Schwab | The Cognitive Holocaust, The Fakelore Age, & Agents Of The Super Spectral Order

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05:32 The Planet Puppet Masters almost surely have a plan There's clearly maybe something there beyond But until you've thoroughly tested every last close-dressed view Find the more you think, you know the less you really do Where we be? LTHC Those who're lying to us just don't know to what degree

06:12 Something wicked this way comes, Hireside Chatters. From the Sunshine State I'm Greg Carlwood and it And it seems that insanity is the new standard for the modern mental condition, and the madness infecting the realm is subtle enough as to slip under radar for many making it even more insidious than it appears. Today the soul starves for purpose and mind yearns for meaning as the archonic architects of our situation have turned a sacred experience into a living nightmare

06:58 Our process of progression has been whittled down to hopelessly clawing through value-sucking corporate hierarchies and our internal call for impactful experience quelled by the scrolling wheel of entertainment options. And each newly constructed layer of the prison from the mental and monetary to the digital and virtual drags us deeper into the depths of wasted life ruled by tyrannical time meters and demonic drainers of desire. While our weakened spirit, buried under an avalanche of consumerism shallow manipulative pleasure center stimuli and Pavlovian training cries out... What The Hell Happened To The Good Timeline?

07:37 Well, if anyone can answer that question it is the great and powerful Schwab. He's been here twice before talking about everything from the mysteries of Magonia and the Great Chicago Fire to the airship deception and the electromagnetic ecology in the years since we last spoke The incredible work on his Schwab stack blog is as diverse and powerful as ever So let's go! The modern meaning maker radical Renaissance man And the king of counter history and high strangeness Schwabsir Welcome back Wow, thanks for that great introduction. Greg, that was amazing. I really liked the eaters of time. That's in there! That was amazing. Yeah. That's great. I feel like that was probably something I wrote or inspired and that was really neat. Certainly inspired. I try to match the tone and energy of the guests and I worked extra hard today because your tone and energy is tough to match.

08:32 But thanks for doing this. You are one of my favorite writers today, so it's always nice when we get to do this. How might you describe the last year to get us going? What have you seen that alarms you maybe more than expected? Does anything give you hope? These sorts of things. I guess the general theme is what you would call cognitive holocaust. People are getting sort of, that's a big one. People are getting kind of dumber at an alarming rate. A lot of it is memory recall people can't seem to remember things. A lot of repeated conversations and just generally a lack of emotional processing. And you see that in the macro a lot people falling into fandoms and anti-fandoms and getting really heated about it, getting really insane about it.

09:32 very extreme, almost incoherent polarization happening. And people kind of following into it's not even an echo chamber. It's more of like a hermetically sealed silo that people are falling down into the bottom up where they're not really perceiving a objective reality. So there's quite a lot of things that kind of all directionally lead towards something called the schizophrenia engine The online space is basically acting as this blender, this IQ blender and perception blender as well. Generally I would say I've been exploring that you know what's causing it how to avoid it what the origins of it are so yeah it's been a fun year for me and you know of course personally trying to avoid because I do spend quite a bit of time on Twitter writing threads

10:40 you know, sort of researching online and I do spend some time interfacing with other people and personalities. And also working on ways that I can personally avoid falling into that situation. Yeah you spend a lot of time beast adjacent so to have your wits about you obviously is key! And i love that you brought up memory it's one of the big quotes I had here so of course I picked over some of my favorite posts of yours over the last year that have some thematic continuity And it was hard to nail down but let's start with this post titled portals that largely is about the deep history of fairy lore but it does star out about memory with you saying. Memory is not local to the individual memory isn't folded into matter exists and complex patterns in the air and the earth and then the oceans,

11:30 Nothing is lost all is remembered many acts of imagination like the visionary process are a projection of this memory. This articulation of the living cosmos is one of the great purposes of the human form eruptions of non local memory are triggered by rituals and encounters with high synchronicity, Any action that blots out local memory will to some degree trigger non-local memory, hence the use of schizotropic substances to confound the mind in some shamanic traditions. Ritual and geomancy are a means to sculpt synchronistic encounters – in other words there are portals!

12:09 Obviously, I like that. But elaborate more on this articulation of the living cosmos being one of the great purposes of the human form because so often we're very much steered away from any activity or engagement with this kind of process these days it seems to me. Yeah, I would say that living in material reality... We are in a sense in a sort of liminal space and this is how the ancients always described it where there's playing between the lower orders of reality and the higher orders, lower orders of perception and high orders. And so one of the things that our objective here will are our purpose or function however you want to think about it is to sort of create a synthesis just synthesize the material in the divine and be able to effectuate that or exemplify that in our lives to be the expression on the material plane

13:08 And one way that happens is through the visionary experience, through I guess ancient man. The first medium was the sky and the first words were the stars. He would look up into the sky and he would engage in that visionary experience and he would see the gods, he would see apparitions, he would see all kinds of celestial phenomenon but he wouldn't see them in the way we do where they're just sort of stripped down as just a light, it's just gases – there would be a narrative involved it wouldn't just be a comet, he would actually see the sort of electrical activity or rather the plasma activity and it would take different forms and shapes to his percipients. He would see it as a dragon right? He would see it roaring and coursing across the sky and there would be a lot of meaning that was derived from that and that would shape his life. The quality of his life as well would be completely changed by that. And so yeah there's a lot there in that sentence as our human life being articulation

14:14 That the visionary process is very deeply entrenched and tied into what it means to be a human being. You go on to talk about fairy lore and the deep history and a lot of the individual encounters and you use a phrase. To refer them as the administrative spirits of the earth and i like that, we've done many previous shows about folding ufo's bigfoot aliens fairies all this kind of stuff into afford in box that is kind of all parts of what jack play my call a meta system. That they are more related than a lot of researchers through the nineties and early two thousand's would have had you believe, i think that is the right way to think about these things but

15:08 Sometimes you look at a system or process in nature and it's logic is genius for example trees make fruits fruits taste good to other mobile creatures fruits contain the seeds to spread themselves outward. It's, Symbiotic nature is evident, the genius of that system is right there. But I struggle to see the logic in such a system as it's being described when it comes to non-local memories and this custodian class of supernatural beings. The logic behind why this is part of reality is missing for me! I don't know if you can help me at all?

15:51 Yeah, that's an interesting way of putting it. What is the logic of it? There are a few different ways to answer that. First of all there might not be a logic as we can perceive it. There may just be no logic that we can process as humans and that you know we can't make it make sense. And that might be the point – to point out the limitations of that process, of that one toolkit so that we don't get overly attached to it. It's a way to kind of keep us from becoming too concretized to materialized in this life, like a reminder. That's not what you are that's just a limb that you use to feel out the world around you your logic it's just there to help you we have mapping the world or graphing it or modeling it and making sense of things but it's not the ultimate reality and another way to answer would be who sees fairies? Who are these people that most often see fairies? It's the children

16:56 insane people and shamans. You know, those are the people that are most usually seeing them especially as like a full spectral tactile apparition they're seeing the whole thing it looks to them like a physical being and there's a clue there you have with the child their almost prelingual right? They haven't adopted these semiotics that signs and symbols of the dominant culture, the hierarchical order of perception that exists like that's enforced upon you. They're innocent and the shaman one of his goals is to regain that innocence, to reject given meaning and exist outside of the sorcery of language. He creates his own sorcery of language. He attacks things from a more what I call this super paranoid angle where he just doesn't take anything that's given

17:54 So you could think of the shamanist in a sense post-lingual, right? Or able to enter into a post-lingual state for a certain amount of time and perceive the world as it is. I've talked about the electromagnetic ecology before or you call it the ethereal ecology and I think The Child probably sees the world with more dimensionality, more fullness so yeah, the world is spooky. The world doesn't actually makes sense and that's not what it's there for. It's not there to make sense for you, right? Your logic circuits are there to help you live your life construct society like everything example you gave about the logic of the tree, the genius of the tree all of that's involved in your... To use a sort of vulgar metaphor, your life support system right? That's there to keep you alive and all of those things are obviously logical

18:58 as a human organism, caring at the business of living and reproducing and building civilizations and all the things that humans like to do. So that limit, that's like 90% of reality that we don't really need in order to do the things that we do. And there is like the Vallée system you have John Keele system with the ultra terrestrial. There are definitely ways to spread that logic out. That's what Esotericism is for. That's what it is, to approach the sort of limits of given logic and given meaning and try to extrapolate outwards and explore outwards to do a sort of experimental sense-making of those things. And people that do those things are in danger of becoming alienated or marginalized because in order for let's say a highly complex civilization or society to even work

20:05 you have to sort of marginalize or push to the edge all of those things that don't really fit into your system that you've created. The logistics of your empire, of your village, of your town... Once you get to a certain level of sophistication, you can't worry about if there's a fair amount… I mean, You can't worry about if there's like a fairy mound here, or like there's some kind of underground. There's cobalt layer here. You can't be thinking about those things all the time because other civilizations and societies that are thinking about those things they're going to conquer you. You have some exceptions like Iceland where they will reroute highways around all kinds of sacred sites but that's Iceland it exists under of course the umbrella of another empire that doesn't think about those things

20:58 Yes, I think that makes sense and a lot of people have a model where fairies and modern aliens these cryptid beans are guardians or custodians of non local memory. And i think that makes sense because a lot of people's testimony is that they were taken to this bizarre place and given information big information download a big dump where it's like Man i don't even know what to do with that but it seems like there's these beans at the real beings that want us to know. That is their so i guess in terms of like what kind of function, these beans could serve in the system you mentioned keeping us from being too materialized and i like that because you would think that the

21:49 Uber system would have a series of safeguards to keep itself running how it's designed to operate and it probably acknowledges that man can get really obsessed with the material and potentially are. Oligarchical leaders get vested in making us more materialized because that's where their wealth and power comes from is operating in that wavelength so you could see a safeguarding the system. Where ufo just injected every so often to be like hey there's more here than what you think and it's like a bread crumb for the mind yeah that's a great way to think about it

22:34 I'm hopeful that such a system exists and it does actually make sense that they're there to make sure we don't turn into some kind of cosmic horror. You know, at this sort of collapse into ourselves into over materialization or could be that they just find it offensive on site if you know what they're seeing? It could just be – We are their neighbors and it makes us stink. It makes noise. It's a presence that they don't like. It could be that as well Because if you look at the nature of some of these things, yeah a lot of it is instructive but a lot of its just sort of like an ontic shock. It's very rough. Its very just like yanking you out of your reality and some of the people come away with PTSD. So theres that as well to think about it being a benevolent system is one way to think about it and I hope that exists but im sorta agnostic as whether there is

23:42 Meta system that is watching us all the time and it might just be sort of incidental. Kind of like if there was an animal that you saw, that was distressed, barking, causing a disruption because its injured yet the thing happening... You feel bad for it but its also offensive to hear this happening around you. It's disordering your environment. You're like oh I can't have that happening that attitude exists as well among humans, right? Some people do it out of compassion. Some people just do it out a sense of duty. Some people are like okay we have to take care of this disruption and if you think about how alien they are in the way that they communicate right there...the way they express themselves I would have to say there's probably a range right? If there is an ecology and there's different types of beings I would say some of them are more compassionate and some of them are just like

24:42 you're causing a disruption. There's probably a spectrum of what's happening when you're talking about all of these different ultra-terrestrial phenomena. Right, and looking at animals is a great example. Obviously animals are little less bizarre than these other creatures in the super spectral ecology, the electromagnetic ecology but you could look broadly animals and be like well there's predators and then there's prey, and the prey eats the vegetation. And this is the cycle of life that we learned about in The Lion King but then you could also look at individual animals and be like what is the function of the tiger? Because there are other predator so it's not every individual thing has some kind of function I suppose but I guess I'm just trying to get at the bizarreness of these things and what they do for the system

25:36 But just to elaborate on even some of what you said, here's another quote. You say the question arises why hide fairies? The answer there is no conspiracy to hide the thing itself but an invasion from the universality of a para physical category. The reason for evading the university of a distinct and predictable phenomenon is quite simple because it is a path that when followed leads directly beyond the great delusion of this present madness The machinic maze that twists into our eyes such is the nature of our predicament under the spell of disenchantment which gathers men into the cosmopolis. Perception of the ferry ecology isn't eruption of peak experience often only made possible by shamanic ritual or the,

26:24 Indigenous volcanism of certain individuals it is a direct experience of the organic environment the moment of peak experience is a great wound up winding cataract in the leadless eye of the thing. which invades our world from the future so yes similar to entheogens this is to be marginalized because it gets in the way of this spell of disenchantment great phrase probably gonna be in the title of this one but I would think that these super spectral ecology and these beans would have more agency than say, the mushroom. It doesn't really make sense that this would be something within the realm

27:05 of control by the controllers. It doesn't seem within their power to control." There's a lot of very powerful mechanisms that we don't understand fully, like film even books media in all its form that effectively make us dumb deaf and blind I do think that Of course they're not all powerful anybody can have these experiences just by wandering around in the woods you know You can construct a liminal experience for yourself The best way to do it is just suddenly, without a plan to get into your car and drive without direction. To go somewhere that you've never been before and decide to like go camp out there or spend some time in nature unannounced don't tell anybody so the more improbable it is for you the more outside of your routines

27:59 the more liminal it becomes. So anybody that has these experiences, usually by accident they sort of wander out of the system, out of their routine, out of their habits of consuming media and going into this machinic maze that they lived their life inside of – that's when those experiences happen. So while the shepherding that occurs is very powerful and can make us retard our recipients To degree that the same seem completely invisible to us yet people do fall out of it. What about no that makes sense the shepherding is such a great term you know i use a harsher term controlling but yeah you could use a softer touch and say we are shepherded away from these sort of things and then,

28:50 In the off chance that they do pop into our reality we are completely thrown off kilter by their presence and then sometimes we won't even talk about them which then. Keeps them out of our culture even more so, so it is a self-fulfilling prophecy and i do think its great advice to get out of our own routines but just say more about time in what you call the thing that invades our world from the future You also refer to this thing as a para-physical parasite that consumes and assimilates the memory of humankind. Time is indeed an organism, and our current timeline represents a form of artificial life." Well since the first time we did an interview I've been talking about the good timeline and that terminology how did this cyclical parasite

29:42 become so dominant and what might the process and effects of escaping its grasp be if it can even be done on an individual level? Oh, that's a big question. What is it exactly? There are different ways to think about it I guess the sort of Nick Land view is that it's techno capital itself reaches backwards through time and self assembles itself a causally yeah I would say that's a mystery I don't know what it is exactly I sort of think of it as a cosmic horror, some kind. Or you could think of it as a procession of events leading from the children of Cain, of technism, of the sacrifice of innocence, a kind of chain reaction leading into greater and greater or deeper and deeper materialization. It's a thing we're doing to ourselves because our mistakes are shamelessness

30:52 our moral condition is allowing this to happen, opening us up to I guess the word is parasites. Things that can only express themselves through the screen through media or through these electronic assemblages like the internet they can only embody themselves through our machines or through our cybernetic systems but the primary error in us it's our actions our lack of ritual purity that allows them to kind of enter into our lives. And I think that happens a lot through, has been happening for the past few hundred years primarily through fiction, through media and then through movies and now through the internet where we open ourselves... Because if you think about the average medieval peasant right? What images did they see? What stories do they hear? They were all part of an organic mythic tradition or religious

32:03 theological, very well thought out system that kept them ritually pure. It may not have been for the best at all times but it did keep them in a reasonable innocent condition starting with the printing press and the pre-modern era you have this explosion of people using fiction and almost immediately using esoteric knowledge alchemy religious and mythic symbolism and weaving it into their stories, but making it secular. Creating these sort of interiorities in people where all of a sudden they're having breeding ground from neuroses so they're becoming more and more detached from the good timeline from originally pure state. They're becoming consumers with media steadily over the past few hundred years. That's what makes us open to this thing, this process, these parasites

33:10 that want to embody themselves in artificial intelligence or the internet or different media. It starts with that, that's the beginning is veering away basically from tradition and from mythic memory folklore. I have an article that I've been working on. I published part of it in a magazine but we have fake lore now for example right? You had the organic folklore before 1850 in the United States, in North America. And then there was this very organized, very broad spectrum creation of fake lore to sort of occlude it and replace it. That's a great example of that happening. So instead of having an organic folklore that is a recursion of these ancient themes and symbols that ties you to the genius of the land, you have this very corporatized

34:14 intentional propaganda that's being created, that is given to you through the education system. A lot of it was deployed in the world's fairs. You had this virtual environment – that's what the World Fair was – with this cybernetic system they created where people would go in and get re-educated and then come out on the other side. And a lot of these fake lore folk heroes were introduced during those times. You know, big statues murals things like that the story would be acted out there'd be little plays with them the idea of The Cowboy a lot of that sort of sensationalized cowboy character was introduced to a lot of people at that time you mentioned Johnny Appleseed in this context too at one point 100% Johnny Appleseed is a big one Davy Crockett these kind of characters Davy Crocket Paul Bunyan all those guys really created by

35:15 business interests. Paul Bunyan was the lumber industry, I think John Henry that guy was the mining or rail industry. Each one was an industry that artificially created these types of things. Yeah, that I've never thought about. That is really interesting because again, I'm starting to think well why do this? Well, that's why you have a mascot essentially for every depraved industry that's destroying the land Yeah, that's amazing. That's a great parallel right there. They're involved literally in destroying the land then on the metaphysical level they're destroying the avatar that ties you to the genius of the land creating this situation where you're psychically numb and the reason like... The direct intent of these people like you look at them and they're just doing it for money but I think there's also another layer of intent. You see people doing things because their

36:17 I guess the best way to think of it is demonically oppressed. They're in this lower state, that's all they're thinking about is money so of course something can nudge them and push them around and get them to do these things that are introduce metaphysical contaminants sort of strip mine the human spirit for what? For this little carrot you know this reward of your a little bit richer now So yeah, I do think it's a combination of people being motivated by filthy lucre but also the reason that it's so easy to get them to do things that go outside of that too like start messing with the culture is because they're being driven to do things like that. Yeah and more I think about just examples like Rosie The Riveter and what that represents and what that calls people to do

37:15 Even uncle sam always finger pointing the images always finger pointing as if to be like. You specifically need to do this thing and you should feel guilty and you should feel small america's monolithic and we need your taxes for the war these sorts of things in, i did a recent interview that was about just the corporate food industry and how it all started in history there and how it kind of was Shepard along to hide inflation because people would notice the inflation in food once we came off the gold standard if you make cheaper food and then create. The nutritional apparatus to say actually not only is it cheaper this food is better too which we all know now was a big lie, you think about how to make that lie work to sell it they use a lot of mascots what is

38:10 frosted flakes you have to have tony the tiger to kind of put it into the psyche of the person and get families to think it's okay and all these serial companies for their poison used a mascot and if u try to mentally strip the mascot out in the marketing out in the branding now and look at it you would never accept it probably if you just look at a pile of cornflakes that looks almost like sawdust you wouldn't think to eat that but. It's all that is so terrible around the marketing and i think that's so interesting just to think about another time depth going back further, and taking those like cereal mascots that sold us poison and applying them too

38:58 a lumberjack or Johnny Appleseed, maybe that's agriculture and these sorts of things. It is interesting I mean i guess they have a good handle on the mind metaphysical and how to weaponize that against us to get us to accept things that lead to destruction of the landscape and the body and the mind yeah Tony the tiger Captain Crunch are essentially Side work folk heroes. That's what then they're put right in front of us and what you said about the esoteric angle, yeah I keep running into that a lot of the times when these things first appear, they appear in very suspiciously sophisticated forms right? It's as if they knew exactly how to do this from day one and I find that very interesting and usually you know when you look at these guys that are involved in it there's all these suspicious connections you know they're connected with

39:56 you know, weird secret societies or the occult or they have strange connections or obscure relationships with people. And you find that over and over and over again that yeah when these things appear these things that we think of as sort of staples of the culture things like romance novels right? Or just a novel itself when it first appears in this very sophisticated form he knew how to build He knew how to weave in alchemical symbolism. He knew how to construct it in this tripartite form." Who gets credit for the first novel? Samuel Richardson, he was an occultist. He was connected to a lot of people and the Hellfire Club and this guy named Edward Cave. He was sort of acolyte of this guy Jacob Bohm who's called The Alchemist Of The Soul. And his writing led to

41:05 what was called the smile revolution, the sort of mass hysteria in Europe and France and Germany where before that time people really didn't smile with an open mouth. Right? The big toothy grin that everyone's familiar with. Wow! Yeah. And he kind of led that or sparked that off into being with encouraging people especially women to display these sort of excessive displays of emotion And if you still go to many parts of the world that weren't affected by this process, like if you go to Asia almost any indigenous population, uncontacted tribes things like that. They don't smile they interpreted it as a sign of aggression menacing and sometimes insanity or person that's just sort of drunk right? Then you would see the person baring their teeth

42:04 When we see footage of indigenous tribes, I sometimes see them palling around and smiling. But maybe that's a mimicry that they got from the person who visited them? A lot of that is a mimicry and some of it is actually just aggression, right? They're displaying naked aggression in the people that are interacting with him don't see that. They don't see that these people hate them because their signals have gotten across but I guess the best comparison would probably be Asia where, especially with the older generation people don't smile. Like my grandfather he never smiled in photos if you look at yearbooks the smile revolution in the United States didn't fully catch on until like after World War II If you look at your books You see most people still not smiling and photos even though it had been an art for like 200 years of this point showing people smiling It took that long for to fully catch on

43:07 Yeah, I mean that's kind of an innocuous harmless example of how media early media can affect people's lives and change their habits. And it makes sense because there is the concept of the robo fish that you put a robotic fish in with other fish and they will follow it because we're all kind of in this reality without any real guidance. We don't really come in with a handbook so we like to think we know what were doing but if we look, And we find someone who's extremely confident, there is a large contingency of people who will just follow their guidance. Because like oh this guy knows what he's doing I mean that's...I can't go wrong following this guy because i know i'm clueless and the real joke there is we're all clueless like everyone comes into the reality the same way so if you're fooled by someone's confidence well

44:08 I mean, what is a con man? A confidence man. It's just like that's the whole premise is they don't have any special knowledge of course unless they're born into this systematic secret society network that kind of gives everybody a leg up on what the understanding has been thus far but yeah in general it's just following an example you could apply that to advertising or to media. The people that had access to the first printing presses were people that were in the elite class, those things were expensive so they had time to experiment with people. You saw the way that people reacted to

44:51 Signs and portents, there would be people who publish that. That was a lot of the first product that came out of the printing presses. Something was seen in the sky or this apparition appeared or somebody saw there's a monstrous birth over here." So there was a lot of time to observe how people reacted to things, how people got hysterical. And if you're in the elite class, you have the leisure time, you have the information network and you have the funding to make a printing press to do things like that I don't think it's that surreal or weird for somebody that has that to be able to trick millions of people, to display that confidence. To put up a huge image in front of somebody or have the same image beam into their living room to millions of people. If you had that power, you could get people to do things too. It's just organization and funding

45:50 That's really what it comes down to. And they are the ones that when those technologies first came out, they were at the right place at the right time. They were the ones that were able to figure those things out Yeah you can scale that up to everything the film camera. The video game all these new level jumps in technology it seems like they were weaponized from the beginning and of course look who has the funding who's developing the technology sure they were and, we've been mentioned the phrase guys involved in this stuff let's jump to agents of the super spectral order In this one, you mentioned things like the Manhattan Project and MKUltra. Oppenheimer being a Soviet spy? Never heard that. Jack Parsons' claim that a homunculus was created at the Trinity site? Know that story. CIA investigations of Uri Geller, UFOs and all sorts of things. What would you say is the central message of this post? Who are the agents of the super spectral order? Well, this sort of ties into my idea of parafiction

46:53 I'll answer your question, but to understand what I'm saying there. To say that it's like a stack of currents back in pulp, like it has this para-fictional frame to it where part of the purpose of it is to have this psychological effect on people. The nuclear warhead itself, the atomic bomb if you look at some of the original discussion of it and classified papers, he was always discussed as an psychological weapon, just as much as it was discussed as a weapon of mass destruction or physical destruction. So it's also a mass psychological weapon and it has this mystique that's built up around it and has a para-fictional story that goes with it to empower that so some of these things I think the way they're distributed out to the mass consciousness is sort of part of their power and that includes things like MK Ultron

48:00 the city at Oak Ridge. There's this folklore around it, and that creates agents of this sort of super spectral order in an artificial sense. So you would have your original organic avatar or administer of the land, ambassador of the secret commonwealth of fairies, and that has its own mythology. And you see the same process occurring with Oppenheimer, with MKUltra, the Manhattan Project. Jack Parsons and that's not to say these people weren't like Parsons was obviously involved in the occult but these things are distributed to the population in order to further empower that psychological aspect of these things and I do think that has actual psychic effects on people it can lead to spooky things happening you can lead to people having hallucinations or

49:05 actual poltergeist or hauntings, or I'll give you an example. Any nuclear sub if you talk to anybody that's been a sailor seamen in one of these nuclear subs or nuclear armed submarines they've all seen ghosts or apparitions or it's so common that they know someone and they at least know someone who has seen something terrifying on one of these submarines And its because of that liminal The nuclear weapon itself is this, I would say almost paranormal thing. It's very liminal. It has this legend around it. It's obscured in darkness and security. It's born in secrecy. They describe it as being borne secret from its very origins and it stays under that patina of that atmosphere or secrecy for its entire existence

50:10 Yeah, I actually planned on bringing nukes up to you because you do have a few lines here and there about them. You have bigger posts but in the ones we were going to narrow this conversation down to you still have a few lines that speak to the things you're talking about obviously your fan of David Lynch and he has illustrated some of this stuff as well. You don't say nuclear weapons are a hoax exactly but you seem confident they weren't dropped on Japan yet refer to the bomb as a bridging mechanism with the supernatural, kind of the things you're talking about now. And it seems like they're somewhat real but not really... Yeah that's what I mean by them being liminal. Yeah yeah exactly maybe this has something to do with how we talked about the first post portals maybe this is like i mean

51:02 If you affect people's consciousness in a certain way with this kind of building up of lore and energy, I mean, things happen. We know UFOs and nukes are kind of synonymous. People always say, oh well maybe Roswell was the result of nuclear testing in the desert then there is people who talk about UFO is actually shutting down nuclear facilities that's been a trope and you follow g for a very long time there supposed to talk about. Actually a big UFO event in Missouri, my old stomping grounds in the 70s. And you write that Southeastern Missouri State University conducted a seven year study involving over 35 scientists and numerous observers across 158 viewing stations. The lights observed in the UFO sightings were predominantly white orange green and red frequently changing colors during observation

52:00 These events disrupted communications, knocking out transmitter towers including a police radio tower and caused widespread interference with radio and television signals. Harley Rutledge, the chairman of the Department of Physics at CIMO concluded these UFOs might be intelligently directed plasmas as they responded to observation by changing color and trajectory. In his summary he wrote that radiation in the form of microwaves was perhaps the way the light forms moved and then you wrote well What would an atomic detonation look like to such a being? If these things, be they fairies or janitor archons are indeed a race of sentient plasma. Humanity's newfound capacity to disrupt the electromagnetic ecology could be profoundly disturbing to them even if nuclear winter is a hoax in our world perhaps it is real and theirs." And I like that! It's like

52:59 The people who debate, are nukes real or are they not? It's like well they might not be as effective here as they might be in the electromagnetic spectrum. Exactly so there is this huge you know there is a lot of electromagnetic energy that goes out from one of these things and if you actually look at places where these devices have gone, they become habitable shortly after. You have things growing back like the islands were tested, the coral started growing back I think within five to ten years. the Soviet nuclear reactor disaster. It's all green now, all the animals are there." But it's quite possible that yeah if they exist as some sort of modulated plasma or an electromagnetic entity of some kind that huge burst of energy could just decimate that local ethereal ecology which is why you'd have people coming to investigate which is where you get the UFOs

54:00 You also hear lore about them being deactivated by these UFOs so you could get this kind of response to that. Yeah, and when this Harley Rutledge guy concluded UFOs might be intelligently directed plasma... I mean we talk about that a lot but i guess i then become curious do you think they're intelligently directed plasma or are the plasmas themselves alive because this also goes to Jacques Vallée saying oh i think these are projections we just need to find the projector.

54:35 Well, what do you think the projector is? I believe that it is a projection or it's like a manifestation. I don't think the thing in itself is the cause of it. The projector... You could think of it like this. There are a lot of people who believe the Bigfoot for example, is a poltergeist of some kind. So you have an emergent intelligence that comes out of a forest especially in old growth forests and the Bigfoot essentially is a projection of that superorganism, of this sort of complex system leading to complex outputs. As it becomes more intertwined the things it's able to do become more sophisticated and that would include being able to sense and communicate in some way with people that entered into it so you're wandering along, you're a hiker and the forest doesn't like your vibe so it projects something at you to terrify you, to chase you off

55:43 And that's not to say that it can't interact on the physical. It's not just like a hologram, it could have physical effects especially temporary like you could throw rock there's a lot of things that could happen so if you scale that up right they're basically what the Greeks called daemons their governor daemons that exists at a higher order reality perception this sort of in cosmic or higher levels of the system that we're inside of. And yeah, these plasma lights would be them just sort of gathering energy and shaping it, organizing it for a probe essentially. But yeah, they're nature spirits I'll put it that way. Right? Well, I like the way the Greeks talked about daemons

56:42 I've had Patrick Harper here a couple times who wrote demonic reality and one of the things i find interesting about his work is he talks about the personal diamond, the idea that obviously we are soul and spirit and physical body in that our spirit is kind of on the astral plane like we have an astral twin so to speak. And we also have a daemon who kind of is a liaison between the two, sometimes getting us back on our purposeful path. Sometimes shaking us out of our mechanistic routines perhaps and most people go their whole life and don't sense this daemon but I like the idea that there is some kind of companion spirit or usher to this reality that's trying to get us to fulfill a purpose that we maybe signed up for before we arrived here

57:38 Yeah, I've had sort of appearance of the daemon before. Oh okay! I didn't see anything it just sort of like took over and what i think it does is its there to sort of show you something. It's to show you...it's like a revelation that you need so that you can do things later on. That my experience I had was I was able to look at a person and know that we were one thing and that I could enforce that fact upon him, right? I could just like drop the barriers between us. And there was this moment where it was like would you like to know more? And it was all non-vogel of course but it was a feeling of like alright let me step in and the room disappeared everything sort of faded to white and both me and him experienced without drugs it was just this experience that happened suddenly

58:42 And it got quite intense, very fast. And I don't even remember saying it but apparently he told me later...I said something to the effect you know, I want to show you something so wasn't just for me was also for my friend as well yeah freaked us both out My friend actually avoided me for a couple weeks after that because it was very intimate and very sudden It was the stepping in, I think of like a higher order being. And yeah and it didn't feel malicious so it wasn't demonic or anything. I think that's what that is. It's the energetic double, the diamond, the daemon showing you something and I do think those things happen for everybody in different ways. If you ignore it we're trying to rationalize it shows up less but if you just sort of accept the experience and you're grateful for it, you have that conversation with the experience itself

59:42 you internalize it, it'll happen more often. You'll get more of these kinds of incursions of your personal daiman will show up more and interesting things will happen So that experience you told us about is really interesting and in the previous times you've come on it has been brought up from commenters and listeners that they want to know more about you but I just kind of say by the nature of anonymous person they want to be anonymous there doing this for a reason. And i've also always thought my show is more about information than it is about people i guess then the guest themselves but how much of your work

1:00:21 does come from personal experience? Because a lot of it is really resource heavy in your writing. You're very resource heavy, which I like but how much of the perspective that you arrive at is validated by a personal experience versus just researching the experiences of others? I would say half of it, at least my interest definitely arises from personal experience right? My interest in these things be trying to explain things that I've seen and experienced to myself. But there's quite a bit of it that, you know especially the stuff about nukes that i rely on research...I'm just interested in that because it has a certain quality to it that I think is important for instance if you ask me about like what exactly IS the thing that's eating us from the future or invading us from the future? I don't know because I'll sort

1:01:22 I don't speculate at that because I've never experienced that personally. I sort of intuit it, but a lot of the things that I talk about more confidently is things that I have directly experienced – yeah? Things like the daemon or the ultra-terrestrial or psychic powers and things like those kinds of things. I've seen them, I've observed them in people. I guess one of the qualities that I have and one of the interests I have in cryptids and the ultra-terrestrial discussion People will tell me things ever since I was a kid. People have just divulged sometimes things, I don't want to know but as I got older, I learned to kind of control it a bit and get people to open up to me about their experiences. People often don't like to talk about things that they've seen you know whether its ghost or unexplained experience that they had where they had lost time or they suddenly appeared in another location

1:02:25 So I've found that a lot of people have had these experiences, a lot more than we know. And that has just been my life up until like, I would say my mid-20s. I had people just telling me things they'd never told anybody else and a lot of that content, a lot of information included bizarre unexplained things that they don't feel comfortable talking about. There's this sort of superstitious paranoia that people have and I think it's actually healthy instinct to not talk about things that very nearly traumatized them because they were so terrifying in the moment. They'll just never speak of it again." So yeah, that's my own personal experience and my knowledge that most people are having these experiences and there is a natural instinct in people

1:03:21 where they don't write about it, they don't call into coast to coast. They keep it to themselves, they take it to their grave 99% of the time so yeah that's kind of what has informed my interest in these things I like it and throughout several posts you comment on the dangers and the potential benefits of engaging with the super spectral. You mentioned predators in the ether that would devour and digest the psyche, another post to say something to the effect that random encounters can be very dangerous but summoning can often yield sacred knowledge another post mentions these engagements being

1:04:02 corrosive to sanity, but also during some liminal periods the fairy forts were intentionally entered to secure enchantments in Terran Anag. While most things worth doing are not entirely safe but do you advocate for some sort of engagement with these super spectral? What super spectral juice do you consider worth the potential sanity squeeze, so to speak?" I would say, okay this is a public forum so there's going to be all kinds of people listening and i don't want to add to the schizophrenia engine as i've been calling it. So i'll try to be careful with it. I would say people engage with wherever they can their local folklore and traditions you know sort of just eradicate

1:04:55 any notion or any kind of attachment that you have to branding or, you know, the cyborg folk heroes as much as you possibly can. You know refresh the senses do things like I said create liminal experiences for yourself don't go too far right just you know sort of sudden camping trip that kind of thing unplanned and be spontaneous an yeah you'll have engagements will get enough re-enchantment to keep you vital, you know? To sort of revitalize you as a human but not to corrode the sanity. Because yeah! You can vanish off the face of the earth that's in the cards that's an option if you push it too far or you come back and your memory is altered or your character is altered in ways that might not be desirable I don't believe in schizophrenia I think what is labeled schizophrenia

1:05:56 some variation of a traumatic experience with the super spectral or with some metaphysical truth that people weren't ready to process. A lot of the times it happens because of, you know sort of chaotic environments things like that like if flip switches or something happens by accident and they stumble into something they shouldn't have but yeah I would say follow especially those things that resonate with you personally whatever your personal heritage is you know, go on a trip to the old country. Or if you're a foundation American and your family's been here for hundreds of years there is a lot of lore that your family in the regions where your family lived those areas that you could engage with like organic lore and it just takes going into local libraries reading town histories

1:06:50 A lot of those town histories, of course have stories of people digging up bones about giants and things like that. The tradition of giants is a huge one right? So you start getting into that, that's a great portal I think once you realize that our actual archeology and your sense of chronology of time is artificial has been artificially constructed over the past 175 years That opens you up to a feeling of yearning for the organic folklore and traditions and rituals of your line, if your people. Yeah just a more enriching life and maybe we should lean into being better at articulating the living cosmos to bring it full circle. Yeah yeah I think that's good i would say try to stay away from just diving straight into eastern esotericism or things that are kind of alien to you know that where they came to through the internet

1:07:49 You know, try to stay away from that as much as you can even though I'm coming to you through the internet. But if you want to personally have these kinds of experiences your best bet is to engage with it as intimately as possible with who you are. Yeah i think that's good advice so Yeah, man. Always a serious pleasure you have away with words and I hope you get a good response from our interviews remind the people where to find your work and anything else that you might be working on next? You want them to know about sure. You can find me on Twitter or X formerly known as Twitter at real human Schwab and I'm also working on

1:08:32 a project with my friend called Parafiction Press. We're going to do our own publishing and hopefully we'll get a comic book like a 1950s pulp science fiction comic book series going, we're working on that as well you can see links to Parafiction Press and all that other stuff on my timeline I've been putting a lot of that out recently so that's where you can find me it also i have the substack Schwabstack, substack.com. Love it man! Well I hope more people engage with your writing because it's really provocative and informative and I'm just happy to know you man thanks again and cheers to trying to revive the good timeline Thanks for that man thank you It was great talking to you as well And boom goes the dynamite The triumphant return of Schwab for lucky number three Yes

1:09:35 We went a little more big picture with this one as opposed to the tight focus of dirigibles or the extreme oddness of the Chicago fire, or Magonia. Those are all specific well-defined somewhat isolated situations compared to The stuff we talked about today like what is time? Or what do you see out there in the world these days I like his answers, but some of those questions maybe are a bit broad. And i think i've learned how to continue to get the best out of Schwab when he's here But it really doesn't matter...I just like his cadence and the words He chooses to use in his ways of thinking phrases like breeding ground for neuroses Just get a rise out of me and funny enough. He wrote me after we recorded this interview

1:10:27 and said he was reflecting a bit more on my questions regarding how to contact super spectral beings and that sort of thing. This might have been PlusShow, I'm really not sure...I can't exactly recall but he told me that he started working on an article with more detailed instructions and has a special link for THC listeners it's called Betwixt & Between and the paywall is off on this one if you use the special link that you'll find in the show notes, which is very thoughtful and generous. I like when a THC interview spawns deeper thought and further reflection and ends up in some extra bonus content for us

1:11:14 But as for the content The Plus Show did contain, because I do take some notes on this. We got into his post The Deep Desert Civilization which was great we talked about psychological warfare today and a really interesting part about the helicopter as almost a form of Lucifer's technology or at least a vision and just the idea of it being the trickster in mechanical form it should not work yet...it does And you know, in previous interviews we've at least referenced cultures and people who have an oral tradition that refer to a time before the moon. Well Schwab did a deep dive post on that and we talked about it all around great stuff if you're only a free listener You're missing half the show It's time to knock that off

1:12:04 5 two-hour episodes a month for the low, low cost of the ever declining value of $8. Use the links right there in your show notes right at the top to sign up! But I am on the hunt for more guests who would fit into this very hard to define and unique space. I've always considered Gordon White and Chris Knowles to be these sorts of gems, Schwab and Analog now too We talk to a lot of people who know one thing really well and we have some banger episodes but it's hard to find people who bring the right flair and quality to pretty much any topic. It's a hard thing to quantify, it almost sounds like a paradox to say that all four of these examples are similarly unique but it is what it is!

1:12:52 When Schwab came hot out of the gate with Cognitive Holocaust, I immediately scratched out my original title something like The Spell of Disenchantment and the Time Organism and replaced it with Cognitive Holocaust because it is such a good phrase. And shorter than Spell of Disenchantment which is important for boring logistical formatting reasons But we have a lot of guests talk about re-enchantment of the world. Gordon used to describe that as his overall mission, and we all know what he means—it's a noble goal! I folded it into my own agenda and thought process behind guest selection for sure. Dismantle materialism and bring us back to the esoteric quasi dreamlike perspective more in tune with natural conclusions of the ancients & indigenous

1:13:43 a more accurate map for reality itself. It's somewhat of a concession that we were born into a time and place that has it wrong, just wrestling with that is super hard for people to do and then to seek out a more honest worldview that is capable of the wider inclusion required well... That's even tougher and a major through-line to these here interviews you know? But Schwab takes the spirit of the term re-enchantment and flips it around to actually be more specifically accurate. The world never lost its enchantment, we just live in an artificially crafted society that is victim to the spell of disenchantment It's us that changed and need to change back Reality has been consistently weird throughout And you know those are the kinds of things I take away from a Schwab show

1:14:37 And I'm already looking forward to the next one. Be sure to shower him in appropriate praise so he keeps us in the rotation and wants to come back! Who else writes about fairy beings, portals, plasma intelligences and cybernetic mind control operations of the deep desert? If you find another let me know That said, I don't want to keep talking about my deceased father in every wrap-up but i think we all appreciate synchronicity and not only did Jim Willis also pass just after the release of our interview. The first one after my dad died But Shannon Taggart the guest to follow wrote me after our interview came out because she heard my wrap up and so she gave me condolences And mentioned that funny enough her and my dad had the same birthday

1:15:24 She heard me mention it was May 30th and so obviously that stuck out to her. And the sinks keep piling up, some relevant to the show some others not so much but it's an interesting thing to experience and continue to pay attention too. Speaking of this Shannon Taggart seance spiritualism super show let's see what the plus people rated it Any Plus member can rate an episode by logging into the website and clicking the appropriate star out of five. And check the comments, get into a conversation while you're there It's pretty lively But for those asking about where to review episodes that is where I get it is little confusing because everybody's asking for ratings and reviews of their public shows through iTunes and that stuff is important to the algorithms

1:16:16 But this is just inner circle stuff for me to see what Plus members like and what they didn't like so much. And my interview with Shannon got a 4.6, very solid! I wasn't sure about spiritualism as a topic but i'm glad to see people found plenty to like about it. Spiritualism does seem to be another casualty of the industrial spell of disenchantment and it was nice to dust it off and see what it's all about learn about the history and get some insight into its current state. Big thanks to Shannon for that interview! And of course, as always we have some events to call out free and open to everyone at higherside meetups dot com why not expand your local network over a mutual love? Of the kind of things we get into around here on deck with the calendar we have

1:17:13 June 18th, the Hideout Steakhouse Casa Grande Arizona. Who wouldn't want to have a nice steak with other THC listeners? I would! June 20th Pasadena California at The Corner Bakery Cafe. June 23rd Kansas City Missouri at The Broadway Café. June 30th Canaan New Hampshire at Poor House Barbecue That seems fun and then there's a couple on the calendar for July already July 1st, Lansing Michigan at the Rooted Socialite Cava Cafe. I had cava once it's very earthy but it did provide a uplifting almost sativa-like intoxication that I did enjoy and then July 6th in New Buffalo Michigan at Rolling Embers great nice handful of events it would be really

1:18:10 Fun to see the calendar fill up even more so we have listeners everywhere across this great land. Let's do something about it! Hiresidemeetups.com go there to get more information about any of the events you just heard about or to make your own But I love it. That's the show, super fun one for me today! I hope you agree take care of you and yours and i'll catch ya next time...I've done my part Your move cognitive holocaust deniers fake lore seeders and cold calculated casters of that persistent spell of disenchantment You're fuckin' You can try your best but you won't succeed In the transhumanistic future we see

1:18:58 We'll keep you wired so you can't sleep. Tech is a curse It's just one chip behind your face And some parts below that we can replace Progress leaves no time to waste Enlist the lights inside Forever connect and EI's To fix you

1:20:00 Your computational hours grow while you run endless loops of cat video. Offense will soar and cash will increase your worth. Lights in forever canonize to fix you! The people that first get it should have a massive advantage over people that don't have it yet Well, I mean its the kind of thing where your productivity would improve

1:20:53 dramatically maybe five factor of ten with it so you could definitely just take out a loan and do it and put the money back real fast. Yeah super smart when do you think your gonna do? How long will you wait? Our big dream, new phase A high end race our big dream, a new phase Stand by our big dream, new phase for all

1:21:59 A big dream, new face. Stand by me to fix you