THC 33: Judge Jim Gray | Libertarian Nominee for Vice President 2012

01:43 You know people, we spend a lot of time on the higher side chats dissecting the infinite layers of corruption within our government and 20 days before the national election on the heels of the propaganda machine we call debate. The illusion of choice has never been clearer but the chorus line to corporate media has many tricks and maybe our cynicism allows us to fall victim to a different lie The lie that there's no third choice. Yet on every ballot in the country, there is a ticket that MSNBC and Fox News won't tell you about and for me that's a very telling sign they just might be the right choice Today's insanely special guest is here to make that case A former Superior Court judge in the great state of California And the vice presidential nominee for the Libertarian Ticket Running mate of Governor Gary Johnson He is literally the man with the plan Judge Jim Gray Thanks for being here

02:29 Well, thank you Greg. It's always good to be with good people and unfortunately I agree with your assessment we really do have the answers uh we really do have the most qualified person to be president of United States that i know of than Governor Gary Johnson more administrative experience at this moment than both governor romney and president obama combine i'm proud to be a running mate and you can ask me any question you want i've kind of a defect in the fact is that it candidate so tell you the truth at this point change so let's do this thing and uh... we'll just talk talk serious thanks

03:05 yeah so let's just dive in and start with a question that i know would probably make Mitt Romney wet himself but I know you're comfortable with it and that is simply put the higher side chats audience really likes two things exposing corruption and marijuana why would they vote for Gary Johnson and Jim Gray Well, let me count the ways. Again, aside our qualifications because Governor Johnson actually is so much more qualified than Barack Obama who's he actually been president for three and something years right now more than George Romney as well uh he has practical experience he was a very successful highly successful governor of New Mexico and honestly I am more qualified than Joe Biden who's actually been president for three and something years as well Paul Ryan hasn't even had a job outside

03:49 government since he graduated from college. Biden hasn't been outside of government since the 1970s, you lose touch! I was in the Peace Corps and will be the first Peace Corps volunteer to be elected to national office and i'm proud of that. And the only one of the six of us running for president or vice president has served in the military. That brings a real perspective as a federal prosecutor in Los Angeles trial court judge in Orange County for 25 years and I think all of that brings things to table but not only them We really have as our watchword, our slogan for the campaign is good government is easy. Watch and that's what Governor Gary Johnson has done so I met him because he took a very public stand against our nation's drug policy back in 1999 when I was sitting governor said he held his audit as you called it found out to war on drugs is not working and took

04:40 the public airwaves, said that was a fact. I didn't have any constituency to do that took some heat for it but it was the right thing to do and that's what he did and he did turn things around in New Mexico with needle exchange program stopped the arrest nonviolent drug offenders to a major degree Of course, I had done the same thing in 1992, held a press conference saying our nation's war on drugs isn't working. So we share that and in fact we sponsor, we endorse those three initiatives in Colorado, Washington and Oregon to treat marijuana like alcohol for heaven sake that is the way it goes. Treat hemp like cotton for heaven sakes again just so abundantly clear but its money Greg,

05:22 In fact, I had two sitting congressmen from Orange County Republicans tell me years ago, Jim you don't understand most people in Washington realize the war on drugs is not winnable but it's eminently fundable and they're addicted to drug war funding. We've got to go over the heads of Congress to the people we are making progress and anybody that wants for example to have a medical marijuana clinic survive in the next here to uh... people make hope this governor gary johnson you can elect romney you can elect obama They're not going to have any medical marijuana dispensaries in the country within a year or two. In fact, Romney and Obama are so close together on so many things we call them Robomni they're almost interchangeable keeping our military in conflicts all around the world it just goes on and on We say we're not gonna attack anybody who are not going to be at war with anybody unless they attack us or our allies So there's so many parallels between Romney and Obama

06:17 and we're on the other side. I mean, I can go on and on which I have been doing for a few minutes but it's so vividly true that I'm proud to be the running mate of this guy he is the right guy and uh... working together to stay involved Can you explain how although Obama frames himself as soft-on weed by saying he has inhaled and does these little skits with Harold Kumar for the DNC but in reality the past four years have gotten actually tougher from marijuana users isn't that true? Yes, indeed. Oh my goodness sakes and he even acknowledged in his book that he used marijuana regularly when it was working in Chicago In fact, even acknowledged this book to use cocaine and now

06:56 Of course, he had his Attorney General Eric Holder who issued that memorandum which I really took encouragement with saying we're not going to use federal resources to arrest and convict anyone for medical marijuana as long they are in compliance with state and local law. Which I found refreshing and appropriate now of course they're really attacking even some of the best of a medical marijuana dispensaries because he's lost control over this government or whatever reason Yes, we have an arrest for marijuana every 43 seconds in our country. Every 43 seconds and 85% of those arrests are from simple or only possession. It's just disgusting it's outrageous spending resources on this

07:39 when it literally we could and should be spending them on robbery, rape and murder. And so really this was the thing Greg that pushed me over to come out publicly against this. The tougher we get with regard to nonviolent drug offenses literally the softer we get with regards to prosecution of things like robbery, rape and murder because you only have so many resources in a criminal justice system but spend them up to take those out of commission that are causing us harm is absolutely outrageous. We're going to change it, and they're not. I've seen a lot of videos online and you've written a book where you talk about the failings of drug prohibition which is great and I encourage everyone to seek that stuff out but i wanted to ask you some questions that don't hear asked but are important to me for example how do you feel about Julian Assange and Bradley Manning in the situation that occurred there?

08:30 Well, it's just no different particularly than any of these other things. We simply were hypocritical we are we're simply using resources and squandering them but we need to hold people accountable for their actions and Governor Gary Johnson and I believe that but you know squandering these things on other things just like these cases is simply contrary to reason, contrary to what people should do with their critically important discretion in the entire justice system. It bothers me because currently it seems like secrecy is more important than morality within our government so if you were to expose something immoral uh...you know you're gonna spend your life in a dark hole somewhere and no one's going hear about you Do you think that whistleblowers should have some type of protection?

09:24 Absolutely. You know, the answer of course is yes we you just have to focus I've been in a criminal justice system and I'm a prosecutor, criminal defense attorney judge bureaucracies are really really good at one thing and that is increasing the size the power the control of bureaucracies and that's where we're going It's just outrageous really as we, as citizens see what our government is doing. And you can go back to Thomas Jefferson, a hero of mine who said if you have the people afraid of their government that's tyranny

10:04 But if you have the government afraid of the people, that's democracy. Greg guess where we are today? The government continues to have us intentionally and continues to help us live in fear and they're pushing that it's for their own benefit but certainly not for ours We're going to a police state now. We are in a tyranny situation. We need to gather back And reclaim the soul of the United States of America which which is our freedoms and our liberties. And our soul is under attack for so many reasons by our very own government, and it's just something that the founding fathers who probably take up arms against us were really giving away our liberties without much of a fight to shame on us eternally

10:45 I agree. We did see a spike in protesting and activism this year with the Occupy movement, which was mocked by the media, ignored by leaders and eradicated by aggressive police force but what are your thoughts on the Occupy protests? How would you guys have handled it, you and Gary Johnson if you were in office Well, we are so much in line with so many different movements. The Ron Paul movement? Yes. The Tea Party movement in addition of the Occupy movements as well. Why? Well because we really would for example do away with crony capitalism you know the idea

11:22 of the government paying people not to raise corn, paying oil companies to drill for oil. All this stuff is simply not within the libertarian tradition whatsoever that certainly appeals to the Occupy movements, to the Tea Party all these folks. That's what we do. The military putting our military in harm's way, spending all of this money in Afghanistan. We would bring out our troops from Afghanistan now." That appeals of course to these other groups that I'm talking about and it just goes on and on. This war on drugs marijuana. We would endorse, in fact we will have on the ballot I'm assured in California 2014 an initiative to treat marijuana like wine that certainly appeals to so many of these other groups. I was a federal prosecutor as I said in Los Angeles ended up heading a unit

12:12 prosecuting frauds against the government, the FHA, VA. I prosecuted a lot of bank vice presidents. Governor Gary Johnson and I believe in responsibility at all levels of society and higher position of trust, higher position of responsibility, the higher standard you should be held to that's what we believe. That appeals of course to move on to the Occupy movement, to the Key Party We have all these things in common And we would repeal that so-called Patriot Act, that direct frontal assault on our civil liberties. It's been embraced by Obama and supported by Romney. We would repeal it—the National Defense Authorization Act is so called which is again a direct attack on our civil liberties. Anyone you meet more likely me could be labeled to be a terrorist by the executive department I could be detained translation I could be arrested held without charges ever deported to a foreign country this

13:04 not what the United States of America stands for. We stand for its repeal, Roe v. Bonnie embrace it as their own this appeals to these people so we have so much in common and we have the answers. We are great! We are in the mainstream American political thought today were both financially responsible and socially tolerant no one is going to accuse Obama being financially responsible and no one's gonna accuse Romney being socially liberal We are in that mainstream. All we need to do is show that we're viable and then we would win this election as we've been in these debates, which are just about to wrap up now.

13:44 If we were seen as viable in those debates, we'd be the odds-on favorite to win this election because of that. Final comment on that regard is we will do something that the American people crave and if they understood it's possible they would demand and that is we will put in a coalition government You know, yes, libertarians and independents highly placed in our administration but also Republicans and Democrats assuming that they agree with our approach of financial responsibility and social tolerance. And then when we have all this bipolar politics going on this selfish squibbling amongst themselves or their own political game, we would have some of their colleagues in our administration go out talk to the Republicans, talk to the Democrats hey guys get onboard, this is a good idea. We'll give credit to anybody who has a good idea

14:28 anybody that embraces a good idea and will actually join together and work for America instead of working for this selfish political self-interest stuff. So we will be able to do that, we're not in the debate so our exposure is limited We're going to continue to do this and put this to the American people all up till 2016 I'm committed to this man Gary Johnson he's the right guy He's what we need and by thunder were gonna get him into office Well, you know I've always liked libertarian ideas about drug laws and freedom but i do have real concerns about how a libertarian economy would run and it's probably just due to my own ignorance. But can you walk us through some of the major changes Gary Johnson yourself would make in the economy? Of course! And thank you. Today like...I was yesterday at Tulane University in Houston excuse me in New Orleans now I'm flying to Houston but You know I greeted this group

15:24 Unfortunately, I think bad news. You're bankrupt for every dollar today the federal government is spending we're borrowing 43 cents. I don't care your political philosophy you will understand that no company could possibly do this and stay in business No household could possibly do this without going through bankruptcy Let me tell you a secret no country can either mean we're Greece and it doesn't help you to have your own The economy simply dies because the biggest security threat to our country is a bad, failed economy. And that's where we're going so we're gonna have to actually have an audit of the entire federal government and after reduce spending strongly. So what are we going to do? We have that audit which has never happened before using

16:05 using generally accepted accounting principles just like any public corporation is required to do that every year. They're going to do the same thing for the government and includes a Pentagon by the way, they scream oh no national security we say we're not going to give away any national secrets but were going to have an audit And one of the things then that we're going to do is look at all the money we're spending, have our troops fighting these wars all around the world. We've spent a trillion dollars because of Afghanistan and the answer is we can't afford it. You can't be the world's policeman. Simply anything we can accomplish in Afghanistan, we have. Bring those troops home now. I know something Greg, we are actually nation building fixing

16:44 roads and the schools and the pipelines of foreign countries halfway around the world, we're going to spend that money here instead. We need our own infrastructure to be fixed so that's part of that 43%. We have military bases break something on the order 900-1000 military bases in foreign countries today now were not isolationists I say any those bases are necessary for security terrific reinforce them as far as that is concerned but probably we could close down 80% of those without even scratching our heads more than once because they're not necessary for our security. I swear to you that

17:20 that Germany is not going to be attacked by Austria in my lifetime. Let's bring those troops home, station them in San Diego or Nebraska or New Jersey or whatever. Station them on our homeland instead of theirs." Again they're necessary for our security that's different I actually read a magazine article about two months ago quoting a woman who lives in the small town in Germany next to an US Army base and she was horrified at the idea we might close that army base but she said Oh, wait a minute about 92% of the revenue from our small town comes from the US Army I say you know You're probably right but we're going to instead spend that money in our home Instead of theirs so so these best part is that 43 percent savings? We simply must do and then will again conduct that audit of all of our federal agencies for example. We have the Department of Energy and

18:10 It's not choosing winners and losers in the marketplace. Ethanol, which is maybe 10% of the gasoline we use in California has been decreed by the federal government Department of Energy you have to use corn for that well wait a minute First of all, the corn crop and I've been through Illinois Indiana. The drought is severe why dictate that the corn be used for that instead of feeding hogs and Tortilla market and arrest instead in fact I was on a radio talk show out of Iowa maybe a couple years ago and a man called in said you know I'm going to talk against my own economic self-interest Mr. Gray, I raise corn however i'm here to tell you that an acre of hemp would result in the great deal more ethanol per acre than an acre or wood and corn will clog your carburetors and hemp won't well it's not like field I don't know but let the market figure out which crop is best use ethanol

19:07 We don't need the Department of Energy. It's counterproductive, it's inappropriate." We'll close it down and that's a big saving that's part of the 43%. And it goes on and on I would close down a whole lot of Bureau of Indian Affairs for heaven sake. You can talk to Native Americans and I've talked probably 50 in the last couple years ask them a question what do you think about the BIA? They despise it. I mean wouldn't you right if they don't trust you to educate your own children or baby we'll do it for Nonsense. It's insulting, we'll close that down so we just look at things will disclose everything very publicly and say wait a minute this one isn't working this one is duplicative We've got to reinforce our economy because that's our security threat and were going to give an honest look to it And reduce that obese federal government simply doing things that are inappropriate

19:56 It goes on and on, but I think you get the idea. Let me again insert that we actually have in our initiative to regulate marijuana like wine, you don't have to listen to me. It was the language from the Attorney General's office and if we were to treat marijuana like wine, we would save tens of millions of dollars every year in enforcement costs That's just for the state of California alone and hundreds of millions of dollars would be gained by taxation so we could use that money to pay our firefighters, their teachers, fix our highways. I mean that's just one thing but it's huge! It's just absolutely huge. The United States of America

20:47 leads the world in the incarceration of our people, both by sheer numbers as well as per capita. And here I assure you that we're number one does not make me proud. We're ruining people's lives in California alone tens of thousands of people are imprisoned as we speak that simply should not be there very expensive pastime prison guards union forces it savoring and they're thriving but is simply harmful can't afford it its human were We're breaking up families, taking parents away from children and the rest of that. So let's focus on what people do instead of what they put into their bodies and then we'll be a lot more successful." Again this is exciting Craig you know? This is the most exciting thing that has happened to me since my children were born. I mean this is the right guy!

21:35 He cares about people. Again, I do too. I was in the Peace Corps. We're going to make sure that yes we have a safety net for our people but government will be the last resort instead of the first resort and when it comes down to it nobody is going to be starving in our state or country Nobody is going to be bleeding or not have medical care. The government's the last resort instead of the first resort and we're going to spend money, get a lot more value for that money and really tear down this obese intrusive federal government that we now have taking away our liberties etc. So again it's just an exciting thing and I'm proud to be involved

22:10 Of course. What you just said is really, really important to me about the safety net because I do worry on the federal level with the changes that you'd make with the drug policy and the military, that's going to decrease the deficit and you know stop us from bleeding money as a country but individuals I worry about some of the programs that libertarians talk about cutting because without short-term unemployment or government assistance how could i suddenly lose my job and not also lose my home before I found another one well, I understand unfortunately it was government really created this problem with banking and the problem with

22:51 housing and the rest of that stuff because we actually insured risky loans or loans that transparently were not going to take place. But once again, just talk about health care when it comes down to it We're gonna get the government out of our healthcare for people who can take care of themselves Greg I know neither you nor I wants the Department of Motor Vehicles to be monitoring intake and doing our healthcare but when it comes down to it again If people simply cannot take care of themselves, we're going to have healthcare for them. We're going to put in under at least as far as I am concerned government clinics or sponsored by the government to provide medicines nurses and hospitals for people and doctors instead of administration bureaucracy and fraud

23:37 and you know if you can call it socialized medicine if you want to but that will be the ultimate safety net where we're going to spend money on doctors and medicines etc. And you can call it socialized medicine if you want to I lived in a socialized medicine facility for four years, its great socialistic enterprise called the United States Navy or I am my dependents can go to the Naval Clinic they could get pretty good health care and when it comes down That's what we'll do. But today, and we've had this morass of bureaucracy, this Obamacare is increasing the bureaucracy driving medical doctors out of the field throttling our whole health care system? And the answer is no. The answer is no. We will repeal that when it comes down to it again I promise you if I have anything to say about it at all—and I know Governor Johnson feels the same—we're going to have that safety net. The government will be the last resort instead of first resort. It's gonna work

24:31 Well, let's actually discuss corporations for a minute because this is another issue. I love that libertarians deregulate things for the individual, shrink the size of government but they also get rid of some other regulation on corporations and it's my opinion that corporations are moralist when it comes to their bottom line. That's why our food becomes cheaper and less nutritious. It's why at my day job out of the 11 store managers in my district working 50 hours a week running million dollar stores zero of them can afford to be homeowners. But do you really think less regulation on corporations and eliminating the minimum wage, which is something I've heard about? Do you think that'll help the American people?"

25:13 The answer is yes. Governor Gary Johnson, when he was the governor of New Mexico actually streamlined regulations look we need government no question about it we need regulations but they need to be more user-friendly understandable I mean you can look at these supposed regulations going back to medical marijuana dispensaries nobody understands what they are and i sympathize with police certainly that the in the economy per capita than any other state. So, you know again we need regulations I'm not going to go back to laissez-faire and say oh you know corporations bless your corporate heart they will take advantage of a system just like individuals will be responsibility we need antitrust laws I mean that sort of thing but they have to be streamlined because bureaucracies can tend to expand

26:20 to invade your privacy, invade your world because they really need to justify their existence and we need to tear that back. We'll still have it but we'll have it more streamlined more understandable and more fair in fact if you're worried about creation of jobs We have Obama and Romney literally spending hundreds of millions of dollars on their ads. You've seen them on television, but have you seen any of them that talk about their records? Say I'm running under a record answer is no they don't have a record to run off are they talking about new and good ideas No They don't have any ideas what they are only doing is spending hundreds of millions of dollars showing how inept The other one is and honestly we agree with both of them They just don't have many ideas going idea They have as they want to be elected

27:05 We would, for example, repeal the income tax. Now wait a minute what's the connection here? We will bring in millions and millions of jobs simplify our lives. Greg do you believe that our income tax today is equitable workable and fair? You know nobody will say that. In fact I'm not... So what will we do? Well i was going to say I've seen documentaries that say the income tax isn't even formally on the books as a law Well, I'm not sure that we do have the 16th Amendment. Some people say it was never ratified but one way or the other we would repeal the 16th Amendment and put in a retail consumption tax now look today our goods for example have a competitive disadvantage because they had paid taxes on them through the companies that make them before they leave our shores as exports you know income taxes at this payroll taxes etc

27:55 competing against goods around the world that have not paid taxes on them is a competitive disadvantage. Same deal in reverse, we have a lot of goods coming in from other countries I don't care Singapore Japan Argentina whatever they've not paid taxes on them competing with our domestic goods to have and then all of them pay the same sales taxes If you were to repeal the income tax and have a retail consumption tax instead, you'd have all of the goods paying the same taxes and it would level the playing field. I was in an airplane recently sitting next to an executive from Nike, another shoe manufacturer who said his eyes got big and he said Judge Gray this is sensational if we are going to repeal the income tax most companies would bring their manufacturing back to United States or America

28:39 Translation, that means millions and millions of jobs. So it's a reverse outsourcing but wait a minute wouldn't this in effect be a tax on the poor unduly regressive on the poor? And the answer is Governor Gary Johnson will take care of that For example, how much would this retail consumption tax be? I don't know. Let's say 10%, probably somewhere between 8% and 12%. If it were 10%, first of all understand that everybody that is working and receives a payroll check would no longer have any withholding for income tax or social security. All about money will stay in their pocket because it was paid by the consumption tax

29:17 So people will have more money to begin with. That's a good thing, however what about the poor? If Governor Johnson is in there he will actually have a redate to every adult in the country every month say for an amount of $100 that means if you spend $1000 a month on goods and services it ends up paying no taxes at all. If your really poor and spend less than that they'll actually make money on the deal so That will certainly take care of the poor. And then everybody will pay the same 10 cents tax on every dollar they spend over $1,000 Bill Gates on down now I think you would agree with me that people that have money spend more money than people that don't so they're going to pay a larger amount of taxes

29:57 It's really going to work. It will simplify our lives, you can make business decisions for business reasons instead of tax reasons and by the way there are numbers of companies that have mastered the system, have all these tax breaks before them they don't pay taxes at all in general electric if you want it would change that dynamic so people actually will pay a lot more to failed system because they get enormous political power by voting for tax breaks to their wealthy constituents. And that's across the board, all of them do it and they don't want to give up that power but when we win this election will get such attention nationwide and people will absolutely watch this and see in any of their elected officials that don't vote for this will be putting their selfish political interests ahead of the people's were going to say you know go talk to your representatives and straighten them out just

30:59 This is something that will work for everybody and simplify our lives. There's a difference between simplification, which I certainly favor and simplistic which of course is not this will simplify our lives and really make things work streamline increase jobs and help really everybody across the board except people like H&R Block they don't like the idea. I think we can live with that. Yeah, I like a lot of what you're saying but something that really does concern me in terms of corporations is we have a system where limited liability corporations like Bayer, for example. This happened a few years ago. They can find that they have HIV contaminated blood and because it's more profitable they can dump that on foreign markets and then pay the fine and still be trusted to put products on our shelves with nobody to hold accountable because of the limited liability. Is there any way

31:50 to fix that because if a normal company with the normal owner had done something like that they would not be in business anymore. I've never heard of before, i think that is that's not only human about that but something simply should be prosecuted at that crime Honestly, I've never heard that happening before. Maybe yes maybe no but the answer is anybody that does that we would certainly release that information so fast if the people of the United States heard that one of our companies was doing that they'd go out of business because there be such outrage nobody by their products and if they would be violating any of our laws By doing that we prosecute the devil out of them but

32:31 That's just outrageous. I don't have any personal information, but that's not going to happen in our world. We believe in responsibility at all levels. Let me tell you, I was a federal prosecutor for number of years in Los Angeles and yeah, I prosecuted bank robberies and drug cases and stuff as a drug warrior back then but I also ended up heading a unit, prosecuting frauds against the government. You know the FHA to VA I ended up prosecuting a lot of bank vice presidents and most people don't do that because they can actually defend themselves you know but so the success supposedly success rate in prosecution is lower but those are righteous prosecutions i believe governor gary johnson believes in responsibility at all levels of society and the higher level of responsibility you have the higher the level of scrutiny

33:19 And so we have people today, for example in these banking scandals who are donating big time donations to both Romney's campaign and Obama's campaign. They're going to expect payback at the end of the election. You think these people are going to be investigated and prosecuted? The answer is no! We will. I'm not saying anybody has committed violations of law but we're gonna look into it if so we will prosecute them because were responsive to the people And Romney and Obama, they're interchangeable. They're responsive to private interests with regard to this and so many other things. This will be refreshing. You will be proud to have voted for and supported Governor Gary Johnson to the degree that I promise you everybody that votes for Governor Johnson in November will be proud within a year or two that they had done that. And 60% of the people who did not will truly wish they had.

34:12 I don't disagree with that. That's, I mean...I can understand how someone would even put an Obama sticker on their car after four years it's like what did you vote on him for? You know if it was for getting rid of some of the secrecy in government which he talked about didn't happen If its ending the wars that didn't happen. Guantanamo Bay that didn't happen Soft-on marijuana that didn't happen Pro gay marriage that didn't happen What puts that sticker on your car now four years later what did you get It's kind of well my view is very much like yours that no one with an half-an-ounce of understanding what's happened in the world With Oprah Obama unless they want money from the government. They do he's really good at that He's pandering to the voters using our money to pay for them voting for him you know Romney is so many ways the same, you know it's just simply

35:06 big-time politics we are the voice of people and i know that sounds great not only because what governor johnson talks about but what he actually did in new mexico you know he ended up getting very high reviews for standing up for liberty keeping the government out of our personal lives out of our bedrooms yes we would close guantanamo a bleeding sore on the soul of the united states of america i don't know obama said he would do that right away epic kind of went through the motions but she sure adopted it is all now you know again this patriot act that he's optimism we come at obama from the left we really do stand for liberal values we really will get our military troops out of this conflicts all the way around the world both romney and obama i saw these and and byton and uh...

35:56 I I promise you, though that if somebody attacks us or our allies they will truly wish they had not. Otherwise we're going to declare peace around the world." Obama? My goodness! He's even talking about ... I saw in The Times a little while ago he was talking about putting our troops in Mali for heaven sake. Do you believe Mali is a security threat to the United States or Sudan or Yemen or whatever? The answer is no.

36:35 Obama is not one with liberal values. He simply isn't gay marriage, you know he came out At the end of his administration, a couple of months ago, sending this vice president to meet the press and kind of opine well maybe I'm rethinking this whole idea of gay marriage and arrest. I don't speak for the administration but you know maybe I'm changing my thoughts let me sit back and wait and see what kind of reaction it is two days after that Obama makes the comment well I'm kinda reconsidering this but But, you know it's a state issue. Translation I don't have to do anything about it." Two days after that he was at George Clooney's house in Hollywood and raised $15 million basically from the gay and lesbian community. You know he is pandering. He really believed that he would've done it beginning of his administration. And we say wait a minute

37:23 we believe in marriage equality. It is the next step on the progression from racial equality to gender equality and now it's marriage equality, it's a federal issue, it's a 14th Amendment Equal Protection Issue we will enforce it federally so you can agree with us or disagree with us but that's our position. You'll know what our positions are and we actually believe this where Governor Romney I know where he comes down on that right just read with that and but Obama I don't know what he believes about anything. He's just pandering to people trying to get, use their money, use their votes but it doesn't stand for it. We do." I agree. You know libertarians seem to be about streamlining and simplification but what about eliminating public representatives and voting online so that people don't have to worry about campaign promises being kept?

38:15 I think that those ideas, in fact...I'll take that three steps farther. And I'd never thought of this before but on the campaign trail about six or seven days ago, I had a man come up to me and say, you know Church Gray when we actually began with our republic that we actually had each representative from the House of Representatives represented about 15 thousand people in his or her district And now, of course the number of members of House representatives stays the same as 435. That's not in the Constitution by the way But now, of course they're representing hundreds of thousands of people. Why don't we go back to the original representation? Of having each representative simply represent like 15 thousand people I quickly kind of thought in my mind well that would result in something like 2500 members of Congress said that's true but Like you say great Let's change this and allow them to stay at home and have a home office And they'll do business on the internet yes

39:12 Yes, they can conference with each other. They can listen to speakers. They could speak from home. They can vote from home. to do that, you have local representation. You could actually talk to your member of Congress and actually get a lot more responsiveness and those lobbyists that are now in Washington, they'd lose their control because they won't be able to pigeonhole and talk to all the people from Congress. They'll lose their influence The people will gain influence, the lobbyists will lose influence because there'll simply be too many people that they can affect. It will result in democracy like we've not seen it in decades." I think this is a sensational idea. Me too! Just thinking about how you can work from home and have another job so you're realistic

40:05 It will be a lot closer to the ground and people and representation. I think it's a sensational idea. Yeah, that is great too! I hadn't thought of that myself. And Judge since you are actually at the airport now what do you think about the TSA and some changes that might need to made? You know, I get infuriated. For a long time I would opt out of this nude screening as I call it and I still don't know how much radiation is coming into my body etc., but then the indignity of them literally touching every inch of your body first from the front and then from the back – I get so upset that I now go through the nude screening thing instead. But answer Greg is – I'll give you two answers

40:49 The first is that I was in line to go through TSA, actually in Orange County where they're doing a lot of flying as you can imagine. There was a young man ahead of me, he had a backpack on his back and he had this little emblem, little badge on his backpack. I hadn't learned good enough to see that I didn't want to put my nose on his backpack so I simply said you know what is the badge? He said oh well i work for homeland security. I said okay they make you go through screening too? He said yes and I said let me ask you a question... Is taking my shoes off going to make us safer on this flight? And he looked at me smiled and said something truly notable which is ah! the grand illusion of security. You know, come on it does not make us safer you can look in fact since then I've spoken to a guy that worked for TSA for five years he was actually in civilian clothing and would kind of meander through people and see if anybody looked suspicious they said Judge Gray you can only imagine how much bureaucracy how much waste there is in this GSA so the answer is we'll privatize it

41:47 We will do away with the TSA, privatize it and give the security back to the airlines. They have a vested interest Greg in keeping us safe." To put it mildly is bad press if you have your airplanes falling out of the sky so we will... You can hear I'm getting close. Are you getting called? No, but we can do this! Sorry about that. The answer is that we will bring CS, we will abolish the TSA, privatize it and allow the airlines to oversee the safety of the aircraft. They will do it so that's just one of the things as you hear I'm going to have to get on my plane. Yeah of course! Greg it's a pleasure to talk with you

42:32 Let me just close by saying that I appreciate the opportunity to discuss these issues. We do have answers, you know we didn't talk about healthcare particularly immigration which is a failed system So I can say in summation that Governor Gary Johnson is the most qualified person to be president that I know of. I am really excited by this, it's the most exciting thing that has happened for me since the birth of my children and go back on a final quote from Thomas Jefferson after we finally ratified the constitution was quoted as saying that, look we're going to have to have a revolution every generation in our country. To protect our fragile democracy why? Because the private interests will invigorate way into power and Sapphire vitality and Sapphire strength I deeply believe that the revolution is finally here it's been so many generations and its here in the presence of Governor Gary Johnson at Judge James Grant We will do things bring back to our country that prosperity

43:32 equal opportunity and freedom literally is now skipping through our grasp. So thanks for the opportunity, Greg. I look forward to talking with you again soon and good luck to us all! don't stay home there is an answer you know instead of just bitching from home on the internet let's go out there and try to try to change things so yeah i appreciate it really been in honor appreciate your time so close to be election id also highly suggest that governor johnson yourself reach out to joe rogan and duncan trussell they've got some massively popular podcast and then be a good way to reach the people and combat the media blackout that uh... you guys seem to be

44:14 victims of. But thanks and best of luck, sir! What were you going to say? Certainly thank you and just call my scheduler and we'd love to do it. My life is not my own at the moment but you know who my scheduler is so call her and then we'll see what we can work out once again thank you and good luck to us all. Perfect There you have it people, a vice presidential nominee in a national election taking the time to talk to us on this silly stoner conspiracy show. How can I not vote for him? I hope you feel like I used the time well and asked some good questions that you care about but seriously guys this is not a lesser of two evils situation these guy's really care Of course think for yourself but i've been researching them all week

44:53 We can talk about the integrity of the voting system on another show, but endless cynicism gets you nowhere and Gary Johnson and Jim Gray are brave enough to fight the battle for us if we're willing to spread the word so tweet on people. Here's a great track by a very talented band called The High Cell it's called Underachiever don't be one and I'll catch ya later. C-Crest out I'll regretfully inform you that you're meant for me and you have my sympathy. Be sure to achieve the status that they gave to me, and it seems i'l always be a cheese chain! Why your turd? Cause you possess motivation sanity sustenance word direction. Inform you that you are meant for me And you have my sympathy

46:49 to achieve the status that they gave to me and it seems I'll always be a cheater. You knew that you're meant for me, you have my sympathy and to achieve this it seems i'll always be a cheater. That's your man for me to make a cheat. That's your man for me to achieve a cheater.