Peter Levenda | Sinister Forces, Occult History, & The Nine

00:05 Puppet masters almost surely have up this clearly, maybe something ebby And until you've thoroughly tested every last close justin Think you know the less you really do That's true Dr. Seuss Without THC Cause we're their lion to us Just don't know without THC The higher side Jack shows How's it going, Hireside Chatters? Drinking a little drink smoking a little smoke and really psyched to talk to today's guest from sunny San Diego. I'm Greg Carlwood and folks we don't have to look too deeply to start noticing the echoes of occultism in the margins of history whether we're talking about the true nature of ancient sites around the world, the founding of America or the belief system of the Nazis

01:03 It seems like even in some of the most high-profile time periods, The Gatekeepers have thoroughly quarantined any reference to the real life influences of occultism and perhaps the otherworldly influences it conjures up. And although we're left largely in the dark for what we do know We owe a huge credit to today's guest Peter Lavenda for dedicating a large portion Of his life to doing the real work of dragging these hidden aspects out into the light in his wide range of books From titles like Unholy Alliance and The Hitler Legacy that tackled the little-known aspects of the Nazis before, during and after the war. To the three dense and detailed works that make up his series Sinister Forces a grimoire of American political witchcraft That looks at esotericism in what he's termed quantum history in America And quite honestly connects more dots than a bored kid with chickenpox and a sharpie I stand in awe

01:50 of his many impressive accomplishments and amazing personal experiences, and to have him here is a beautiful thing. Peter my man how the hell are ya? I'm doing great, thanks for that intro. Yeah no worries! I do what i can but...I am really psyched for this you're so knowledgeable in areas that I'm most curious and your work has clarified a ton of confusing material for me and also works to validate this idea we talk about that supernatural forces spiritual entities archons whatever lens you want to look through but force is deeper than what we can see on the surface have a real influence on our world and really shouldn't be ignored

02:25 And I guess to get us started here, let's start with Sinister Forces. Talk to us about this overreaching theme of how we find American history to really be a combination of largely unknown events and connections mixed with what appears to be some extra-dimensional or spiritual influence Sure. I mean, that is really the overarching theme what are the sinister forces we find in history and American history that people have blamed literally blame sinister forces for the things that have gone on? I took the title from Al Haig Alexander Hague had said that the sinister forces were responsible for that 18 and a half minute gap on the oval office tapes

03:06 And I thought that was a really interesting perspective. You know, what are those sinister forces? Al Haig at one point was running NATO. You know he was our national security advisor and one point Al Haig was trying to take over the White House when Nixon was considered either too ill or in the midst of the possibility of impeachment so here's where the most powerful people in the United States government, you know in the 1970s talking about sinister forces and I thought that's interesting. And then of course we had Douglas MacArthur talking about sinister forces coming from some other planetary galaxy you know and screwing with us so...I wanted to know what those were? What did people mean by that

03:47 And like most Americans in the 20th century, when I started we came out of this environment where science was everything. You know science was perfect. Science had the answers to all of it but science for me only answered half of the equation there's something else that's essential to the human experience. And science is great for analyzing material phenomenon, but it's not very good in answering the big cosmic questions like why are we here? What is our purpose? Do we have a purpose? Life after death and thousands of other things

04:29 So I started to look more deeply, what does religion and spirituality have to say about reality itself? What does it have to say about the world that we're living in? Does it answer things that science doesn't. And I found traces of this all throughout American history focusing just on American history and sinister forces I found that there was a thread running through our history where events that are seen to be unrelated are actually deeply related to each other. And the connective tissue is usually something so totally bizarre and so totally off the wall, of course we ignore it because we don't know how to confront it. It's a little bit like the UFO experience you know?

05:14 We have to ignore it because we can't explain it. Since we can't explain, we ignore it and because we're ignoring it, we can't explain it in Catch-22 but that's where we are so we've relied so much on science to answer questions for us that we're neglecting an entire aspect of what it is to be human. And in some cases, by doing that we've ignored connective tissue that exists between political events and political actors that quite frankly I found totally baffling and totally shocking I don't even know where to begin with sinister forces, but we talk about coincidence. Coincidence is a very unscientific term but science will use that term when it can't explain what happened so take for instance the Texas tower shooting right in Texas University of Texas A guy goes up to a tower and starts shooting people eventually police captain has brought in the shooter is captured killed all kinds of things happen surrounding this particular event

06:16 But people didn't realize that this entire episode had been prefigured in a novel that was published years before, which even got the name of the police captain right. Even though he wasn't even in the police department at the time So what was that all about? How did that happen?" It's okay to have a general idea, some nut goes on top of the tower and starts shooting people. I guess eventually some novelist would have to come out with that but to get the name of the police captain right... That's absurd! That's insane So, that prompted me to look further and naturally the ties to the Kennedy assassination was the next step in this process of me looking at that and thinking oh no this is not possible. These people could not have been involved. No wait a minute who's this?

07:06 and connecting the dots, as you said. There's a lot of dots out there but when you start connecting them it gives you a different picture of reality. It gives you a different picture what's going on like you mentioned kind of quantum approach to history. You know? And I always ask people was the Kennedy assassination particle or wave You know, it depends upon how you look at it. Was there a conspiracy or not? You can make a very good case that there was no conspiracy whatsoever which is what the Warren Commission did with voluminous documents and piles of paperwork But at the same time, you can make a very good almost I would say airtight case that there was definitely a conspiracy involved. But you're not going to like the details of that conspiracy involve things we generally ignore and don't want to look at. And it involves spirituality, it involves weird churches

07:58 It involves a bunch of people thinking they were in contact with the UFO in Maine, in 1952. You know? It has all these connective threads and they all point directly at the assassination. How is that possible?" And when I started looking at that and you know, I began to stop and say okay let's look at history. Let's just focus on American history because because this phenomenon is true for all history basically around the world. But let's just start with American history and see where it leads us And that led to sinister forces. It's just three volumes, and as you mentioned it's pretty dense. I have to apologize for that but that was the only way to really make a case was to pile on the evidence the way the Warren Commission did. You've got to do the same thing and use their tools against them essentially and say okay we're going take a Warren Commission approach this let's just pile in the documentation show me where its wrong

08:53 Maybe you don't like my interpretation of the spin that i put on these things but if you just look at the documents themselves there's nothing you can do to disavow it. We did have a bunch of people meeting in the woods and main in nineteen fifty two having a seance contacting a saucer that was hovering over the planet And ten years later the same people are involved in the kennedy assassination i mean directly involved in the kennedys association you know not so really weird peripherally this one new that when did this one about what i'm talking about two handshakes away. Yeah hits

09:29 Pretty unbelievable. It's very trippy and I do want to talk about those threads in JFK and the seance, but let's just back up for a bit because the Sinister Forces trilogy covers so much ground and one area that really blew my mind was just all all the relics and evidence of a rich pre-Columbian history that our culture refuses to acknowledge. To quote the first book in the series, you say there is an ancient America that lurks beneath the thresholds of our collective corn fed consciousness And I really love that. I think you're spot on and it's also interesting if you put any stock in the idea of spiritual forces influencing particular places or areas geographically, it would be pretty important to learn the pre-Columbian history yet we know very little but you know of the things that you've learned about this ancient America what have you found most interesting? Well the fact that you can look at our continent

10:25 at North America with the same wonder that you can look at the Middle East, for instance Egypt or Mesopotamia or Stonehenge in England. Or the vast temples in Mexico and Guatemala and Honduras I mean North America is replete with ancient monuments And because they were made of earth instead of being made of stone, we kind of didn't see them for a long time. Some people did and some people made drawings of them and they excavated there totally amateurishly probably ruined a lot of data, ruined a lot of information that way but it's... There is no doubt that we had ancient civilizations in the North American continent. And they were capable of just the same degree of sophistication

11:15 in creating their earthworks as the Egyptians were in building their pyramids, as an example. They were just as capable. In fact some of the mounds because they were a mound builder culture they just built earthern mounds some of them are actually larger and have more volume than the pyramids of Egypt than the Great Pyramid We're talking about people who are very sophisticated The Serpent Mound is a good example of astronomically oriented earthworks The people had the same ideas about adjusting their life and building their life around cosmic cycles. All of this was there, they just simply didn't leave much in the way of writing behind them but they did develop this very active civilization and I was

12:02 drawn to this accidentally. I had absolutely no knowledge of it, like most Americans do. You walk over these mounds not knowing that you're walking over the remains of an ancient civilization and I was drawn to it through accident. I was researching Charles Manson, of all things so I decided to go to Charlie's hometown basically. The birth certificate says he was born in Cincinnati but he grew up in Ashland Kentucky So I said, okay let me go there. I just want to see the environment. Manson was kind of the touchstone for all of this because Manson seemed to combine in himself a lot of these same elements that I was concerned about. He was Scientology clear on one hand he ran up he was responsible course for the Manson family murders on the other but there was so much other stuff going on. He was at Boys Town crying out loud and he was in all sorts of places

12:57 And I just wanted to see it for myself. So using Manson as kind of the way into the story about American history, I drove down from Rhode Island where I was living at the time and all the way down to Ashland Kentucky and realizing that so many towns in West Virginia and Kentucky and Northern Virginia were homes to some of our country's most infamous serial killers And I thought, well that's something weird right there. Let me just soak in the atmosphere and see what this is all about. Maybe it's the water." So I drove to Ashland and right in the middle of the town where Charles Manson grew up went to school when he went to school and all the rest of it... It's a park called Central Park. In the middle of the town there are these Indian burial mounds

13:46 I mean, they're large enough that they're quite visible. They're quite obvious and there was a plaque there saying that the mounds were actually excavated by a Boy Scout troop or some damn thing and I'm thinking what is this all about? So I start researching the mounds and as I'm researching the mounds, I become aware of the Adena culture, this ancient culture that was there in that part of the world that was very concerned with religious rituals surrounding these mounds. I'm thinking, wow! Charlie grew up playing on these mounds, you know? Playing on the remains of this civilization. Mounds that were used either for burial or they were used for religious purposes aimed at the stars or whatever and I am crawling over these mounds myself saying what is this all about and then I notice there's a strange house

14:35 It's a huge brick house and on the top of the house there are these two cherubs, you know? Like you find on top of the Ark of the Covenant. And these are on top of the roof of this house! I'm thinking well that's bizarre and they're really weird looking eldritch sort-of figures. They're griffins or something and they're very strange and their positioned like they would have been in the Ark of the Covenant The two angels on the ark are the mercy seat. God was supposed to come down and sit in the middle of that, and I'm thinking let me research this a bit more. And evidently they moved this house entirely—the entire vast house. This is not a small building. This was a big apartment house when iIwas there. They moved the entire thing so that it would be kind of in line with these burial mounds

15:22 And I'm thinking, how weird is this? This is Ashland Kentucky. This is Chuck Woolery's hometown. This is Naomi Judd's hometown. What is this all about? And that started me off on this whole thing. What are the mounds about? What is the association? And then I found that there were mounds involved underneath some of our biggest prisons in the Midwest, in Moundsville West Virginia's where Squeaky from me was one of Manson family members or most prominent member perhaps after the ones who were arrested she was arrested for the attempted assassination of Gerald Ford. Squeaky and she wound up in a prison on top of one of the other mounds

16:03 Henry Lee Lucas, very famous killer was incarcerated in Chillicothe Ohio on top of another burial mound. There was this association of burial mounds with prisons in American consciousness somehow we did that whether deliberately or accidentally so I began to wonder what is the meaning of this? Are Is America, as I say in Sinister Forces, a haunted house? Are we living in a haunted house or are there ghosts here from civilizations long past that we've been ignoring and could that be an element of our consciousness as human beings. Or are we possessed by these ancient civilizations that we basically trashed

16:46 Yeah, it's a really fascinating study with a lot of connections that I had never heard before and it does make you think because You like you say in the book Native Americans. There's an area of West Virginia where they have legends don't go there? you know this area where the Mothman flare-up happened and if that makes you think about spirits and entities and Maybe a subtle possession of sorts and yeah, it's very trippy but maybe we're not as in control as we always think we are. No, I think we're in control of some of the things that we do. But I think our motivations are quite often unconscious that we don't know why we're doing the things that we do and I think that's part of the problem. We don't know why. We don't have a connection to this land, to this territory. The way people in other countries have connections with their territory they identify with their land, with their landmarks, with their history going back hundreds thousands

17:43 We are a transient population, basically. We've come from everywhere with no direct connection to our land, to the territory we're living in. The people who lived here before were basically slaughtered as much as they could or they existed and dropped out of sight even before Native American populations as we know them showed up so there's something going on here where you're not connected. You're kind of adrift on this landscape And our only points of attention sometimes are these weird... bizarre architectural, geographical phenomena that we don't know anything about. That we just build our houses on top of it? We unconsciously kind of understand this if you look at American filmmaking over the last 20-30 years there's this idea that we build houses on Indian burial grounds. It was there in The Shining a very good example or it was there in Poltergeist. You know... Pet cemetery! Yeah, pet cemetery. There ya go

18:43 And this other film with John Cusack, the one where all these different personalities are inhabiting this motel. There are these delusions constantly to an Indian burial ground which is never discussed anymore in the film. It just happens to be there. There's brochures in the motel saying that this was an Indian burial ground and that the film was called Identity. So there's this idea that there's a connection Between the burial grounds and our weird behavior. And I think this is something that's really worth looking into it is it is and of course you know when you talk about the founders of America we know a good chunk of them were free masons in they have their own easter teric

19:26 beliefs and practices. And then we start reading about their interest in alchemy and ceremonial magic, and we've had people write huge books on the geomancy and occult symbolism of Washington DC... When you look at it I mean there's a lot missing in the official story here wouldn't you say? Oh definitely! You know because We're talking about what I think was James Webb called rejected knowledge. And even though it's rejected, it was still there we can say that oh there is nothing to alchemy that was superstition but you know the governor of Connecticut in the 17th century had a huge library of alchemical works more than 250 volumes on alchemy. You didn't know there were that many books on alchemy but he had 250 books on it. Cotton Mather

20:14 who was present at the Salem witchcraft trials, was learned in alchemy. He had friends in the Royal Society who were alchemists and there was a lot of correspondence going back and forth on this subject. Of course Isaac Newton was very involved with alchemy through all his life so it was part of being educated to be educated in these ideas. We had governors and we had people prominent in religion, religious life and political life in our country in the 17th and 18th centuries who were extremely involved with alchemy but also with ideas like ceremonial magic which according to some authors was not quite that different.

20:54 Cornelius Agrippa, one of the most famous magicians who wrote books of occult philosophy—the three books of occult philosophy—wrote extensively about ceremonial magic. But what was not so well known was that he was also a practicing alchemist and an alchemical laboratory went with him wherever he went. So there's this crossover between alchemy as a kind of pseudoscience, the way it's described today as a forerunner to alchemy which it was not. You know, alchemy had its own reason for being and had its own character. It was It's hard to say it was a spiritual practice the way we understand it today because we've compartmentalized so much information, to the point where nothing is related to anything else anymore. But for those people back in the Enlightenment era everything was connected and an iteration of something else. You could use religion to discuss science or you could use science to discuss religion but there wasn't that strong a demarcation between all of them

21:52 So, alchemy then became for me because I've written about alchemy a lot recently is a very scientific approach to the idea of consciousness. It was basically a consciousness science that said you have to use all the tools available to you as a human being, to understand what reality is. And once you do that, you can cause change to occur in the material world and that's what alchemy was about it was about going backwards in space and time to the point where the universe was created and understanding that process, and then bringing it forward. It's a very sophisticated approach to understanding reality. And we've kind of thrown it out because it's not chemistry you know? It's not physics but it was chemistry, physics biology, and a lot of spirituality what you might call spirituality, psycho-biology let's call it all mixed in together very advanced kinds

22:51 knowledge, and we rejected it by the time of the 19th century was coming around. The only people who were focused on that would be people who are creating religious cults you know so you had Joseph Smith you know, also very involved in studying alchemy. The man who created the Church of Jesus Christ and Latter-day Saints of the Mormons He was conducting rituals in New York You know basically using Agrippa's formulas magic circles wands, you know lamps incense the whole thing trying to contact spiritual forces And that was the origin of the Book of Mormon

23:27 So, jump forward a hundred years and you have L. Ron Hubbard doing the same thing in the California desert with Jack Parsons using the same rituals that Joseph Smith was using. So I mean this is American... The American religious experience has its roots in ceremonial magic. Yeah it definitely does and you see all these illusions to it early on but What do you think about these beliefs and traditions? Are they still intact among parts of the political elite in this country? Oh, I think they are. We have a kind of problem in our country the way we understand things. We know legally that there is separation between church and state. That's a legal thing where Congress can make no law affecting religion.

24:21 That's fine, but that doesn't mean our politicians have no religion. America is one of the most religious countries on the planet and people don't realize that if you've traveled abroad a lot or if you travel to Europe Europe is not a religious country. They have a lot of religious architecture, they've got a lot of churches and stuff like that but the people themselves are basically not religious, right? Not that religious, right? They're amazed at America and our obsession with religion in this country so you have politicians, you have political leaders who hold very strange beliefs and who don't talk about those beliefs except in the most general way. Oh, I believe in Jesus or something just to make everybody happy. But basically what they really believe is sometimes it's very strange

25:04 And we're electing these people and putting them in positions of power where they may act in accordance with these very strange beliefs. I mean, Ronald Reagan was one of them. You know, Reagan belonged to the same denomination—the same religious sect that Jim Jones belonged to—the guy who's responsible for Jonestown and the Guyanese massacre. They belong to the same denomination It was an apocalyptic denomination, end of times focus. We're living in the end of times, the world's about to be destroyed, we're a breath away from mutually assured destruction and we elect this guy as President of United States who goes up against Soviet Union? In his heart of hearts what was he thinking? Was he thinking oh hell if the world ends that's fine because that's how Jesus wanted it?

25:51 Thanks a lot. Can we vote on this by any way, by any chance? And this is...we have this. Those are the obvious examples like Ronald Reagan and Jim Jones being co-religionists if you will but there's other more subtle ideas as well and Freemasonry is one of those things that You know, exists everywhere in government. We have said so many presidents who are Freemasons and not just minor level Freemasons but high-level ranking Freemasons. Gerald Ford being one of them just to bring him back up again. Here was a guy who was high up in the Masons. We've had senators and congressmen... And people will say well it's like a boys club

26:36 Yeah, except that it's a boys club with magical rituals. Ritual initiations and it's not the kind of initiation you might find at a hazing at a frat house someplace. This is some serious stuff. This is memorizing huge amounts of text that you have to recite. This is going through really spooky rituals just the first three degrees of Freemasonry alone are talking about sort of death and resurrection in a very spooky sort of ceremony, and then you start adding the other degrees on top of it. The Rosicrucian degrees and the Knights Templar degrees and all this. And you are bringing in not only the consciousness-altering rituals themselves but you're bringing in a whole kind of weird history

27:22 that connects that American politician with ancient Egypt, with the Temple of Solomon, with the Knights Templars who were suppressed by the Catholic Church and massacred. With the Rosicrucian Society you're building a whole different history frame of reference historical frame of reference that is outside the mainstream You know, that regular historians don't write about. They don't see a timeline connecting all of these events but that is exactly what a Freemason of those high degrees would have to if not believe they've been exposed to it in a very emotionally charged way

28:02 Yeah, definitely a worthwhile thing to draw some attention to. And if we're going to talk about occult influences in early America you had mentioned the Salem witch trials they're worth the mention for several reasons but talk to us about this saga and how it might be connected actually to the UFO phenomenon? It is very strange I think We were taught in school, or I was anyway back in the 20th century. Many decades ago we were taught all the you know Salem witchcraft trials it was hysteria It was like basically the McCarthy era which was referred to of course as witch trials also In 1950's is when I was going to school sorry about that but that's true

28:45 And it was the time of the McCarthy era, right? So we were looking for communists. It's like looking for witches. It was the same thing and believe me I've gone through this a number of times already and now we're in a similar situation today so in those days it was communist on one hand you had Arthur Miller writing The Crucible which is a metaphor for what was going on and we were taught that there were no witches in Salem, that this was all trumped up. That this was people getting hysterical and blaming each other for things and a bunch of teenage girls going nuts and there was nothing to it at all." Well yes and no I mean there was witchcraft in Salem

29:22 There was alchemy, there was ceremonial magic throughout Massachusetts and Rhode Island, the Parvins Plantations and all of that. All the way going to Connecticut there were practices of that nature we're pretty sure at least one or two those accused in Salem were actually practicing occultists of some kind That's what modern scholarship has demonstrated Wow! There is sufficient evidence that there was witchcraft going on there Now whether Tituba the slave was actually involved in it or not, is a different story. There were two different streams or currents of occult practice taking place in that part of the world. One was the European-centered occult practices that we already talked about—ceremonial magic, Agrippa alchemy and all

30:10 And then there was what Tichuba represented, which was a kind of native Caribbean type of magical practice. So you had two streams running and these kinda collided in Salem. Tichubu when I was kid at school they kinda made Tichuba appear to be a black woman an African American slave. She wasn't she was an Arawak Indian She was from the Native American race. She was enslaved down there in the Caribbean, she was bought by one of the people who would be a minister who was running Salem, The Salem Church at that time and brought up to Massachusetts

30:51 That's a weird connection right there. There weren't that many Arawak left, you know they had been slaughtered for the most part after Columbus when there were uprisings and all of that and the Arawaks were gone after very viciously by the Spanish in that part of the world by the conquistadores so you didn't have many Arawak left but Tutituba seems to have been one of them. There has been some good scholarship on that And it seems as though her ethnic origins go back to Guyana which of course is where we have the Jonestown massacre a little bit later. So I'm not saying there's a direct connection, but it's a very suggestive one. I call it Tituba's revenge you know? But anyway so or maybe its cigarette smoking because that was an Arawak thing too. But Tituba then is in Salem

31:39 and when she's being questioned. And remember, Tituba started all of this right? It was Tituba talking about voodoo dolls making puppets to affect other people through sympathetic magic that supposedly started this whole Salem thing. Tituba was not executed at Salem. She lived a long life after Salem. She was thrown in prison, she was eventually released when the governor of Massachusetts got disgusted with the whole thing and said enough is enough because now you've claimed my wife as a witch okay we've gone far enough here boys and girls so she was released actually I think she got married and went on her merry way which is one of things that we don't hear about Tichoua but when she was being interrogated and she was being interrogated about how she went to the meetings of the witches

32:28 the kind of occult rituals they would perform and all the rest of it, she kept referring to The Man in Black. It would be The Man in Black who had come to fetch her. The man in black was the messenger He was the person who brought people to the witchcraft ceremonies, such as they were. Whether they were Sabbats or Esbats or however they defined them in those days. Tichuba claimed it was the Men in Black who were doing this and I was startled to find that reference in a document going back to 1692. It's very bizarre but there she is talking about the Men in Black, 1692-1697 up until that point of time

33:11 You know, the idea of witches flying through the air. The idea that they could dematerialize in one place and materialize someplace else sort of a manifestation of quantum entanglement somehow or non-locality is very sophisticated ideas are coming out of Tichyba. And the men in black motif then would be forgotten for maybe 200 years or almost 300 years after Techeva, and it would only reappear again in the 1940s-1950s where the men in black then suddenly show up around the time of UFO experiences. And they're there to dress in black and they show up, they question witnesses, and they disappear. They're always a little bit out of sync

33:54 with everyone else. They're driving cars that are 20, 30 years older than modern vehicles and they're dressed oddly and all the rest of it." And Tichouba declared that these men in black would dress oddly. They were in black clothes but they were not period clothes of that period. I mean there was enough information there that led me to believe that maybe she was talking about something very real, that maybe there was a real experience behind Salem Academics will say, well there were economic issues involved. No that's probably true but it was a triggering event you know? There was something really deep behind it

34:32 The idea of spectral evidence, you know where a girl could go hysterical in the courtroom and claim to see a devil bothering somebody or possessing someone else. And of course no one else saw it. Cotton Mather himself eventually got disgusted with the whole thing and said this is wrong. And Cotton Mather was quite a conservative Christian let us say but when he came to the Salem Witch Trials even he put up his hands and said it's not real But nobody said that Tichiba was lying. Nobody claimed that Tichiba had made anything up, the girls yes probably for the most part but there were some people who were arrested at Salem who were involved in occult practices and of that now to be true therefore did these occult practices involve things that would consider today UFO related?

35:25 Yeah, another interesting parallel is uh Bruises and marks on the body that jives with the UFO abduction phenomenon too. I found that pretty interesting Oh sure absolutely there was you know the idea that there might have been implants There might have been a body parts or you know Surgeries taking place on people There was definitely this...there's a motif that runs through history And it didn't start at Salem, it started of course much earlier on. But we see this motif everywhere. We see in the sacrifices of the Aztecs and Mexico. We see this concept that your organs are not really your own but they belong to the gods and the gods can come collect them any time. Therefore to forestall all the gods coming back and wreaking havoc were going to select our own sacrifice or gonna kill people and offer up their organs to the gods which keeps you know the gods away from the rest of us

36:19 I've been doing a lot of research on that lately and i'm reading deeply into the Aztec annals, and the Popol Vuhl and everything else coming around from the Maya even the Inca records. And if you look at it from the point of view that this could be part of that same phenomenon then suddenly it all starts to make sense. There's a recurring motif throughout world literature that seems to be that our blood is not our own, that our organs are not our own, that we ourselves are not our own. We don't actually own ourselves. We're not as autonomous as we think we are and what is the reason for that? Why do so many cultures have that belief you know and in the Aztec case they were terrified by this. I mean people would

37:07 willingly, voluntarily offer up their blood to various shrines. They would pass a shrine on the road to an ascendant god and they would open their veins you know? And offer some of their blood to that shrine before going on this was the concept they had and to me that's fascinating from the point-of-view genetics in evolution what does this all mean is there a genetic connection to this You know, what is it? So that's kind of the work I've been doing these days. That has an interesting thread too but yeah so many flare-ups throughout history it becomes more and more apparent we might just be playthings for the gods play things for these sinister forces

37:44 I'm really interested in the belief systems of the elite, their experiences with ceremonial magic and really just how much contact with otherworldly entities there could be and how that influence could spread across the culture. So The Story Of The Nine is really amazing it's probably the best example that there is meat on those bones and you cover so well can tell us a little bit more about this farmhouse seance and some of the elite families that were there? It sounds pretty weird when you put it that way, doesn't it? That old farmhouse seance. You had this sort of American Gothic idea with a couple of people and overalls and pitchfork but actually it was totally different. And I think it is the best example of this

38:27 A man called Andrea Puharich wrote about it very famously. I mean, he was not bashful about talking about this that's why it is so well documented and yet nobody put the two and two together Andrija Poharic was an American-born scientist of Yugoslav background. He was a medical doctor, he was an entrepreneur, he experimented with scientific devices and that sort of thing. During the Korean War I believe he had the rank of Major in the US Army but he was based out of Edgewood Arsenal in Maryland which is where the chemical biological warfare stuff was conducted

39:09 And he gave a talk to the military, to the defense department personnel on weaponizing psychic abilities. This is totally documented it's there we have names addresses and phone numbers you know? He went there and gave that talk He was very much involved in the study of paranormal phenomenon and he was a friend of Henry Wallace, who at one point was vice president of the United States Secretary of Agriculture under Roosevelt. Henry Wallace, of course, was a friend of Nicholas Rorick who is the famous Russian psychic and artist and medium who went on vast travels through Tibet and Asia and places like that

39:51 and had actually seen a UFO back in the 1920s or 1930s, I believe. So this Andrija Puharic as I say was fascinated with the paranormal, fascinated with psychic abilities and he gathered around himself a group of friends and fellow travelers you might say that he called The Roundtable Foundation And he had a seance. This was in 1952, remember 1952 was the year of the great UFO overflight Washington DC in July of that year well a little later on Kuharich has this seance

40:28 And the person who was the medium was a Dr. Vinod from India, who was a very prominent actually member of some of the world religious organizations and I was in contact with his family a few years ago because I was desperately trying to find out more about this guy and they were insisting he wasn't a medium at all but he was very religious for some reason he acted as a medium with Puharaj and as a medium he had conducted the seance which is very strict a number of people was invited. And the people who were invited involved Arthur Young, who was one of the inventors at the Bell Helicopter during World War II. After the war he dropped out of the engineering business and went straight into full-time research on the paranormal. Arthur Young and his wife

41:18 His wife is Ruth Forbes Payne Young, which is a lot of nomenclature there but I'll explain that in a bit. Also there was a DuPont and an Astor, members of the DuPont family and the Astor family. We had basically blue blood American royalty sitting around a seance table you know? In the forest in Maine And they were allegedly, according to Puharich himself, they were contacted by a group calling itself the Nine that was evidently living on a spaceship hovering over the planet. They were proving their existence and their intelligence by solving a mathematical equation for Puharich which he later verified was true

42:07 And then they went on to discuss plans for the planet, how the people have to get together and solve some of these problems. The nine people sitting at that table were just like them called The Nine. astral entities, or whatever you want to call them. Extraterrestrials and there were nine humans and those nine of the nine on the ground were now united they were linked and then I people on the ground should go out and conduct themselves accordingly and cause change to occur in the world in general. They had their marching orders from this spacecraft entity speaking through an Indian medium

42:47 And they took this seriously, okay? This was a very serious thing that they did. Arthur Young and his wife of course for the rest of their lives were involved in paranormal research. Arthur Young wrote a number of books he understood that beyond the scientific ideas at the time there was one that was neglected which is the scientific idea of The Process the process of how things happen. He had a seven-stage process and formula that he used, he wrote the geometry of meaning, he wrote the theory of process, he was very involved in that kind of combining metaphysical ideas with science. That was Arthur Young's forte. One of the Duponts became very prominent in other psychological and spiritual organizations, the Aster herself was related to the famous Astor family or the Walter Fistoria. She had a lot of connections to occultism and occult practices also. And the list goes on and on. That's 1952

43:50 Arthur Young, as I said is married to Ruth Forbes Payne Young. That's because Forbes was her maiden name This is the same family that gave us John Kerry right? This is this is the four of the Forbes, you know Forbes magazines the same Forbes family right this this famous wealthy Influential family she's part of that she married a guy called George Lyman Payne who was a Trotskyite and out of California. She divorced him and then married Arthur Young, but she had had a son by her previous marriage to George Payne and that was Michael Payne. Now Michael Payne got a job through Arthur Young working for Bell Aerospace in Texas because Arthur Young still had tremendous connections at Bell so now Michael Payne who seems kind of a lazy ne'er-do-well mostly gets this kinda cushy job down in Texas

44:45 in Dallas, and he's married to another Ruth. He's married to Ruth Payne and Ruth Payne wanted to study Russian. She was a Quaker. She studied folk dancing. She was like into a lot of different things. And at one point she was introduced to Lee Harvey Oswald and Marina Oswald introduced by George DeMora. All of you Kennedy researchers know exactly who I'm talking about in this discussion. Ruth Payne opened her home to the Oswalds, Marina Oswald lived with Ruth Payne for a while. The idea is Ruth would teach her Russian

45:25 that, you know for some reason Ruth Payne was desperate to learn Russian which was an uncommon language to be obsessed about in 1963. And at any rate so there she's living there with the kids and everything else and Ruth Payne is the one who helps Lee get his job at the Texas School Book Depository. Wow Ruth is also the one who basically gives all the evidence necessary to hang Lee Harvey Oswald to the Dallas police. You know, she has stuff in her garage that belongs to Lee and she gives him up basically. They are members of the ACLU he...she and his husband Michael Payne they don't arrange for a lawyer for Lee Oswald even though Lee is asking for a lawyer in one of his television things when he was after he was arrested they do not bother to move an inch to get him a lawyer

46:13 And later, of course there's a famous photograph of Marina Oswald, Marguerite Oswald Lee's mother and Ruth Payne sitting in Ruth Payne's home with the Dallas police and the FBI. And they're spilling their guts basically on this whole thing. A month no but two months before the assassination, Ruth Payne out of Texas goes on vacation and she goes up to Philadelphia and hangs out with Arthur Young and his wife Ruth We don't know what was discussed. She had a Russian defector living in her house, right? How many Americans have Russian defectors living in their house in 1963? I can tell you probably 10 or less or further, right? So this is like amazing, she has a Russian defector! You know they talked about this. You know this was an object of discussion after the assassination Ruth Payne

47:13 out of Dallas, Irving Texas technically is called in front of the Warren Commission to give her testimony because she's a crucial person in all this. I read through all of her testimony and the very first interview she was doing in front of the Warren people, the Warren Commission who was on the Warren Commission Alan Dulles right? Former head of CIA. Alan Dulles is sitting there probably smoking his pipe during the whole thing Ruth pain starts to talk about her trip up to philadelphia to meet arthur young alan dulles cuts are off immediately. You read the transcript it's obvious she starting to talk about this trip he cuts or off you make some jokes and totally side tracks the entire conversation we never hear, about your trip to philadelphia we never hear arthur young mentioned we never here what she was doing there. Never hear what was discussed allen does make sure that wow

48:11 Why was this so? Well, as it turns out Arthur Young's wife Ruth Young her best friend was Alan Dulles' mistress. Known for years they were best friends together for a long time. Dulles knew what was going on in the Arthur Young household you know there could have been no doubt about that he knew something really explosive was involved here and he made sure that Ruth Ruth Payne did not discuss it in front of the Warren Commission, and she never did. And she hasn't since. She has not discussed what happened during that vacation to visit Arthur Young, what she discussed about Lee and Marina, and how she came back down got Lee the job at the Texas School Book Depository in the West East District but here was the nine in operation you know?

49:02 It's such a fascinating connection and so many people have studied the JFK conspiracy, and you very rarely hear about this really interesting connection with The Nine. And if these people were supposed to be kind of soldiers of these entities' agendas do we see the threads go out any other events besides this interesting connection with the JFK thing? Well, the JFK has more connections back to the nine actually which are also completely unbelievable. I mean just the fact that George DeMorenchild was a friend of one of the famous

49:40 mushroom scientists, a guy called Wasson who was on the trail of the magic mushroom in Mexico. Wasson was reporting back specifically and directly to Andrea Pujaric, the leader of The Nine on his experiments that he was doing in Mexico with the mushrooms. In fact, he was supposed to be conducting psychic telekinesis and psycho ESP experiments during his time in Mexico back to Andrea Pujaric, who was then still in Maine. There was supposed to be this conversation going back and forth telepathically or something which Wasson screwed up because he got totally stoned on mushrooms... which is understandable I guess

50:23 But anyway, so Wasson goes back and this whole idea of psychedelic mushrooms of psilocybin and all of this becomes a major issue. He has a full page photographic spread in Life Magazine on all of this. Wasson becomes the guru with magic mushrooms. His name address phone number was in George Damoran Schilt's address book when he committed suicide when he was getting ready to testify in front of the House Subcommittee on Assassinations right? So evidently according to the story he committed suicide with a shotgun and they found his address book, and Wasson's name was in it. Which indicates a connection back to the Nine with Damorin Schilt who also of course was involved as some kind of confidential informant for CIA and everything else And most recently in The Hitler Legacy I talk about this...I found this very strange coincidence that Damorin Schilt when he was in Yugoslavia

51:19 in the 1950s, was accused of spying for American intelligence. But he was there under the aegis of the forerunner of the US AID program which is a strange little operation that was created by John Foster Dulles which is supposedly an international aid operation operating out of the State Department but which functioned as a front for CIA or intelligence activities in other parts of the world. George Damoran Shilt was involved with that, and it seems as though there were connections back to Oswald, connections back just couple of other very unsavory people that I researched in Asia who are also part of the same operation so there's a lot of very strange stuff going on there but then there is the other coincidence, the one

52:09 I couldn't believe, really when I came across it. And I had to read it a few times to think maybe I was seeing things or imagining things and I wasn't. It doesn't make sense even to this day if we think in purely linear terms where space-time is concerned. And that is that there was a Belgian mystic who won the Nobel Prize for Literature 100 years ago and his name was Maeterlinck, Maurice Maeterlinck He wrote a number of novels, he wrote plays. He was involved with Stanislavski in Moscow. Stanislavski, of course invented the famous method of method acting and he wrote a play called The Cloud That Lifted it's a play that probably never been performed in the United States or maybe it was once or something It was not one his most popular plays And In The Cloud That Lifted

53:09 He writes about the assassination of a political leader, about the number of shots that were fired which nobody could really recall how many bullets were actually fired. The bullets were fired from a grassy knoll in front of this political leader and it was fired by a guy whose name was Alec and who might have been working for Russia. All these details are in a play that was published before John F Kennedy was even born Wow. It prefigured the entire assassination, even to the point that Alec is mentioned because Alec Hiddell was Lee Harvey Oswald's alias. That's how he bought the rifle that he allegedly used to shoot the president. He was Alec and he was called Alec in Russia when he was a defector living in Russia. So the whole thing is prefigured in this play written by a guy who wasn't mystic, by the way, who believed in astrology and mysticism and seances all the rest of it

54:10 I am one of the prize to boot here was a guy who also play about the blue bird. Happiness you know this idea of the blue bird happiness is this concept comes from him And in his play, which is really strange and they did make a film out of that with Jane Fonda among other people. There were these kids and they're going on a trip to find the bluebird of happiness. They're going through the forest and they're encountering all sorts of strange people but the idea political conspiracy is in this story. The idea mind control of altering reality is all there. Then we have Operation Blue Bird

54:47 which was the beginning of united states my control and kill style experiments on behavior control mind control brainwashing all the rest of it, it was called bluebird i think that's quite deliberate i think it wasn't a deliberate reference to the major link play. And if that is so do they also use the cloud that lifted as a template for the assassination of the president Man yeah that is so weird and we do see it time and time again also with that story you mentioned at the beginning of the show these strange things between media and art in real life events another case, other would be with the sinking of a titanic in the book that was written earlier about the titan.

55:29 I mean the story is almost the same and the name, The Titan. You couldn't really get much closer. And I know we're getting down to the wire here another thing i'm curious about and I know better than to flat out ask you about your own experiences with ceremonial magic or rituals or the Necronomicon but You have talked about paranormal experiences as a teenager that validated there being something else in the world Is there any advice you can give to listeners who are interested and accept these kind of ideas? Intellectually, but haven't ever Interacted with it on a personal level any thoughts on how to best coax out an interaction of some type. Well Let me think for a second sure um the

56:14 The importance is this, I think Israel Regardie who was another one of Crowley's subjects you might say. One of the people who worked with Crowley a great deal had this to say he said that before you embark on a program like this it's good to spend a couple years in therapy first and there is reason for that He wasn't being glib, he actually meant it And he meant because you don't know what your motivations are for wanting to experience the paranormal and you don't know what your vulnerabilities are You don't know what might happen. If you have an experience that is so far outside the realm of the norm, then it could conceivably unhinge you and make you a little crazy

56:54 And I think that's very good advice. I think people who are drawn to this subject might be drawn to it for some of the wrong reasons, and wrong is a judgmental word and it's not really the way I want to put it out there but it could because of vulnerability in your own psyche that you're trying to redress without really knowing about it. This is very potent emotional and psychological material, or it can be. In fact in the best way it can be but it means that you're going to be taking risks and playing a little bit fast and loose with your own consciousness And if you're not really strong psychologically It could be enough to tip you over one moment You could become obsessive There have been even Crowley writes about cases where people would become obsessive by studying magic and all kinds of wrong things have happened I've known people

57:45 that's happened to. They get involved in this thing and they think that suddenly they have the secrets to the universe, but at the same time they're being pursued by faceless demons who want to eat them. And you know, that does exist in a theoretical sense but it can be handled or dealt with. But when the fear reactions start to take over then you lose objectivity and you lose power over your own mind. And that's the thing you really want to avoid. I think it's something you go into gradually, when I was a kid when this happened there was no idea of going into anything gradually when you're a teenager and so you sort of both go into it if you don't know, you had no teachers or nobody would tell you what to do and where you have these experiences and in a sense I wish I didn't have them

58:33 If I had not had them, I probably would have led a pretty normal life up until now. But it was having them while I was in high school and then going into high school and studying chemistry and biology and physics in the high school academic program and realizing the two things didn't match that basically made me question everything and questioning everything is not a comfortable place to be if you want to progress in society. You've got to buy into a program and stick with it, right? You've gotta become an insurance salesman or something." And that door was closed for me once I had those experiences as much as I try to ignore them sometimes and forget about them It was still there. I saw things that should not happen, that shouldn't really exist

59:18 And that is what led me into understanding there were secrets and there were other people like me who might have had the same experiences or something similar, who then pursued this study much more aggressively than I did. Maybe in a different context maybe in a military context or political one or scientific one so it made me realize that there are people out there with some shared experiences who look at the world in a different way And do we, or should we be afraid of these people? You know. I'm still not 100% sure on that and I can't give you an ultimate answer. We should be afraid of some of them yeah probably. Some of them maybe not but some of them yeah I think so

59:56 Yeah, I mean definitely good points. I'm super interested but until you've had like a personal experience it's hard to fully pull these things out of mythology and superstition sure and that's definitely why I'm curious but you're right who knows the deeper deep down reason i might be curious somewhere in the back of my mind I might be being subtly possessed into developing an interest There you go. Who knows? But it could be a very human interest, I mean this is part of who we are. Remember Julian Jaynes wrote a book called The Bicameral Mind long time ago perhaps you don't remember it so it was very big at the time and very controversial and he said that consciousness, human consciousness developed when we learned to shut off one half of our brain but at one point as we evolved as hominids the two halves of the brain were having

1:00:51 And one half of our brain was the half that we thought we were listening to God talk, right? Telling us do this and to do that. And eventually with evolution, we shut down that part of the brain or we integrated it so much that you no longer hear it. So as a kind of schizophrenia, but the human race lived in a state of schizophrenia for a long time which is why we never progressed until we learned to shut down one half of the brain where we could concentrate on other things So it's probably hardwired into us, this listening to the voices of angels and gods and seeing visions and all the rest of it. Which is what half our brain does you know? We've learned to sort of channel it into art or something else

1:01:30 But that wasn't a complete cure. That didn't solve the problem completely, and those of us who are very much involved in the arts and creative work may have inadvertently opened those channels which is what Lovecraft was writing about. Wow yeah I love that perspective! And with these things of course you're right it's important to approach with caution we do hear a lot of horror stories same with psychedelics really i mean some people consider them to be enlightening versus mind melting, you know. Some people never come back they just become burnouts from the same chemicals that other people attribute to wisdom and enlightenment. And an example of that that we really didn't get to talk about is MKUltra. I like how you consider that time period, the things that were going on under that umbrella as forced ritual initiation. I never considered it that way but it really was forced initiation without the safeguards in complete ignorance in a lot of cases

1:02:28 Precisely. And then we sent those people out onto the street And we wonder why. Yeah, and that has all kinds of threads too but wow this has been amazing man you are such a wealth of information and you've written about so much that it's tough to even scratch the surface here We didn't even talk about wandering bishops but hopefully we can do this again sometime You know sure Awesome! Before I really cut you loose Can you remind the people about some of your books they can pick up? Your website anything else you're working on Sure. You can go, I have a website peterlavenda.com. I don't update it that often. I'm deeply involved in a big project right now that i have to finish as soon as I can and it's extremely...it's like another Sinister Forces project basically so um I don't update the stuff as much as I could but you can get information on peterlavenda.com or

1:03:19 Well, Amazon of course has all the books. It has the Nazi books, The Dark Lord which is the Kenneth Grant book that you mentioned as well as other books I've written on Freemasons and on Mormons and other things as well so it's all there. I've written books on Tantra. I just came out with a book called The Tantric Alchemist which is an investigation of alchemy and basically decoding European alchemical texts in light of psychobiology and that sort of thing. So there's a lot of stuff I've been working on, and my last name is spelled L-E-V-E-N-D-A. People will spell it LA and get totally confused when they find some other guy so just thought I'd reiterate that but yeah My books are on Amazon all the usual suspects Barnes & Noble places like that

1:04:07 Right on. Awesome stuff, man! I really enjoyed it and as a lazy stoner in college dropout, I have so much respect for you and all the research you've done You're one of the greats man take care yourself out there I appreciate it. Thanks very much. You got it! Wow guys, Peter LaVenda is a very knowledgeable well-spoken guy and he's got some elements of mystery to him as well It's really no secret that some people suggest Peter is really Simon of the Necronomicon He even has a disclaimer about it on his website And I've heard him say he knows who Simon IS but it isn't HIM and either way...I love it and consider this show to be really top of its class

1:04:45 And the Sinister Forces trilogy is really awesome. Kudos to Gordon White for pushing me to dig deeper into those books, maybe he's working some magic on me hijacking my motivations but I guess it worked out so what can i really say about it? Peter really is a great writer all around and I plan to complete more of his titles and have him on again, but getting that context for America's magical history was great. And the witch trials too! Something you very rarely hear about. In the book he does mention the giants also but we just couldn't fit it all in. If you did like this show please give some love to Peter LaVenda check out his stuff let him know there were people listening so we can get them back

1:05:23 We did cover so much ground from ancient America, Manson and the Mounds, rejected knowledge and alchemy within America's early founders. The Salem Witch Trials in the parallels with alien abduction interesting justification for human sacrifices And then of course in the second hour of the show for plus members we got into Peter's work on the Nazis in The Occult and their strange beliefs lots of insights I hadn't heard from anyone else We talked about the Hollow Earth 2 and a connection between Operation High Jump and the assassination of JFK. So many connections with this guy! And also I figured since i do see so many comments asking me, well what about the Jewish elite? Every time a guest talks in depth about the Nazis...I figured I'd ask Peter about it. So we got into the idea that the Jews run the world-that whole conspiracy Zionism

1:06:11 how to kind of put these things in context with everything else we know, I'm glad we went there. I thought those were pretty good answers and uh... We talked about Nazis in the Catholic Church too connections between Lovecraft and Crowley Kenneth Grant and the OTO and a bunch of other stuff. You know the drill by now just sign up for the extended show already and treat yourself to the totality of THC! I think it's about time Not only did I dig out some old Joey Diaz show as a bonus last week, i also did the first edition of the Carlwood Q&A. I answered personal and conspiratorial questions from the forum thread and it went a little longer than hour so check that out and ask me some questions for the next one if you're interested

1:06:52 A lot of people seem to like it, so I think they're going to continue. And I do really just love the forum discussions. I wanted to bring up one about the white genocide trend in the conspiracy community. It kind of relates to today's show. It's way too much to read but in the Make The Case For Forum where we try to stack up evidence for various perspectives, Shaman Janir pointed out a laundry list of areas where you can see Nazi influence after World War II. The fact that the Nuremberg trials only convicted a dozen or so Nazis and only 10 served sentences? Does that sound like a power structure dismantled and held accountable? It doesn't to me!

1:07:29 He also brought up that the Muslim Brotherhood was who George Herbert Walker Bush reached out to for creating the Mujahideen, likely because of the family ties through Prescott Bush's Nazi connections. Then later the Mujahadeen were finally utilized again as Al-Qaeda and Gladio operations which were then recently rebranded as ISIS I mean Nazi connections to Isis I see the thread there. He also brought up the Red House report, which outlines Nazi plans for post-war Germany's European domination by the establishment of the EU as well as for Nazi survival by leveraging their backers in Britain America and the Vatican and by the smuggling of loot through Switzerland. That is Joseph Farrell talking about huge caches of Nazi loot! He also brings up who does Greece or any other European country have to placate when their currency is in crisis?

1:08:20 And there's way more there. I'm very thankful to have people putting out really thoughtful and intelligent posts in the forums, but i point these things out just because i get annoyed when people want to reduce things down to a single narrative. I can be tempted to do it as well and i definitely did it more in the past but the more i see the more complex things are not simple And I would throw in the words of one more guy, Hammer1 who said if you imagine fascists and Europe as the extension of the Roman Empire. The last 150 years in Europe starts to make a little more sense familiarizing oneself with the empire can be quite handy why would the Vatican work with the Nazis ever heard of the Holy Roman Empire based in what is now Germany?

1:09:02 This is why all European royal families have very strong Germanic ties. The royal houses, the Vatican and the Nazi party are all arms of the same octopus." The Empire Never Fell is not the glib throwaway line that it appears to be but like everything in this life seems to be a both-and kind of thing and that's spot on. That's my attitude – its both! Drawing attention to one power center does not mean we're ignoring others And I'm not saying there's not lies told about World War 2 also. I think there is a lot to be unpacked there, but I just don't think it goes so far as to think the Nazis were not also bad guys There really was no good with World War two the way I see it just too power structures looking to feed and when it comes to people broadly criticizing the Jews

1:09:49 It's just not descriptive enough and it turns the majority of people off and then they miss the core message which might be about real substance. Because even if a large group of media and banking elites are Jewish, which I have no problem criticizing you can't blame a whole race can you? Just like you can't say all Americans are to blame for the military-industrial complex. I want nothing to do with that, neither do a lot of people I know just because we share a race or a nationality don't let that be the division it's about regular people being manipulated and fed on by the ultra rich That's the division to me It's very simple So when shows go looking at refugees as the enemy, as the destroyers of white culture... I mean come on! Enough with the I only want white people within these borders. It just sounds so gross As technology improves, as people's resources improve our ability to move around the planet more freely becomes apparent and maybe some brown people are gonna come to your white place but we're all gonna be okay i think

1:10:49 Maybe this has to do with me being an American rather than a European because like we talked about in the show, Americans don't have a cultural heritage or connection to the land were on that's very old. We sort of have what I've been describing in private conversations lately as an individualized culture. We just take what we like and make it a part of us on an individual basis. And I love that! I think that's what culture and political ideologies and spirituality should be...individualized Of course you can do that anywhere, but I think Americans do it subconsciously because there isn't that long traditional heritage. But if i was born Mexican, I wouldn't want to feel obliged to like and know about Mexican music or adhere to Mexican stylistic choices

1:11:31 I'm actually heavily Polish and Swedish, and my attitude is oh that's interesting And I just go about my life and try to enjoy it. I don't know much about the heritage there or the history of those places... ...I probably know more about the Japanese or the Egyptians because I was curious about their history and so what? Are we not part of the human family first? So because I built my own cultural likes and dislikes, and I'm just an individual I don't fear anyone coming around and destroying my culture or affecting it in any way. I just don't care about that! I'm sure most Syrians would love to just be home with their families if their world hadn't been turned upside down by powers completely outside of their control They're not flooding in to hurt you, they're just trying to exist These terrorist extremists we know are just puppets for the shadowy elite pawns being used on a chessboard To spread fear

1:12:22 And I just hear shows talk about loving everyone and how big a part of the playbook Divide & Conquer is, and then in the next breath they're worried about the Muslim invasion. I mean, I don't know...I'm sure people who are on this thread will say that I am naive and I don't understand the ramifications of this multi-generational campaign to destroy Europe with multiculturalism so everyone forget their roots and we have this hodgepodge one world government But the existence of Chinatown does not destroy San Francisco Whether they co-mingle or just coexist It's not something to worry about. And again, I think the one world government is already established through corporations without borders and a revolving door of privileged fucks! I think Coke and Pepsi, McDonald's and Walmart have done more to destroy our culture than a mosque on the corner. Where is that outrage? Those are the companies destroying your local culture and heritage aren't they? Replacing it with nutrient deficient cardboard and poison

1:13:14 Look, I'm not saying the elite aren't trying to force cultures to clash together. Just that if you consider yourself part of the human family first that play won't work against you Now I do think that cuts both ways too. If i was talking to a devout muslim who insisted on looking the part, I'd say just drop that traditional bullshit that you were raised in so you bought into it and just look around and decide what you like Don't be attached to a paradigm That is being used as a weapon right now Let go of that attachment! If ya think flat bills looks cool wear a flat bill if you like wallet chains then wear your damn wallet chain Can a South Korean not wear overalls and plaid shirt because they were born in the wrong south?

1:13:53 I mean, I'm joking around but that's just because I find this so silly. White people and white culture will still exist even if we have to share the spotlight a little more than we have traditionally Is that weird? I don't know...I just think the floodgates are open The internet is here And cross-contamination of culture is going to exist everywhere you look and maybe I just don't get it But you're only going to hear me criticize power structures, not multiculturalism fear-mongering. Maybe I'll be one of the last shows to say that for better or worse. But what do I know? I am not the smartest man in the world. This is just a tribute, and with that I am calling it in! If you remember, I used to ask for tracks from listeners who might be in bands with related songs and I stopped doing that because even though bands were giving me permission, I was still getting automated copyright strikes on YouTube which defeated the whole purpose but I do have this song laying around called Wiccan Wives from a band called The Wire Riots. I hope they still listen but I thought it'd be an appropriate one to play us out with

1:15:04 So that's it for me this week. I hope you don't hate me too much for going against the grain of my own conspiratorial culture, but either way it's your move occult architects of our stagecrafted reality... Your frickin' move. You're wicked wise! Summertime! You can f**k things sentimental as long as you so shake hands with whom you've met. You're not the only one dead. You're just the only YOU! You can talk ass

1:16:21 As long as you're at the top of the show So shake hands with him, you- You're not the only one dead. You're just the only white wiccan white summertime whoop you can find! As long as you rip so shake hands with him, you may- You're not the only- You're just the only