Nathan Isaac | High Strangeness In The Penny Royal

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00:51 Which means you'll unfortunately never hear my voice again. 1930s President Franklin Delano Roosevelt addressed the nation through a series of radio broadcast known as the fireside chats His aim was to reassure the common man that society would recover from its troubled times From 1930 and I deal with a different kind of fire For a new era of worldly frustration we offer a- I'm Greg Carlwood These are The Hireside Chats

01:30 Hello again, Hiresite Chatters! From sunny San Diego I'm Greg Carlwood and while the rest of the world trades opinions about Twitter's trending topics and anticipates the decree that they can safely return to the familiar comfort of a baseball stadium today we're gonna wade into the hot bit of weirdness that is the penny royal plateau. If you don't know, and I definitely didn't. The Penny Royal is a large area of Kentucky that is home to a great deal of high strangeness activity abandoned mines the mammoth cave system said to be the largest in the world with an estimated 1,000 miles of underground goodness And it's all right there at the foothills of the Appalachians thought to be one of the world's oldest mountain ranges Well if you spent any sort of time looking into the paranormal You know that one of the key factors in unraveling many of the mysteries is place

02:16 Whether it's ley lines, a potent and emotionally charged history or anomalous qualities to the landscape. When people have high strangeness encounters we should pay extra attention to where they are And with the rich quartz crystal concentration The ancient mountains The history The seclusion and of course the mammoth cave system This corner of Kentucky is well worth our time Here to help us take a deep dive into the Pandora's box of paranormal provocativeness that is spilling out of the penny royal Is Nathan Isaac Nathan is a lifelong fan of Fortean phenomena who turned that love into labor and produced the eight-part Penny Royal podcast series that covers a whole host of strange history, activities, sightings and events in the area. And it is a pleasure to have him here today! The Somerset Seeker Of High Strangeness and Penny Royal Podcaster of Pulaski County...Nathan my man welcome to The Higher Side

03:06 Thanks great man that's awesome dude thanks for having me tonight i'm super excited to talk about all this crazy. Of course of course i'm psyched it is a pleasure to have you here i thought your eight episode pennyroyal podcast was super interesting so many wild threads to talk about bizarre stories that get, well beyond your typical Bigfoot or Silver Ship sighting and I didn't want to give too much away there in the intro so i kept it kind of vague but to dive into this thing for people who really have no context at all what would be a good description of the Pennyroyal area and the qualities that make it so unique? I guess what I usually tell people when we're talking about Pennyroyal, It's an area

03:52 That goes from the Appalachian mountains west through central Kentucky, south central Kentucky to western Kentucky and then up to the bluegrass region where Lexington is. Sort of where all the horse parks are so this particular region is a karst region which makes it pretty unique lots of sinkholes lotsa caves the mammoth cave system is on the western part of it And I guess the biggest feature, the strangest feature and really what kind of started me down the rabbit hole. Of this whole mystery in this area was finding out that actually Pulaski County is the center of what NASA calls The Kentucky Anomaly right? So The Kentucky Anomaly is the largest spike of geomagnetic energy in the Western Hemisphere

04:52 The reason that i found this out the way that i found it out is the dad and reading about sedona people say now the sedona sort of. Less a hot spot for you if those you know there's too much tourism not there anymore but i love sedona at one of my favorite places but, i was reading about it and they were having all these sidings of your phone and read about the courts there's a giant courts deposit beneath sedona And the article i was reading is talking about this really intense geomagnetic field there. I thought you know what i can test this out i can grab some of the satellite imagery, they're called kmz files that nasa and other agencies put out you just drop those files on to google earth so i did it not but let's see if you know it's grabbed the one for geo magnetic

05:46 Intensity and i dropped it in insure enough so don't let up and. An area of southern alaska and then this place in the south east united states was the most intense and at the time i was looking for something in lexington i wasn't actually here to summer said, when is zoomed all the way in There it was the last county was right in the center of what nasa calls the kentucky anomaly. And i thought this is crazy and then a few years later ended up moving down here with my wife and i was like this is crazy you know,

06:25 At the time I didn't know all the other weirdness that's associated with it. But what you find out is that this entire region, that geomagnetic energy centers on Pulaski County and its so intense that the gravity here in this area is different like when you look at NASA maps they have an actual gravity well map and Pulaski County's gravity slightly different than the surface gravity around which is strange ya know? But when you look at the entire royal plateau one thing to know is that the western most reaches of it like i said its man cave. But it's also hopkinsville where the hopkinsville goblins are right and also a good casey is from hopkinsville and then there's a lot of your settings,

07:14 No obviously the man tell signing there's the stanford abductions of the three women in nineteen seventies that just like thirty miles north appear and. Just tons of strangers lots and lots of bigfoot signing scripted sightings and the other thing i will note, that i found in the process researching all this is that there are a number of adena mounds like ancient earthworks from like the hope well culture and then again a culture They really center on the ohio river valley and that's where the serpent mound is ashland kentucky or charles manson is from as a ton of them you know if anybody's read. Peter lavenda sinister forces yes they'll be familiar with the fact that he played on top of those so,

08:06 It was a strange thing when i found out that here in pulaski county that there is an adena mound and that was one of the areas that alot of this strangeness centered around. And it's strange too because its located, theres a highway here where alot of this strangeness occurs at and its highway 39. If anyone has listened to penny royal dan dutton famous kentucky artist he features prominently on the podcast and hes a close friend of mine And what's the start digging into this he was pointed out you know how a thirty nine is one of the oldest roads in america it was part of the great warrior way, no when they were following buffalo traces that's where the name buffalo trace for the berber comes from.

08:55 These ancient american tribes were following these buffalo up through their trails and so one of those roads is how we thirty nine cuts right through here, write past the dean amount right to this intense area in and then that's the other thing to mention the courts in the intro. This area is just there's a heavy concentration of course And I think, you know that a lot of my research too about the Sedona sightings and kind of fed into what we found here was that there's just this weird spike in violence here. A history of violence at Pulaski County and in this region but like extreme violence. And I really wondered...and I still believe that this is true but I wondered if the intense geomagnetic fields, the intense electromagnetic fields

09:48 Coupled with the courts, you know was creating something like a piezoelectric effect or something that was affecting people's minds You know brains there's a high rate of mental illness here. That's sort of unexplained and You know That's a favorite story of mine is it? You know A lot of people we've talked to that have worked at Eastern State which is like the largest mental institution in Kentucky And it's located in Lexington Anytime you bring up last county apparently to the people that work there like what's going on down there because i think the last time we spoke to someone was like seventy percent. Of the people in their work coming from plastic which is strange so it's a weird region and then it's where those things do you know that's the thing about this show. You know that was sort of the goal going into creating penny royal,

10:44 I really wanted to look at the folklore of a place of this place and see the relationship between people in place and how. Place affects the people and other people affect the place and this just turned out to be, Unbelievably weird and like it's just totally strange man. It's just the deeper we dove into this and still yet the deeper we dive into it, The weirder and weirder it gets in the way of just just the stuff we found man I mean you've listened to the show the shit about guitarman all that stuff is just absolutely nuts yes Yes, it does get weird and

11:23 In terms of this anomaly, do they really have any idea what could be the cause of this? Like a comet or meteor impact. Are there other possible suspects as to what's causing this? The only thing you know when you read the NASA research on this it's lithospheric data which is data in the crust of the Earth. The idea that there are some type of deposits deeper in the crust and that the core of the Earth its magnetic field as it spins Is somehow interacting with those deposits to create this but that's why it's called the Kentucky anomaly known nasa really doesn't know why there such an intense spike here. But there is a minute so intense that it causes the van allen belts to dip slightly toward this area, try to touch that magnetic field which is strange yeah it's weird man

12:21 On the subject of why there might be so much weirdness in the area on top of that, Kenneth Grant is one several people to have suggested the Adena or Hopewell tribes are maybe even ancient humans at an even deeper time depth open some type of portal in the area that was never closed and that is a provocative idea but do you know what they're basing that suggestion on? Yes i guess that was one of the strange things here that we found it's like truth is stranger than fiction right. We heard you know what bring this up a few times but sinister forces living dimensions grant in there talking about. The dean mounds and kind of relating that to charles manson and some of the stuff near ashland but,

13:12 There's a story amongst the Cherokee, but also with the Hopewell and the Adina that the priest class that the shamans had opened up. A gateway here in this area well in the area of Kentucky right from where we are sort of over to Ashland and West Virginia and up to where Cincinnati is And that they had opened up this gateway which was a get way to the night side and that that. Gateway was never closed and because of that all these things have been able to penetrate our reality as it were some people say that thats, i talk about the mothman is being apart of that but

13:59 The weird thing that we found which absolutely didn't believe that we were gonna. Encounter this because i heard all the stories about cults and groups here in the area practicing magic or doing various things, what's a still discount you know i don't think there is any like coordinated group but what i did find out whats more interesting is that it was a group in cincinnati of magicians in the 1970s who were led by a woman named neema or that was her magical name. I think maggie angles with her real name and so she was a practitioner of things she was member the originally but, she was part of the typhoon in order of kent grants group and she formed this group in cincinnati called debate cabal

14:59 And they were part of a publication called the Cincinnati Journal of Ceremonial Magic. I was lucky enough to get the entire collection, it's absolutely fascinating but what we found was that she very much believed this Concept and that's really where kenneth grant gets his concept of this portal being opened is gateway being open to hear from neema. And she called it the cincinnati vortex right and then it stretched out into this area, can you send me a message totally unbelievable when you start to find the stuff that she

15:39 And the bay cabal and members of the cable were coming from cincinnati. Down here to pulaski county on the edge of the daniel boone national forest in they were performing rituals that they believe because you know kenneth grant and the bacon ball some of these groups, they believe in this concept of the old ones there are these Prater natural intelligences which i was like this is too much you know after finding all the stuff that we found in pennyroyal. To come across this and find out who truly believed that there are these beings but they were performing time magic here, in this area to prevent these intelligences from penetrating our reality it's crazy

16:29 But she's really the reason why Kenneth Grant believes that and she believed it because the Cherokee also have stories about this. Apparently something happened that was horrible enough to cause the Cherokee tribes to kill all of their priests in one night, and that's a thing that has popped up again and again. I don't know if its related to this specifically but this idea of that gateway over top of Kentucky. But it's so strange how it lines up with the whole Kentucky anomaly research too, right? That here you have the largest spike in geomagnetic energy in the Western Hemisphere and a story about a rift in space and time that is allowing these things to come across. So it's weird. It's just weird how it lines up, you know? Yes! Well, we're off to the races now!

17:25 So I also wanted to step back to a weird little story that you talk about in the first episode. Uh, I guess it would be called the Kentucky meat shower of 1876 one of the weirdest things that I have heard in a long time but tell people about this as an example of the kind of anomalous stuff that seems to happen in this area Yes so the first time i heard of that obviously if anybody's familiar with charles sport and forty in phenomena you know the book of the damned new lands he records a lot of stories about. Sky falls which is the proper term yes you know but falls fish balls frogs those are sort of things

18:18 The most uncommon obviously probably in the history of forty and phenomena is this story from olympia springs which is the first time i heard about this. Olympia springs kentucky and forget the name of the couple off the top my head but this is a late eighteen hundreds and they were there backyard Suddenly there was this rain of meat from the sky and so they're really large chunks. Of meat what they identified as me and they could explain what it was or what came from their neighbors came over i think it rained for like five ten minutes steady so there's a larger man is mean and so strangely enough some people tasted which i don't know if i would have been sold to taste

19:13 Meet the father of the sky but these people tasted it and they said that it tasted like a lot of it was lost to time but a piece of it was actually kept at transylvania university which ends up being. the place that I went to college. And at the time, I didn't know in their special collections that they actually had a vial of the Kentucky meat shower that they preserved and if I had a god, I would have gone there but at the time I guess I just wasn't doing all this research 20 years ago so it was fun to find out it was there my alma mater you know? But I'd known about them obviously from research with

19:56 40 and phenomena, but while I was talking to Dan Dutton here in Pulaski County And we're talking about the strange things that happened You know on highway 39 and in the area of campground Road. I mentioned The Kentucky meat shower and that's when Dan was like well We've had those things happen here too you know that there have been frog falls and meet fall from this guy and his parents had told stories about This happening in the early 1900s. And it's just another one of those strange things where you're finding out about the Kentucky Anomaly and these Adena mounds, and this weird high strangeness and portals and gateways. Now someone is telling you there is a long history of weird shit falling out of the sky here in Pulaski County. Definitely in Kentucky there is no denying that a well-documented meat shower

20:54 Something that's hard not you know the hearts of your mom right yeah for sure. I have always been fascinated by those sky falls as you say. I think that's why Magnolia remains a pretty decent movie on my list even though the rest of it is kind of slow, but have they ever figured out what that is? The best conventional explanation which isn't even good is that tadpoles would get sucked up in the water cycle and then fall from the clouds later I guess but have you ever heard of a better explanation for that

21:30 The accepted explanation by scientists which i don't believe this is not on board with this but. The conventional theory is that a flock of vultures and vulture apparently vomit often, Influx so the thinking is that they killed something and even carry in. And as they were flying over the farm the entire flock began to vomit the meat that they need and that's what this is you know that's accepted that is the accepted

22:06 View to explain this by science swamp gas swamp gas explanation. Well, you know what the other interesting thing too is this idea of star jelly right? Yeah and There was a book that a guy wrote I wish it now now that we're talking about this I'm like, oh, I wish I could remember the name of it but it was about his attempts, he believed that there were these weird creatures that lived in the upper atmosphere. And he would go up in a hot air balloon and attempt to find them. Apparently he says he did find them, but he's seen them with babies and they look like these see-through amoebas. Ever since I knew about that story in that book, I've always thought

22:54 Is it just a dead one of those what does exploded in the sky somehow you know and that's what this is but i'm not asking him like it is strange when he was just one of those weird things. You can also think about a portation when an object drops out of the air, and then that somehow this is related to bad but i don't know i just think its another one of those weird things that This area is just rife with those kinds of things. And weird spatial distortions, weird time anomalies and all of those things just... I don't know that it's just why do things like that cluster in places like this? But definitely i think the meat shower is and the sky falls have been reported here especially are just

23:43 a part of that phenomenon somehow right well as interesting as stuff from above is i'm always fascinated with stuff from below and you mentioned the hopkinsville goblins a story from nineteen fifty five it's probably one of the most well known weirdness stories from the area but in the effort of, leaving no child behind what can tell people about that particular story cuz it is quite weird. You know i say most people know the story of the sudden farm in hawkinsville that they saw a light in the sky and then for the rest of the night this family was besieged by these tiny little goblins creatures. And the strangest thing though which doesn't sort of jive with other stories of alien encounters,

24:38 They actually came into conflict with these creatures and we're shooting at them and so whenever they hit one of them, they would spin in the air and there was a sound as if. The bullet metal that's a strange detail i've always thought it was weird I would say this is one of the most documented, if not the most widely accepted actual encounters with something strange. There were so many witnesses law enforcement was involved you know they end up having the sheriff come to the farm he sees all these sh- like they obviously were shooting at something They at least believe something was attacking them and so that is the origin

25:27 of the term little green men. It comes from that encounter, it ended up in the paper. Now there's a belief that these creatures that were encountered could have been a UFO crash of some sort and so they came to farm, they encountered the Sutton family and then they go down into a cave on sorta back side of that families farm And, you know as you kind of spin forward there was this idea that maybe they entered the Mammoth Cave system that stretches all the way across Kentucky and somehow have existed there. You know it increased in number possibly and then obviously people are familiar with Hellier or any of the sightings of...and not just Hellier though their stories of these little creatures that come out caves

26:28 This idea of Tommy knockers in the coal mines people call these things all kinds of different names but it's really fascinating that sort of. That very early ufo encounter also is tied to a number of sightings with sort of caves and kentucky and also i will point this out that is the only you if o side slash encounter that is officially reported by the CIA. The CIA sent a guy named John Mulholland, who was a stage magician to investigate and file an actual report on the Hopkinsville Goblet encounter which is totally crazy

27:17 Yeah it definitely is and i wanted to lay that out so that we could mention what happens in hell year cuz for people who haven't seen the hell your series kicks off with a similar story from twenty twelve of a guy who was so desperate for help with this kind of situation he reached out to local paranormal investigation group instead these little green creatures were coming out of my night on his property and tapping on his kids windows and just generally freaking them out And that show, Hellier is a wild ride that for me I didn't really feel like it ever really reached the heights of that first episode. And I don't feel like it really stuck the landing but that story is still super interesting and it turns out that both places where these goblin creatures emerged 57 years apart are on the surface in different areas but they are both connected underground by that mammoth cave system right? Right yeah

28:15 And see the thing too about Somerset, Pulaski County because of the karst geology here. We have what's called the Sloan Valley Cave System it's the 13th or 14 largest cave system in the United States and actually connects with the Mammoth Cave System you know in different parts all this stretches eastward all the way to the eastern tip of state where Hellier is The town of Hellyer It's actually a suburb of elkhorn city i love it and in terms of evidence there is also an at least some of these cases. Three toad footprints the next morning when people come out to investigate right that something, yeah man that's the strangest thing too i mean obviously that's what tell your focus is a lot on these three toad footprints if anyone has read. The rebirth of pan by jim brandon who was really

29:13 William grimstead who is a very controversial character author i've heard you say that before would you mind elaborating on what he said the so controversial i just find myself like a moth to a flame attracted to the word controversial and what might be hiding behind it. Well i mean this is part of whats come out in our investigation too pennyroyal which is kind of its just crazy how all this is connected but, I've always been fascinated by and a fond fan and reader of James Shelby Downard. Sort of the grand old man conspiracy theory, i think alot of people that talk about ideas like mystical toponomy synchromysticism all these things. A lot of people don't realize it goes back to down right? And there's this idea

30:10 That possibly downer is a literary invention and that he was the literary invention of michael hoffman who's very well known. I hate saying conspiracy theorist but you know i guess, you know he is a conspiracy theories but better term yet yeah but michael hoffmann and also another gentleman named william grimstead bill brimstead Now bill grim said when grim said also wrote under the name jim brand so he wrote a book called weird america and then also this other book which became a big part of hell year call the rebirth of pain. Which covers you know all this stuff about yeah,

31:00 Grimstead, as Jim Brandon was in Kentucky quite a bit. And this is another one of those things you know I'm a huge fan of Downard and digging into this and then suddenly I find out these guys were here You know here in Kentucky that Downard lived and grew up in Kentucky That Downard went to college 30 miles 40 miles north of Somerset at Center College right? In the 1930's You find out that when you said he is the guy that created this concept of a lot yet factor, are there any factors. That places with the name fayette like lafayette or county which is where lexington is all these different places that there's this inherent weirdness attached to that name. So then he goes and so idea power names in inside it there's an ancient sort of

31:55 Spirit to the land here in america and then he talks about the three-toed footprints. And how those relate to this idea of the green man of pan of sunneros you know the horn god so anyway all those things are fascinating there it's media material for forty researchers anyone that's interested in high strangeness Well, he's writing these books as Jim Brandon. When you dig into who William Grimstead is, you find out that he and Hoffman were part of the American Nazi party and that these guys were Holocaust deniers. That Grimstead was the editor in Hoffman too we're working pushing some very racist ideas and very anti-Semitic ideas

32:51 And i think that's one of the things to do. The idea of king kill thirty three that jfk assassination made been some type of killing at the king ritual right which is a fascinating thing to think about in symbolism that's attached you definitely talk people it, you know we're familiar with that and love your listeners are but a lot of people even when you think back to downer When he published that article, Michael Hoffman was the co-author and really I think probably the author. And then Grimstead is involved in a lot of the publishing as the co-author in a lot of Downard material so it's if they're using downer whether existed or not which is another thing that we're working on there nonetheless exist this undercurrent of fascism

33:42 you know, and anti-Semitism and racism that is part and parcel of their beliefs about this quote spirit of the landscape. Right? That I think has to be taken into account when considering their ideas of high strangeness. So it's just one of those things that I think you have to address it definitely in the second season of Pennyroyal When it comes out and we've got most of it done, It deals with that. It deals with our investigation down there but you have to address those things. You keep finding those things and I think you have to talk about those things because you don't want give a platform to those underlying ideas

34:28 Because obviously grimson Hoffman no doubt believe that the ancient culture of America, right? That laid the foundation of all this mysticism was an Aryan group. So you know it's fascinating man I'm telling you but also it's like I dig into this stuff and then I find out that Downard is in Fort Thomas Kentucky you know that's where his family was really located it strange to this isn't a podcast but no that's where the most famous murder in american history up through the eighteen hundred happened there was the murder of pearl brian.

35:07 Where bobby mack is where they decapitated this girl there's hundreds of balance about this and all took place right we're down it is right with this bastion like high strangeness. Is any money went to school here thirty miles forty miles north of somerset here's the sky, Right the center of all the weirdness yeah that is wild and i figured it had to have something to do with race because what else would be that uncomfortable talk about anymore but hey living in a conspiracy world you're gonna deal with these kind things will say that too that's one other things. Penny royal when i started working on his back and we started two thousand seventeen really the recordings began january two thousand eighteen right

35:57 At the time i was interviewing all these people none of the q and on stuff. Are the ideas like pizza gate at least really prominent and as i near, the completion of the podcast in there is that weird cold element to the story that's undeniable you know it's what tell me what's like making it up with some real Thread of the folklore here this idea of these cults right and I was terrified that i was going to release the podcast in the midst of this environment media environment and that qanon or. An extremist group would latch on to pennyroyal and then use it as evidence kids were being held in the caves in kentucky you know,

36:51 I guess that would be a valid concern actually now that i think about some of the material that you end up getting into and on the subject of cults there is apart where you talk to, a woman named pamela richards who says she was brought up in pulaski county and was brought up in a cold when she was a child. Apparently during some ritual events she was covered in blood she was given drugs. She was taught to sacrifice animals alive and she would hear their screams at night, and on at least one occasion she claims human sacrifices were made in their bodies were cut up and taken to the mouth of a cave by kids in a ritual procession I mean these are some pretty hardcore claims but she is not the only one saying stuff like this is she? Yeah that's

37:43 For me that was the turning point in the whole mystery of the pinning royal mystery is. I started researching all this stuff because we moved down here i was driving around the town square it's kind of a circle let you go round And there was this group of people with the signs that they were holding up towards city hall and the sign said, you know you did it. So I thought why in the world is this? This is crazy so I get back to the house and talking my neighbors asking like hey you know I saw this really crazy group of people downtown

38:30 And they got the signs and what's going on so they tell me about these murders this unsolved murders that happened in nineteen ninety four very high profile murders date line came here in two thousand nineteen is the twenty fifth anniversary. It was Linda Gibson and Cody Garrett. And she was 21, he was four and a half, he was her half brother. They were last seen on the 4th of July 1994 getting into a car. Then they were found three days later mutilated on the city limits. It's really strange case anybody can look this up but like I said it has been covered by some true crime stuff in Dateline

39:17 She actually lived down the street from us and the place they were last seen is literally around the corner from my house right. So, they're telling a story there saying that it's connected to this cult here in town right but there is this cold it's an eyes wide shut sort of motif. It's the upper crust the patriarchs of the five richest families are part of this thing and it goes deep into the you know that they're having these sex parties, and there's drugs and Ritualism people are in robes. And I thought this is absolutely bonkers right like there's no way not to Not to say anything disparaging the area but I was like You know There's no way that these country bumpkins are Worshipping some type of elder gods or doing anything of that sort right? And I just thought you know There's no way and definitely in

40:11 Researching this deeper i found out that the story of the rich and told was actually an amalgamation three different murders here in town. Now to talk about are definitely they absolutely happen but it's time to hold like a separate weirdness anyway i'm fed up with those i heard about those, Stories tied to this cold and I for the most part once we dug into researching it had decided there's no cult. This is just local rumor so this like twin peaks you know element to how people think about things in other people empower our doing these terrible things to be able well that's when the hell your crew shows up so great new car comes comes to town

41:03 He knows kyle could there's a friend of mine who runs the this is strange to you know how many towns have a paranormal museum. Yeah and so here we are with cockadell in there says international parallel museum and he would go these conventions and meeting greg and dana newkirk because they also were on the convention circuit And so after hillier come out they contacted me talk to a few times and they said they were in the area. They came by to interview just about can't eat it now we're shooting second season of the show. So that's your buddy should talk too. And he told him that you know you should talk to nathan because he is researching all stuff is gonna be stories on this phone call about the area,

41:50 And so they contacted me and we met in our studio above Jarflap Brewing. Greg asked me about the weird stuff, and I told him all stories of high strangeness and all that. He said well what do you think is going on? Let me tell you about the darker stuff right let me tell you about the crime. So i told them all the criminal stories some of the stuff i just told you but other things too. That's when he That's what he told me that they had been contacted, but no one knew this. But they had been contacted by a woman in Somerset telling them that there was this cult here and that they were killing children and all of us just totally crazy stuff. But what he was telling me it was the same stuff that we had heard from Pamela. And there were three other women with the same stories here in town right?

42:45 Now, Pamela did point out that there was one other woman that had exactly the same memories as her. But they both shared the same psychiatrist which is suspect this is exactly the time of the satanic panic and I'm not saying nothing happened to Pamela obviously she suffered trauma you know now that was one of the most difficult things to record Of the show and something that i never tackle before was sort of the ethics of how do we approach you know because that is definitely a part of folklore here someone. That really wanted to tell us her story how you can't because it's very sensitive material. I said she absolutely believes those things happened but anyway greg newkirk is telling me,

43:38 Literally that there's a woman that I don't know, but i haven interviewed. That has contacted them telling them the same story about cults and green men and all this crazy shit well thats scared me to death man because then i thought what if we are you know for me at that point it was kinda still fun and we were like looking on local crime in high strangeness and he tells me that i think What if there really is something going on here? And what if we're poking our nose in it and we shouldn't be. So that definitely freaked me out, and they left you know after that I told Darian and Kyle or the co-producers of the show That maybe we should just stop doing this because like I have zero interest in trying to solve murders right leave that to the police We did sort of let it cool down for a while but its one of those things

44:36 We looked at it again and we couldn't stop looking at it. And honestly talking to you know that was what's so weird was the intersection between hell year, and penny royal was so strange because I was working with dan dot this very well known artist in america but also super famous kentucky artists On a documentary about an experience he had while making one of his offers called the phone about pain right. And i'm filming a documentary with him about experiencing head and elkhorn city kentucky where he feels like he encountered the archetype pan and then hell your comes out

45:26 It turns out that summer said is actually like the last half of the show of the second season and they are researching pain you dan dot ns opera cycle his four part opera cycle which is really famous kt film. Is called the secret commonwealth in the episode that i'm in the eighth episode where they really reveal all the summer system is called secret commonwealth. And so it dan wearing had this encounter and help when city you know that we're going to reproduce artistically his opera dance opera in break center state park,

46:08 To see if we can invoke that experience again for him not really the salmon pan but in a sense someone paying an artistic way right and. That's the finale of the film and then the finale of, hell your second season they attempt to perform a ritual someone paying here in pulaski county in the caves right where. All of this weird shit has been happening centered in that part of the county and i was just like this is totally nuts,

46:44 And i texted greg that morning and i'm like dude, i'm working on this film with dan dotton and that's when greg says to me text me back is like i am looking at dan doton. On my wall he didn't make it in the second season because i just don't know how this guy. That was so tired of pain fit into all this and it was just one of those weird things its like No matter what you think about their researcher or we're researching it's an incredibly strange intersection. It's just beyond coincidence that they came from hell your kentucky which is elkhorn city it's a separate city. Who summer said and ended up trying to send pan in original the cave and then not unbeknownst to them we're working on film where we went to elkhorn city hell year,

47:39 To restate his phone opera to in the pan and it's just so strange you know i mean outside of all the other stuff it's like. Incredibly odd right well when you read a lot of these books and. Articles from paranormal high strangers investigators they often find themselves being part of the mystery that get hit with so much synchronicity it feels like something is leading them along, seems like you felt that as well and to Talk about some of the lighter stuff again be goblins are obviously very fascinating but there's also another weird one in episode two were you talk about a couple who saw, some sort of man to rate creature undulating or sort of swimming through the sky it was also transparent naked see stars in the night sky through its body that is pretty out there.

48:41 And that's probably one of my favorite stories of this area right that's an official move on report. That submitted to them. 2005 i can't think of the top and bottom is two thousand five but it was recent you know last twenty years fifteen twenty years that yeah couple in burnside which is just, Five miles south like somerset sort of stretches into birdside you know it's one of those old towns. That when they built the lake here that's the other thing that's hearing plastic county is late coming which at what point was largest man made lake east of mississippi river,

49:24 Burnside was one of those towns that was flooded and ended up moving the entire town up to higher ground which is kind fascinating the town itself it's still under water so if you die under the lake you can still see the layout of the town. And all the streetlights and there are always crazy ghost stories about. The people seeing in their boats beneath them the street lights coming on which i love that story you know it's just you know it's full work so burnside. That's where they saw this couple come home and things after midnight and they saw,

50:04 In the sky this flying what they described as a man to ray creature you know ufo that they can see through and see the stars. And it was undulating flying in the sky what's fascinating about this is that those same sightings are reported on the west coast of united states frequently and There's a farm in the northwest god i can't think of the name of it but the guy guarantees that you're going to. Is any is it the east city ranch james gilliland yes yes james guillaume and yes so one of the hosts of coast to coast was in my gym church not just church but i think what are the guys that some customers,

50:58 Had a siding wall at the ranch of one of these flying manta rays Which that was the first time I never heard it was on coast to coast and then you find The same type of siding reported to move on here in Somerset And it's within 1 mile of a place called alien grave mountain where this guy claims in 1963 there was a UFO crash And it's telling that span is a totally crazy story but i love that that's one of my favorite. Signings anything ufo or sky creature see that harkens on what we're just talking about the idea of these,

51:41 Translucent things in the upper atmosphere you know what is it a ufo was living you a phone or was it one of these creatures that come down to close to the earth. Yeah wonder and so you end this series asking people to look into their own places where they are and find the mystery of their place have you got any interesting feedback in that regard i mean definitely people have been I think that resonated heavily with people, which it should. I mean, I'm going to mention this—I hope it's all right to mention this because I talked to Tim Renner about this a bit on Strange Familiars, right? Because I think Richard Spence who did Agent 666 and Empire of the Will with Walter Bosley with those San Bernardino murders

52:39 I mentioned this whole idea of like, is this stuff happening everywhere? And Richard Spence was sort of the mindset. Yeah it is happening everywhere. It was happening in my town, it was happening in San Bernardino and when I talked to Tim Renner though about this and we were talking about folklore and the connection between people and place and looking at your own hometown he mentioned that he had done an experiment about Whether or not you could just pick a random town and find all this stuff So he did that experiment and he didn't find anything And so it's like I think everyone everywhere should dig into their talent and find That folklore and find those stories that form this sort of underlying strata what makes the place interesting but also what is

53:40 Makes that place influence people you know people don't realize how much. Influences their own personal identity, Because you are sort of where you live in a way and also that place is what it is because if u. And the stories utah and the stories that everybody tells that lives there right so this weird interplay and so i think anybody wherever you are if you listen to this, you should dig deeper into where you live because your gonna find your gonna find something interesting

54:17 Are you gonna find something? I will say, i think there are very few places with as much weirdness as this place. And that's what Timothy was saying is that there are certain places like Toad Road or Skinwalker Ranch where it's like those places are these Concentrations of high strangeness and i think this is one of those places but you can't find that, no where if u are in one of those places until you start asking those questions any start digging any start looking at where he live because ultimately

55:03 Where we all are, there are fascinating things. I just think people should value folklore more and value understanding how the place that you live in affects you and how do you affect that place? That's why Penny Roll, the tagline to it is a magic and mystery of place because I just think that's a worthwhile thing to engage Yeah cheers to that man well said i do agree having done the show for ten years. You can start to try to think of creative ways to cover things and one of the biggest hits has been, who do deep dives with local researchers about the place they live weather it's phoenix arizona or the susquehanna river or philadelphia for various reasons

55:58 People who just have the eyes to see can pick up on a whole lot of amazing stuff and. No let's just add this to the list i mean this is a great one and kentucky of all places one of the few states i don't know if ever even been too, just pretty crazy and i do think with some other weird possible nazi ties it's like where do you go to do this stuff when u been blown up so high on the radar. You gotta go where nobody is you go these compounds in argentina go to the middle of, can talk it's crazy but i think that strategically that would make sense and for us to be learning about that a few decades later wouldn't be the weirdest thing in the world so i think he did great

56:46 Podcast series man is really fun to hear all the various interviews stacked up the way you did it solid production value, before we go anything else to tell people before we call then you know get a podcast wherever podcasts are found your doing season two what else do i want. Yeah yeah she's gonna be coming out september twenty first will be done this summer We've got a Patreon called the Liminal Watch, but you can just look us up. Penny Royal on Patreon find this secret Facebook page as part of the liminal watch we're doing all kinds of research on random number generators and if you listen to podcasts like there's a lot stuff that were researching because we do all this data science test some of these theories about cybernetics and about observational

57:41 Qualities of magic and things in really we're just all digging into this mystery together and. All the research all the newspaper articles all the shit we've gotten from the FBI like cia documents like everything we come across everything we found, where providing it to this community and they're giving us a movie that is for since november you know so God, it's been fantastic man so if anybody wants to help us dig more into this and try to Dig through all these documents and understand the mystery of what's happening here on the penny royal definitely check out our patreon and check out the website and Hopefully they'll tune in for season two there was just so much that we couldn't include in season one. That was part of the mystery that I

58:33 It just gets weird, man. The longer we look at it the weirder it gets Amen man my business is weird and businesses good so you put on an awesome show i am psyched to see it continue. And i had a blast talking to me hopefully we can do this again but keep doing what you do out there in tell the system i wish him well. Do thank you again so much for having me tonight ma'am totally love the show. And also just thanks for having me that's fantastic. Too kind, my pleasure. Well enjoy the evening man! Have a good one! Thanks man you too Mountain mama yes that was certainly a wild ride high strangeness in the penny royal meat showers goblins portals subterranean cults what more could a person want

59:30 I honestly just never really knew much about this area. I've never been to Kentucky, but the more i think about the landscape and the mammoth cave system and the foothills of The Appalachians... ...the remoteness, the large amount of quartz crystal it's a pretty perfect place for weirdness! I do like doing paranormal episodes or things that get into cryptids but sometimes the stories are just so similar that you feel like you heard it before With this one I think we were able to highlight a lot of stories that don't fit the typical mold. Like that old Kentucky Meat Shower of 1876, I can't get over that one! And of course The Hopkinsville Goblins is a wild story as is the very similar story that kicked off The Hellyer Series and when that came out a lot of THC fans wrote me and said dude you gotta watch Hellyer it's right up your alley but um

1:00:29 For me, I was a little underwhelmed. I loved that first episode but after that it just didn't feel that exciting It started to feel like your typical paranormal investigators show to me Stretching things to make them more interesting Really straining to shoehorn in some synchronicity This is what happens in the studio production process But we did have Alan Greenfield on THC around the time that Hell Year was coming out. And even though his secret cipher of the UFOnauts is a big part of the show, His book is really great and it stands on its own and sits right in that sweet spot of occult summoning of quote-unquote alien beings blurring the lines as we like to do Man I thought that was a good book and Alan was a great interview

1:01:26 As was Nathan Isaac. I'm pretty happy with the show today, big thanks to him! Great show to release just a day after my birthday how about that? What do i want for my birthday? I want messages about strange experiences and wild theories at thehighersidechats.com slash voicemail I'm going out of town this weekend but I'm coming back doing that joint session before March ends and I need those messages Content is king, people. And for the joint sessions that's really whatever you decide to send my way What else would I want for my birthday? Oh, I don't know! I guess I would just want YOU to treat yourself to a plus subscription How thoughtless of me right?!

1:02:13 What a guy I am. But i also wanted to mention updates and additions to the THC forum! I just added groups so people are able to form their own groups now which, I think will help some people form connections in the community better than just forum threads. And I added the live chat rooms as well One of them you can just pop in and just talk to whoever's there, and one is going to be accompanied by the WTHC 24-7 radio live stream. And that in my mind makes for a good prompt for conversation and an interesting live group listening experience for THC which is kind of a new way to do the thing I'm spending more time there

1:02:59 I think it's pretty clear it has improved a lot in the last 60, 90 days. And it's going to keep getting better because I really think that that's probably the next step for this thing. I'm going to do the same show I always have done and people are here for that but also think it's important to network and come together with like-minded people particularly at this time so I want to make it easy for you guys too do that I figured let's just do it in our own system rather than jumping from platform to platform. But yes, i'm trying to get this chat up...I can see it on my screen but I might not have configured it correctly because I put a few test messages in there and nobody's responded so it must be hidden for non-admins but I did say in there the first person to respond

1:03:58 The fact that no one did, I guess probably people can't see it yet. But keep an eye out on that! I'm gonna go through the settings toggle things left and right you know how it goes? And uh... It should pop up there then someone can claim that prize Yes nathan really pulled together a lot of great stuff for season one of his penny royal podcast not only paranormal activity but this weird life of alexander to term the sky who. Beneath is cover story might have been an ex nazi officer, i don't even think we talked about this part in the interview but apparently at one point he flew to la drove out to roswell kidnapped a baby and took it to the philippines and that was before i think, he was charged with the largest stock manipulation in history up to that point. And then he gets out of jail and buys a mine in rural kentucky okay just wild

1:04:59 And then I think it was in the plus show, but Nathan mentioned he would tell me a little bit more off air. And yeah there's a decent amount more to the story and i hope he tells the rest of the world in season two but it is not my place to say If you're only hearing the first free hour of the higher side chats, you're missing half the show. Sign up for PLUS, throw me a few bones and get yourself the full THC Plus experience! Just in this episode we talked about the Oakwood clinics occult activities, the channeling of The Nine MKUltra and the abuse of clairvoyance and seers

1:05:38 What nathan has learned about magic the connections between binary and definition that really blew my mind. Add a real contender to the meat shower story the back cyst ball bearing incident, You plus people know what I'm talking about, but i always try to keep my interviews action-packed focused on the material. They're always commercial free. I want to make the best show I can for you guys so that it's worth the price of a subscription and we both win without any advertisers! So help me help you get access to the private RSS feed. You don't have to listen to the show from my website. You can use most podcast players like you're doing right now

1:06:24 Anyway, the very top link in your show notes should take you right there. But I suppose that's a wrap! Really wild stories... Interesting area.... Who knows how an area gets weird to begin with but it certainly stacking up in Kentucky Take care guys much love and thanks for listening I've done my part Your move cave goblins meet showerers and paranormal portal openers of the pennyroyal You're fucking Woke up this morning with light in my eye and then realized it was dark outside. It was like coming down from the sky. Must be those strangers that come every night whose saucers shaped a light, put people

1:07:36 uptight leave blue green footprints that glow in the dark i hope they get home mr spaceman won't you please take me along do anything wrong hey babe won't you please take me along the high side woke up this morning

1:08:25 I was feeling quite weird. I had flies in my beard, My toothpaste was smeared. I opened my window they'd written my name Said so long we'll see you again Hey Mr. Spaceman won't you please take me along Won't do anything wrong Hey, won't you please take me along the higher side Mr. Spaceman, won't you please take me along I won't do anything wrong Hey, Mr. Space, won't you please take me along the higher side

1:09:47 Won't you please take me along the high side?