to support those hypotheses but I don't have the money or the time to take the subjects, to take this thing that much further but i hope people do. So I'm going to publish more information on Fortean Wins. I'll publish some stuff about that regression analysis and a bunch of other information that I was able to pull from AI like whether or not certain ethnicities see UFOs more. Yeah! I love it

1:05:02 Well, I look forward to that. This was a real pleasure thanks for taking the time take care out there made the 40 and wins always be at your back. Thank you Greg awesome show. I appreciate you doing it man And boom goes the dynamite people rom X breaking it down years of research some end-of-the-line conclusions and An interview coming out of a very random string of events guided You could almost say Because something compelled me to play 40 and wins that day happened upon their last episode. And I thought it was good, but I had follow up questions and lucky me wouldn't you know it? I am in a position to ask

1:05:48 I'm glad he was willing to do it i think we're pretty well aligned on what's most interesting about this whole thing and the effects these beans have had on the human story. And that we had a great reporter, we did record this a couple weeks ago now just before lue alessandro new book came out And of course he's doing the podcast circuit to promote it. And I don't know if we would have had anything to add about that so far most of what i see in these interviews is him saying the same old, well I have to be very careful with my words and this is all I can say about that etc etc

1:06:28 The only really fascinating thing I've come across from that book is that apparently there was a plan, or he might even be proposing a plan to capture these things by setting up a nuclear signature because it always seems to attract them. And apparently they have done this before in Russia. They set this kind of nuclear trap and I'm not sure about the details or how successful they were or weren't in an actual capture but it's just something i came across recently and thought it was a fun Creative concept that really, after so many years I hadn't heard talked about. But I did like hearing RomX talk about putting grimoires into AI you could make a more searchable archive than we've ever had before You could have it extract patterns you might even be able to have it design new rituals based on the most often mentioned criteria That whole thing is an interesting use of AI given where it is

1:07:31 Obviously going back to Dr. Steven Skinner, a lot of that stuff has yet to even be translated into English so I'd love to see that too! It has been said here before for a long time that ufologists need to be talking to the occultists and the psychonauts need to be talking to bigfoot researchers and all that because all these people are studying or having experiences with things that break materialism It's possible we have several things that do that, but it's also possible that we have several different pathways to get to a single thing at the heart of most of it. You know? Different displays and all that so really fun interview for me I loved that we could just jump right into it and skip a lot of the introductory stuff. We've been swimming in these waters long enough and you guys don't need to go through the basics again

1:08:22 And I came away thinking that if i was a listener, I would be pretty engaged and happy with it. He also sent me several links to both previous podcasts and articles that relate or fill in some details on several things we covered so check the show notes for those things as well! Of course the full two hour show contains a lot more than just the free first hour with the extra time we talked about plasma wizards behind the enforcement and creation of religions rose accretions in the ufo, the connection to magic in the occult the rules of ritual interaction dissecting why and how it works.

1:09:04 Who Ram X doesn't trust in ufology, who the shills deceivers grifters and intelligence piss boys are likely to be. His own first-hand creepy experiences in field investigations some interesting international cases some really great inner earth cases and the inter-earth para fictional literature And we talked about the Sarah Chena whole crazy story from the nineties. And I believe Bulgaria, so many good insights and offhanded comments as well. You know, the deal just become a plus member support the work get yourself twice as much show and you don't have to hear my new plus pitch song at the beginning of the episode anymore even though I listened to it when I don't even have to

1:09:55 I'm having a lot of fun with this music stuff. Sorry if some of you find it annoying But I really enjoy the variety and the closing songs being one-offs that I'll never use again is just fun too. But let's take a look at the plus rating for the last episode, Yuga Shift with Bibu Dev Mizraa. The people have spoken and they have said 4.7 no complaints here really enjoyed that one to Well, no complaints content wise but he was using a microphone on his earbud wire and it kept rubbing on his shirt. And I addressed it like four times but if a person isn't going to help me out then I just have to kick it to our editor and hope he can make it sound less distracting. Some people noticed that rustling and were bothered by the sound quality on top of an accent...I get it

1:10:51 It all contributes to difficulty in understanding every word. You know I care a lot about that and try to bring you the best, but I can't do much to control the recording environment on the other side of the call and what a guest does. And as always The Meetup Calendar Anyone can go to higher side meetups.com and make an event and find a time and date together at a local restaurant, park brewery or whatever, and meet some other THC fans that live in your area. It's nice to have a network of like-minded people and it doesn't cost anything to experiment with seeing what or who is out there. And when it comes to the events on deck

1:11:35 Coming right up September 7th, poor house barbecue and Kanaan New Hampshire. September 8th red root farm in Milford Connecticut, September 11th San Antonio Texas at the Halcyon South town, September 18th at the corner bakery cafe and Pasadena. And then we got one in October on the 14th. At Galbraith's ale house in Eden, Terrence Auckland New Zealand international events. It's a beautiful thing, but if you heard a nearby city or town called out jump on the meetup calendar to RSVP and to get more details and that said it looks like I'm pulling this one into the station big thanks to all the listeners. It's a very fun job. You guys allow me to have, and I think we've done some great episodes lately

1:12:26 Analog, Bibu and RomX all sort of relate to each other and hit on some of my favorite stuff. I've been trying hard to avoid politics in an election year and just go against the grain and do my own thing... And that seems to be the move! It seems like i'm not alone in being pretty sick of all that other stuff But I am getting out of here. Enjoy the musical stylings of Blues Traveler making sweet, sweet music out of today's episode themes. I've done my part your move disclosure deceivers old money interests and ultra terrestrial plasma beings your fucking move. There is a secret lost to time Plasma stands and twists and spins That's where the gods

1:13:26 Governance of play with us we play with 2D disclosures Cover so the higher side just doesn't play Bullet sugar and dismiss the lecture end in search The Vatican's got cosmic beings Got the church They were the teachers first It really isn't clear when they decided to

1:14:33 Disclosures coming so they say The higher side-chats doesn't play We don't want it, should erupt Endless misdirection Never ending seraticons Got cars Cosmic beings got the church Other teachers are deceivers Isn't clear Were we better off without all

1:15:35 When they decided, disclosure's coming So they say the higher side chats doesn't play We don't want it sugarcoated, give it raw Disclosure is coming so they say The higher side chats doesn't play We do not want it sugar coated Give it raw and right away