Dr. Heather Lynn | Sitchin’s Anunnaki Inc., Archeology as Espionage, & TikTok Blood Witches

00:00 Well, here goes nothing with another new episode of THC, truly independent of any outside sponsors, networks, agents, or conflicts of interest of any kind. I've got no strings on me. As always, the first hour is free, and the full two-hour show is for Plus members. And can you believe it? Right now, you can get a seven-day free trial at THC Plus, and it doesn't even require you to put in a credit card. Just grab the link from the show notes or that QR code if you're watching on YouTube. It'll take you to the higher sidechats.com. Put in only your email address, and I'll send you a username and password to access the full archive of extended interviews and bonus shows going back to 2010. You can hear more about it after the show. There's other details and all that stuff. Lots of wild taboo material to be dug up in there.

00:42 Don't say I didn't warn you. Enjoy. The Highest Side Chat Show Critical World Common. Well, praise be to He. So say we all. This is the way. From the Sunshine State, I'm Greg Carlwood, and the mind control machine has never been more sophisticated. Nor have the tactics of a Pandora's box of ideologically motivated cults and hidden networks hell-bent on gaining market share in the realm of ideas for whatever backwards philosophy gives them the excuse to be in charge or claim souls for another subversive spirit god. We have to navigate so many mental landmines on our path to discovering whatever spirituality, true history, and the human experience looks like to us, despite the hidden agendas, unadvertised motivations, and weaponized applications of many things that, left alone on their own, wouldn't be so bad.

01:31 What can you do but keep your head up and watch out for the red flags of corruption and inversion, as well as many of the winding paths towards the weird pseudo-Christian Zionist technosis digital black cube rapture they seem to be pushing the herd towards. Well, here to talk about all these things and more for a third time is my friend and yours, Dr. Heather Lynn. You know her as a historian tracing the occult architecture beneath the human story right on through to modern power. She is the creator of the ever popular substack titled The H-Files, as well as the Midnight Academy podcast and the author of five books, including Baphomet Revealed, Evil Archaeology, The Anunnaki Connection, and Anunnaki Revelation.

02:10 Her forthcoming book is Codex Machina: How AI is Decoding Ancient Civilizations, Technologies, and Lost Languages in Our Search for Meaning. And we are really going for it today out of the Kurt Metzger Turning Point 2.0 text chain and into the fire. The ancient civilization scholar, broker class critic, and academic double agent, Dr. Heather Lynn. Welcome back. Hey, that was a great introduction. I hope I can live up to the hype. Oh, you can. You can. I know it's going to be a good day when you're here. You've been on fire with the H-files. So many good articles lately. Dollar store gooners and classic blood facials. I mean, you hit them on both sides. You got to have equal coverage for men and women that are both crazy.

02:54 Hard to really know where to start, but the one that got us talking about doing another interview was this two-parter, The Great Deception, breaking down how the entire Zachariah Stitchin, I say Stitchin, people hate it. It's Sitchin. I know what it is, but I can't help myself. But the entire Zachariah Sitchin ancient aliens narrative, it's a psyop apparently aimed at promoting Jewish supremacy to the alternative crowd. And I was so ready because many of us can see that ancient aliens has kind of been artificially inflated and basically taken over the history channel. And you start this one by saying the following is the most in-depth H-file I've written so far.

03:35 The argument is this: The Anunnaki story, as popular culture depicts it, the Virgin Zachariah Sitchin branded but did not invent, is a 20th century construction resting on two older layers most of its consumers have never examined. The first is a 19th century scholarly project built to vindicate the Bible with a spade and artifacts. The second is a wartime intelligence apparatus that turned that scholarship into statecraft and helped draw the borders of modern Iraq. Titchin himself belongs to the third layer, and so does a curious errand of his involving President Harry Truman and the only signed copy of America's recognition of Israel.

04:18 Spicy stuff. So give us some of the background on Stitchin because people will be surprised to hear how involved he was with the Zionist cause before any of the Anunnaki stuff came into the picture. Yeah, I mean, if you look up his name in different sources, particularly in Israel and abroad, he's known for the Zionism and not so much the Anunnaki books. It's usually a little byline, like an afterthought, like, oh, and he was also an author of interesting topics that question our place in the universe. So they don't even go on a deep dive there on, like, well, it's about the aliens. All right. So they try to prop him up as somebody a little more trustworthy in that regard.

05:00 But yeah, he was born in Azerbaijan, but he was actually raised in the British Mandate for Palestine, which was the League of Nations mandate administered under the United Kingdom from like 1920 to 1948. Its whole purpose, that region, for anyone unfamiliar, was to facilitate the establishment of a Jewish national home. You know, so putting down a foundation, right? And so he was from the very beginning this advocate for Zionism. His wife was too. I mean, this was something that brought them together. So he was involved in promoting Israel. He was the founding director of the American Israel Chamber of Commerce and Industry because he was actually an economic historian.

05:42 He studied economics in London. So that was kind of a core of what he was interested in. He was also the chair of the American Israel Pavilion at the New York World's Fair, which was kind of interesting. And his wife did a whole lot of things too. But the thing that got me sort of more intrigued than ever was this particular document that I came across, which was this Truman document. While preparing for this American Israel Pavilion from this world, this fair that he was doing, he met with the Truman Library and he had this copy of this press release, essentially, that was stating that the United States recognized Israel as a

06:26 legitimate state. So all it was was a press release. It was just like kind of roughly typed. It was from May 14th, 1948. Immediate release. It says statement by the president. This government has been informed that a Jewish state has been proclaimed in Palestine and recognition has been requested by the provisional government thereof. The United States recognizes the provisional government as the de facto authority of the new state of Israel. And that was it. That was all that was ever done about Israel. And so, you know, I mean, that was a very interesting document. And his goal was to actually get it signed by the president so that it would be an official document, which he did.

07:09 He took a copy of it to Truman and it was signed in 1965. And so that became the actual signed recognition of the state of Israel from the United States. And that was like the guy who wrote about the Anunnaki. And it's just kind of funny because it's kind of, it's a big deal. It's that is in a museum now. It was auctioned off. There is a letter that was sent out in recognition from the Embassy of Israel in 1987. And that document is available too. I have that on my sub stack, but it's also available from the archives of the museum because it's real. All this is real. And it says, Dear Mr. Sitchin, thank you very much for your letter of July 28th.

07:53 I read with great interest your vivid recollection of your meeting with President Truman in 1965. We most certainly would be honored to accept your kind offer to loan us your copy of President Truman's instrument of recognition. It would be our intention to place the document on public display here at our embassy for the duration of Israel's upcoming 40th anniversary year. In this way, it would serve as a living symbol of the closeness and friendship that frames this special relationship between our two countries. My colleagues at our embassy will contact you by in the near future so that we can finalize arrangements concerning this matter.

08:32 Once again, permit me to thank you on behalf of the Embassy of Israel for your interest in joining with us in making Israel's 40th anniversary. And that is from the Embassy of Israel in Washington, D.C., August 28th, 1987. So this is he, these are very, these are primary source documents documenting his active involvement in making sure that the state of Israel was recognized by the United States and elsewhere. And so on one hand, you could say, oh, that's great. You know, he was working for political cause he believed in, et cetera. Maybe that's different from his work with the so-called, you know, Anunnaki and whatever they're doing there.

09:10 And it's, you know, so you can make a lot of, I guess, apologies for that. But I think you have to kind of look a little deeper then into the history of the field of sumerology and Assyriology to begin with. And then you also have to consider, too, looking at the trajectory of Sitchin's, shall we say, ministry on the topic. His very last lecture was actually about Jerusalem and how important it is that we make sure Jerusalem stays protected and because it's like part of where the chosen people were from and where they're going to be back. And essentially, he's saying the Anunnaki were those people. They're the ones that are coming with that noble blood again and they're going to be back there.

09:53 And he's making all of of these strange, almost supremacist claims. And that was his very last lecture. It's available. It's a little difficult to get. You have to pay like two bucks or something. I think you have to go to his website because some of those things are on lockdown, but just go there and you can download it and watch his very last lecture before he dies. And then you start looking at things in retrospect and understanding that's the lens that he was researching under. And you start to see a different picture of possibly the Anunnaki story as he portrays it and perhaps why it is so popular right now and being pushed so hard. Yeah, that's a great summary. And it does seem like he was assigned the job. When you look at his previous assignments, it does just seem like another gig.

10:39 And in the immortal words of Kendrick Lamar, it seems motivated by this idea that they're not like us. It's motivated by the idea that the Goy are something different and we have a divine right to rule over them. I mean, it's in the Bible, it's the same thing, but it's kind of repackaged in a sci-fi way for an alternative crowd. And I mean, mission accomplished again. It just seems like it's been very successful. The thing is that I don't, I don't know how many people who are fans of ancient aliens and the ET astronaut hypothesis, I don't think they make the connection there, but I guess subliminally, subconsciously, they're eating up propaganda that suggests that there is a small group of people with special blood that should be ruling over the rest of us because they're the descendants of these Anunnaki.

11:33 So maybe they don't identify who that is because they're in their head. This is so long ago, but it's there. I mean, this seems to be the end goal of why this was promoted. I agree. And it's not just Sitchin. Sitchin kind of gets his, I don't know, we don't know where he gets his ideas. I mean, it just could be from him, but he gets definite inspiration from predecessors who kind of lay a foundation for some of this thinking as well, like ones like Blavatsky with Theosophy and Lost Civilizations, spiritual hierarchies, and the root races. But then there's Vilikovsky, which that was very inspirational to Sitchin.

12:10 And it really, I think, is not talked about as much. I think Sitchin is more overtly recognized as like the space god kind of guy. But then you have, of course, Von Daniken. And Von Daniken's work was really popular in 1968. And then you have later Sitchin coming out in 76. So he wasn't the first and he wasn't in a vacuum. At the same time, you have a lot of these things coming out of, you know, like maybe the occult revival and then the second occult revival. And so a lot of these sort of alien religions or these alien philosophies, they do coincide with occultism.

12:48 And I 100% don't think that's a mistake. I think that's by design. I don't think the phenomenon is something separate, even though it's portrayed as more of a nuts and bolts type phenomena in some ways. But I think there's this like metaphysical thing underneath it. And now what we're seeing through what some may call the externalization of the hierarchy, or there's many different ways to try to contextualize why now we're watching the confluence of both things, where we're saying, you know what, there are some biological or nuts and bolts, like material science views of this and metaphysical. So people are feeling rightfully so that it's being pushed.

13:28 But again, it's also very interesting to people. And the show Ancient Aliens, you brought up, that one is paramount in putting these ideas forward. I'm going to be flying out to do the next season. So I'm not the best source to talk to on this because I probably would be biased. But I will say the reason I still do the show is because the production itself kind of puts everybody on and just says, all right, go for it. And so they do put two different viewpoints. They have their ancient astronaut theorist over here, and then they put a whole host of people on to give alternative viewpoints. And so I've never thought there was a problem with that. I always thought it was a really great way to reach people where they are in terms of an interest in these topics and history.

14:10 And so I always thought it was a good show. And I'm very familiar with the production. And they've never tried to steer me at least in saying anything that I wouldn't believe, nor have they cut me in any kind of way that made me look like I was saying something in a way that was misrepresented. But, but at the same time, it's not just that show. And that show is really big. And I can't tell you whether or not it's really big because people just love it so much or because it's given some sort of special treatment. I mean, those are things I'm not privy to, but I just think that it's a little strange that these topics are pushed so heavily.

14:48 But again, maybe. it's just because people are interested in it. But I think that the unfortunate thing that we have is definite controlled opposition in those spaces. We had Michael Heiser, and he was the guy who did sitchiniswrong.com. And so he was clearly a guy put up against Sitchin. But the problem with him, even though his work was really good and detailed and scholarly, is he also had his own position he was coming from that was more of like an evangelical thing, right? And so it was almost like, in my view, controlled opposition that way, that you'd have to now only understand this Anunnaki question between two things, sitchin.

15:29 And if you wanted to disagree with him and have any sort of bona fidas, you'd be like, well, Heiser. But now you've come down to only the choices of, you know, that it's like aliens or that it's some sort of like watchers thing conveniently from the book of Enoch, which is another thing that is being pushed right now excessively. Yes. And that is people love it. People love it. And again, it's very interesting. And I don't even have a problem with any of it. I just think that it's funny how people who are supposedly Bible-based definitely fall into this book of Enoch camp. And it's like it's, it's an extra-biblical thing. It's from Second Temple Judaism. Why are we, you know, shit talking certain things from Second Temple Judaism, but then we're going to adopt this Nephilim ideology.

16:17 It's another thing, I think, in the bucket of Anunnaki Inc., where we have many different things coming in and creating this industry. Why is it an industry? There's many different theories. Why don't we have like Loch Ness Monster Inc.? I mean, there's so many other like weird, unsolved mystery type things from the past. But why the Anunnaki? Why has that one been so popular? And so my view is that there is that hidden agenda underneath it to get us all to start thinking in ways that could promote a supremacy of one type of person over another and could prepare us for a lot of different things that have been planned in more of an eschatological lens. So those are the things that I worry about. Yeah, I'm right there with you. I worry about that too.

17:01 And I know that you've used the term archaeology is espionage. And I think that's really great, Anunnaki Inc. I love a good term. You got to get them with these terms. The book of Enoch thing is so true. Anna Paulina Luna tweeted, just simply read the book of Enoch and she's deeply involved with the disclosure movement. So the insinuation is that if you want to understand the truth about aliens that the government has been hiding, it's contained in the book of Enoch. That's kind of what she's implying when she says that. And I know a bit about the book of Enoch. We've talked about it in the past because anything censored and at a time 15 years ago, the book of Enoch felt like a censored thing.

17:41 Obviously, through history, it was taken out of the Bible. But now they found a reason to put it back in the popular culture or the alternative popular culture. What do you think it is in the book of Enoch specifically that serves that goal? Or would if they're having a meeting about like, how are we going to frame this disclosure narrative and how are we going to make it a supremacy thing? What's in the book of Enoch in that story that you think helps them towards their goals? Well, it gives sort of a whole new mythology that really does come down at the end of the day to bloodlines.

18:19 I mean, often it does, but this idea that the Nephilim is like a bloodline or a spirit or something like that, where if they want to start dehumanizing other people and going after them, I mean, I've heard this on even podcasts that I think I've even been a guest on, where people are like very much about the Nephilim as these entities that still walk among us somehow, but that they're part of us. That it just gets dangerously close to the idea that at one point we could have a witch hunt where we're somehow getting rid of individuals who we think are Nephilim or Nephilim adjacent or something to that effect. It sounds preposterous now. And I'm not saying that that's the end game completely, but it's the power of incrementalism.

19:04 You know, if you start putting out these little ideas and over time, we could get ginned up in such a way that it sounds right to us to say, yeah, maybe this person is bad. I mean, we're seeing a lot of dehumanization and that's the name of the game. You can't, it's much harder to go after a group of people or persecute them somehow when we see humanity in them or see ourselves in them. But if we can successfully other them and not only other them, but make them dehumanize and so even evil, then it's not so hard. I mean, and we can talk about the Holocaust all day and all the problems with that and like the Zionism, Judaism, whatever.

19:41 But it is a good example still of just not. only the Holocaust, but what happened in Russia and communism, any of these totalitarian leaders, what they had to do was make vermin out of the people they wanted to get rid of. And so still, this idea of othering somebody as though they're not human, the line of being human is so important. And it's also kind of flexible, unfortunately, because we don't really know what humans are. And we don't know, we're animals at the end of the day, but we're not animals, right? I mean, there's been some kind of mutts. Right? There's something like that, which is part and partial to the story of this Anunnaki or the Watchers and the Nephilim that somehow we're like Greeks, you know, like maybe we're semi-divine or there's something else to us.

20:31 And I think it's the question, especially coming up with artificial intelligence of what it means to be human that is being tampered with a little bit and in a way that's even frighteningly just atrocious because, you know, Cash Patel putting out the whole thing on bestiality. We're seeing like a lot of talk about bestiality and things lately. Before the FBI made these changes, there were certain things that disqualified you from being an FBI agent. What were the things you changed? Simply that if you were a victim of some of these vicious crimes. Victim of what? Give me the prostitution, bestiality, crimes like that.

21:10 So I've been doing work on an article that I've been trying to release, but there's been a lot of things getting in my way about it because it's a bit incendiary, to say the least. I heard you talk about this on another podcast and kind of allude to it. And I was like, we have to hit this because yes, Kash Patel is getting questioned by Kennedy. Why would you have to change the policy around being allowed to be in the FBI to say bestiality is not something that disqualifies you? Are you getting that many candidates that have been involved in bestiality that you have to put that on paper? I don't want to leave with my chin and get into bestiality. And he then comes back and says, well, a lot of these people were made to do bestiality against their will.

21:55 And then my thought is, okay, well, that's a compromised individual. I hope you live a good life. I'm sorry that happened to you, but I don't think you get to be in an intelligence agency because someone clearly has a tape of you fucking an animal or an animal fucking you if you're that if you're super unlucky. Now, it just seems like that shouldn't be part of the discourse, but this is where we are in the timeline. And you have a really interesting subtext to why that might need to be rewritten because we might be co-mingling agents more on the surface. You know, they probably do this behind the scenes, but it'll be more overt that our intelligence agencies are going to be merging with Israeli intelligence agencies and the IDF.

22:41 And this might relate to the bestiality thing, right? I believe that is the case. I think that there's a few things that can be true at once that maybe like one thing is a consequence. Like, okay, so there's some victims and that'll work. And that's a great cover story. But ultimately, yes, it is my belief based on the research that I've done that there is a much bigger reason. And some people have touched on this. I know I had mentioned it to Kurt and he said that they touched on it on Jimmy Doerr and a few other places. So I have been doing a deep dive and getting the evidence that I can, the paperwork and the articles and some things in PubMed more specifically, to show that

23:26 allegedly, still I'm going to say allegedly, but my evidence supports that what they've been doing in the IDF is using dogs in groups that have been trained to go after women and children in Palestine to rape them. And so they have packs of rape dogs. And now someone may hear this and say, how is that even possible? Like, I have a pug. You know, like we're seeing dogs and we're like, this is. But the thing is, is you can't imagine it because you're not as depraved. You know, that's the problem. We can't even imagine. You have to be a real monster to even sit and contemplate this and the why is in the house.

24:06 And it is possible and it's been done. And there's a precedent for it elsewhere. And so the unfortunate part is that, yes, there is enough evidence that satisfies me to suggest that they've used packs of trained dogs to go after women and children to rape them and others, because there have been claims that men have been involved, but specifically to harm innocent people and traumatize them in a way that we just can't even imagine on so many levels, physically and mentally. And there's medical research. research on the after effects. I mean, so it is definitely documented possible to be assaulted and violated by an animal that way.

24:49 And then that leads me to think: okay, if that's not some of the most heinous things you could ever imagine doing to humanity and animals, just everything, it's like unreal. But then you have to remember, too, in the Talmud, what it says about the Goy and the precedence there for like, okay, so maybe to them, it's not actually very unethical or immoral, even, because we're just animals. So there's the line again. What is the line between a human and an animal? And it has to do with this divinity component. And that is something that if you're not part of the divinity that they are choosing to see as divine, then you're just an animal.

25:27 And that could go for many different types of people, different philosophies, religious viewpoints, because the struggle of what it means to be human has been one that we've dealt with since from the beginning, from the very beginning, at least of written history that we can document. So the problem here is that you do arguably have a group of people who have a religious text that gives them a framework to suggest that people outside of their tribe that's accepted are animals. And so you can use animals against animals and you're not really doing anything that abhorrent because it's just animals. It's not bestiality. They're all animals. And so that's about the dehumanization component again.

26:07 And it's so important that we bring this up and talk about it. And I've faced a lot of kickback from that. And I have not published the article just yet. I am in the last stages of getting it prime to do that. It is unfortunately going to be a paid article only because it is so heavy and people need to know what they're getting themselves into. Also, the money that would come from that in terms of subscriptions or whatever, I'm donating to the Palestinian Children's Relief Fund. So that's not going to be something that I profit off of. But I do think it's important to put it a little bit behind a paywall for various reasons. No, yeah, I agree all the time. I'm like, well, we're lucky we have a plus show because some stuff, like maybe this, I would have saved until later.

26:48 We can't introduce people to this stuff so early. Well, you know, why not? Just get right into it. No, no foreplay. We're going to scale up from here, believe it or not, people. So that's a little bit different than the framing that I laid out because I'm so conditioned to think about like the synergy between Israel's intelligence agencies and our own. And then I hear what they put people through who are going through those ranks, like they make them raise and kill a kitten. Exactly. That sort of stuff. So I thought maybe this was a hazing like, and you have to bang an animal to be part of the IDF or something. And so now when those people cross-pollinate, that has to be something that we allow on our side.

27:29 But this is a little different because if they're sending dogs out to rape weakened, starving people in the rubble of Gaza and the FBI wants to have informants on that side of the conflict and they start seeing all these experiences, it's like, well, you can't just write someone off because they were dog raped because it's weird to even say, but you could use that as a strategy if you were Mossad in the IDF, be like, oh, we'll just do this. And then that bars the FBI from even talking to these people because it's such a ridiculous thing that they wouldn't accept it. So I mean, dirty, dirty games are being played. And it's just insane how much they're scaling some of this stuff up.

28:13 But to go back to the sitchin thing a little bit, a lot of this goes back to, and the idea of archaeology as espionage. It goes back to the decipherment of cuneiform. Like this is something you framed up as the Sumerian problem that there's this perception that a lot of people, they dig in the dirt, they find a thing, and then they try to put it into the greater context and they have no other motivation than to just reconstruct the human story. But as you explain, there are people trying to validate the Bible. Then there's people trying to validate Jewish supremacy.

28:49 Nobody is working from just a blank slate. They all have biases and they all have people paying them to try to find the facts that reinforce their version of the history. Talk to us a little bit about the Sumerian problem, how this goes back to the decipherment of cuneiform and how there was a big Zionist lobby that was really trying to control that narrative. And maybe it got away from them. And now we know maybe a little more about it. And that Sumerian was not a Sumitic language, a Semitic language, as they were trying to say for so long, right? Yeah, this was so the Sumerian problem. And I've talked about it before, and it's just kind of a known thing in academia that the Sumerian problem is framed as the problem that the Sumerian language is a language isolate, that it just.

29:34 kind of comes up out of nowhere and nobody knows anything about it and how it came to be. It's sometimes called the Sumerian question. But it's a question of like who invented the first writing system. And so it has created this vacuum that we can fill, of course, with like all kinds of cool ideas of aliens or whatever. But that's been the crux of the work of Sitchin and others, really, even my own, just this idea of like trying to figure out like, where do these people come from? Why is it different? How did a group of semi-settled hunter-gatherers so long ago just all of a sudden transform into what we call a civilization in the span of only like 200 years? What is that? Right. But that problem has been talked about from Samuel Noah Kramer, and he kind of put out a popular book, a couple popular books.

30:18 He was a Sumerologist, and he was also responsible for putting out the list of Sumerian firsts and the list that some of those things I even have to walk back after doing more research and finding that half of the things aren't even the firsts. And so, you know, I'm guilty of standing up in front of my students before and going over that list because it's so approved by academia and that, okay, so they were the first to have, you know, this. And it's just not even the case half the time. But, you know, live and learn and science evolves or even the soft sciences evolve. But this Sumerian question, it doesn't just start with Samuel Noah Kramer. It goes all the way back at the very beginning of when they discovered Sumer.

30:59 So the question is not just like you kind of said, like, wow, where did this come from? We want to know about humanity. It devolves into this question as always: who's better than whom? You know, it's the who invented the first writing system. The question is racial at the end of the day, because in that 19th century sense, they were using racial language. So race, language, and culture were treated as just one sort of thing. And so scholars were really excited to prove then that there was a non-Semitic aspect to this language. And so the real Sumerian problem at the end of the day was going to be who could claim the invention of the Sumerian language, because then that would be whoever had all the very firsts of civilization, and it would be the evidence of actual racial superiority.

31:47 Because you could say, well, we've all come out of wherever, but boom, in Sumer, there was this like civilization, which of course you can link to what other people have conversationally, which is Atlantis or pre-flood or some sort of like golden age or anything like that that implies that there was this group of individuals who were just far more advanced and they came in and helped the primitives. And so it's already setting up for that racial question. And so one side of this debate thought that the Semites had lived in early Babylon. And so Semites then were the ones who invented writing. And that person who was really big on arguing that was an Ottoman-born Jewish French scholar and an early Zionist, of course.

32:32 This is before Israel even existed, but the idea of Zionism was already kind of coming into be. And this was about from 1870s, early 1870s onward. I mean, he argued that actually Sumerian wasn't a real language at all, and that he insisted it was a particular cipher that was invented by Semitic Babylonians. And it was a sacred code from the priest class of Babylon. So, I mean, that was kind of how it started. And he was a very prominent scholar, and he spent a ton of time trying to abolish the Sumerians as a people altogether.

33:10 He denied that they existed. And even in the Encyclopedia Judaica, it's listed this guy as this, that he was working for Semitic, like, quote, Semitic pride. And so, even in the most mainstream accounts, he's recognized as having this racial agenda, arguing that the Sumerians were superior. So, people will say, like, where did the language come from? How did they interpret it? How do they, that's fine. But there's this parallel thing happening in the academic discord at the time, which was all about racial supremacy between Jewish people and non-Jewish people. And the debate became even more entrenched with drama when there was a German scholar named Frederick de Leach, and he accepted this Jewish scholar's sort of secret code idea.

33:59 And it became like the accepted narrative for about 12 years. I mean, it was the very beginning of Sumerology that, okay, the Sumerians, these were special priest class of Semitic people. And this was for the whole thing. But eventually, though, this is where it gets a little weird. And, you know, I put this in the article. And some people, I want to clarify too, if you go read the articles, what I'm doing is giving a historiography because I was called out on this by some well-known anti-pseudo. archaeology debunkers, I will not name, but this has been called out that I was trying to claim that there was an Aryan Jesus or something to this effect.

34:37 What I want to make clear, and it'll be clear if you read the article, that I'm doing a historiography, which is the history of the history of something. It just means that I'm tracing how historians have viewed the subject over time and the arguments that they've had about it. Doesn't mean that I'm arguing any of this. I'm showing you the evolution of the question. And so, that said, this de Leach guy, he comes out after about 12 years and he says, you know what? I was wrong. The whole thing is wrong. And it's actually something completely different. And so he started to denounce this. And his first work was called Babylon Bible. And again, he was a leading Assyriologist at the time.

35:18 And even his dad was too. And so this guy had put the whole grammar of the ancient Mesopotamian language out there. I mean, he was like key in establishing Assyriology. So he was no small figure in this field. And he was, again, his dad was Franz de Leitsch, who was a famous Christian Hebrew scholar and a missionary to the Jews. And so this guy was in it deep, but he ended up doing this whole study. And he started asking like why any nation would pour money into a distant and dangerous land where there was no gold or silver. Right. He was like, why, what is going on? And so he was like, it's the Bible. We have to look at the Bible.

36:00 And so he kind of goes back to his roots and he starts looking into the different clay tablets and he looks into Hammurabi and he makes this big sort of revelation or this discovery and he declares that the actual markings on these tablets he was studying, there were three of them in particular, from the age of Hammurabi and they say Yahweh is God. And so if that translation was right, according to him, the name of Israel's God was already being talked about in Babylon a thousand years before Israel even existed. And so it's the word Yahweh was what he got hung up on. And so in his view, then this would make this whole thing an older inheritance of the Canaanite tribes who settled in Babylon rather than a revelation given at Mount Sinai.

36:48 So it's the very dangerous road he was treading because he's trying to say, you know, this is not Yahweh is not this God that was revealed to these people in Mount Sinai. After all, it disputes the entire core of that claim. And then he ends up doing a work called The Great Deception. And that was published in 1920 and 21. And again, it was, yes, there was some Nazi thinking happening beforehand, et cetera, but this was not a consequence of Nazism per se. So some people will claim that. Say, oh, he was just a Nazi archaeologist. He wasn't. This was before that. This was the 1800s. And then eventually this Great Deception was printed in 20 and 21.

37:27 And in that book, he completely denounced the whole field, denounced the whole thing. And he turned the Hebrew Bible just out openly and he just ripped it apart. He destroyed its historical truth. He showed dates and things saying this is just not even accurate. And his view was that Christianity should cut itself loose from the Jewish core entirely. He claimed that Yahweh was completely different, and this was not the God of the New Testament. He said he needed to kind of try to de-Judaize the origins of Western civilization. And he was elevating what he viewed as a pan-Babylonian inheritance over a Semitic or Jewish one.

38:08 And so it's cold, right? So he goes, he goes hard on that, but that is a back and forth then between him and other scholars. And this was what was going on in the time where we're supposed to believe that there's these like guys who are just wanting to know the truth about humanity's origin and they're just studying these tablets. And then they come out with stuff that happens to look like maybe it's aliens. And then good lone wolf researchers who, you know, look into it. So we got like two storylines kind of going on at the same time. One is the underpinning and then the other one is more, I mean, we'll call it like an esoteric and an exoteric, right? What we get to have, but there's sort of like three different strata. And if you go to the Penn Museum of Archaeology and Anthropology in Philadelphia, you can find the Star of David all over the building.

38:56 And the museum first opened in 1899. And that was the point that the university's expeditions were, you know, first happening over in Mesopotamia and particularly Nippur. So this was kind of a museum built for that discovery. It was a point of pride. But this was before Zionism. This was before the Zionism we understand. It was already a political cause, but it was with a small group. And what they were doing was putting the Star of David out. everywhere. And that was not a Jewish symbol at that time, even. It was not a Jewish symbol. It's only much later that it gets put on to the Israeli flag.

39:32 But as of now, you can still go to that museum that was so important in having all of what we even know about Sumer is kind of coming out of a link from that museum. And you can see all over the building, it's just, you know, so-called Star of David everywhere. So there's just, you just can't deny that there is this link to at least an interest in individuals who came from a particular persuasion who are interested in finding archaeological evidence to promote or at least reinforce their views of themselves. And for anyone who may say, like, oh, no, the people don't do that. They're academics. They're, you know, whatever.

40:10 No, because to this day, you have Bible archaeology as a discipline and people go into it. And the truth is, most biblical archaeologists are going in there because they're Christian and they want to prove like they can find news arc or whatever. And, you know, I mean, that does not to say that nothing good comes from any of that scholarship. People actually go, they do work, but we have to call out those biases, those motivations, so that we don't delude ourselves and we can stay on top of it. Yes, that is well said. And that picture of the museum is one of the things I was going to throw up because it is so crazy. Clearly, it's biased. It's like getting your information from a Vatican museum and thinking that it's not validating itself.

40:49 The same thing happens with the Tataria research. I know Kurt is big on pointing out that that stuff all comes from Russia and apparently it's Russian propaganda to prop up the idea that they had a crazy high society and a kingdom in the ancient past. And Fromenko, definitely the guy who started a lot of this hidden history, the timeline has been manipulated stuff. He's Russian and he's a Russian nationalist to a large degree. He's trying to validate that. But it's easy to forget because it's just so far from my own motivations to make anything, anything other than the truth that it's like, yeah, you got to forget that everybody has a hidden motivation.

41:29 And you talked about earlier the othering of people. That is a dangerous thing. We have seen it used so many times from indigenous people that, like, oh, they're not like us. They're just digging around in the dirt. Who cares what we do to them? Native American savages, you know, kill them all. Who cares? It happens all the time. And then people, it's happening in Gaza right now. And then regular people where their compassion would kick in. There is something psychological about, yeah, it's bad, but I don't know. It just, for some reason, it doesn't seem like it's your neighbor. And that's a problem. But of course, the elite, they other themselves. I mean, they're the ones who've been obsessed with their own bloodlines and mapping these huge tapestries and cross-pollinating themselves.

42:13 So it's like maybe that's a little projection on their part to other all of us when really it's like they're the ones who have separated themselves. And if we had any power whatsoever, it'd be okay, I think, to take those in power who have separated themselves or don't see themselves as human and put them somewhere else. Yeah. But, you know, again, not really up to me. Maybe that's a good thing. Well, I think they're trying to do that anyway. I think that's part of the whole deep underground base kind of thing. They're trying to, you know, somehow go off world, although maybe they can't go off world the way they'd like to. But yeah, they're definitely othering themselves. So, and that's, I think, part of the question moving forward when we have these like few future-focused ideas of AI and transhumanism in this.

42:58 We still haven't kind of wrapped our minds around what it means to be human. Like that, or what it means, like in the past, like going back to the epic of Gilgamesh, even the idea of like conquering nature. So there's like a king that conquers nature and this, this idea of the animal, the beast of the field versus the people. And it sounds like such an archaic idea, but we still can't wrap our minds around it, right? We're still like, and even when we do, we may say, well, like if I were to ask you, like, what makes you human? I mean, there's so many different answers, but some people self-awareness, I would say. Self-awareness, right? And so that ability to maybe abstract and plan out and have that self-awareness.

43:37 But modern cognitive research has shown that Corvids have that. Blue Jays and crows, they can do that very thing. So who knows? There's a handful of animals that apparently can recognize themselves in the mirror. So Dr. Zach Bush was just here and he says a lot of stuff that I really like. And then in my youth, I might have been like lame, new age junk, don't care. Who is this softy? But, you know, he had a near-death experience. He was transformed. He had a download and he just seems like so enlightened now. And he says these things. He said that the point of human beings is that it's the most complex thing nature has created so it can recognize.

44:19 recognize its own beauty. He's like, Because in that regard, it's not looking at yourself in the mirror. It's like, what animals stop and look at a sunset? None, only humans. So, humans are part of nature, but a creation so that nature can self-recognize its own beauty and probably move some pieces around on the board to steward the land and increase its beauty and all that. But I thought that was pretty well said. No, I love that. I really, really love that. It reminded me of the platonic triad of like truth, beauty, and goodness. Because there's something about beauty that is, well, in that framework, the idea of beauty brings you to the truth, and the truth is inherently good.

45:02 And so, there's that relationship between that, where it's not just something superficial or aesthetic, it's something that is deeply moving and like a sunset. Or, you know, it's part of the reason people say that churches or cathedrals will be a very effective way to get people to convert because you walk in and immediately you're taken by the beauty of something like that. And you may then be more likely to be open to the message that it has. Music is the same way, but any time that you can stop and observe and commune with that beauty, there's something existential about that. And that can leave you open to the suggestion of possibly good and then truth. And so, yeah, that relationship.

45:42 So, I love that. I think that's really cool. But maybe we'll find out that other animals do that too. It's hard to say, you know, because we have limited tools still in technology. We're always, we're only as good as the tools that we have. But it's still just a question. We don't know what really consciousness is. We don't know what it means to be human fully, yet we're already kind of fucking with it, right? We're trying to like go to full transhumanist. And again, the border, it's the slippery slope. You know, we can kind of say what a human is and then kind of say, but yet we're animals. Same with something like transhumanism, because one of the arguments you'll have for it is, well, we already do it. We have human plus, because if you have glasses, you're already augmenting your sight with something external.

46:24 And so there's that. Pacemakers and all that. Exactly. And so, how far along will it go before we say, now we have to make a decision that this is the line, that this is now a human, or this is now no longer a human? And I say this is now a human because we're kind of immediately looking at it like we're entering a new world where there's going to be a bionic man, where we're getting the technology and placing it on us or in us. But there is wetware, if you're familiar with that, where they're taking computers, you know, and putting human tissue on that. And so you're kind of doing the same thing, but in reverse. So how long before a actual computer type system or a machine becomes a human?

47:07 Like when do we differentiate that as being a human? And these are ethical questions that are actually being discussed in terms of the animal component of it too. That's already been well established in the literature and some really kind of disturbing thought experiments that have been put out in bioethic journals, which are like the idea of head swapping. So if you put a human head on a dog body, at what point does it self-identify as a dog? You can find them everywhere. Peer review, just look up like head swap and all of that. But yeah, bioethical journals will have these discussions over at what point do people become like trans species and where are the ethics then?

47:46 So blurred lines everywhere. And it's very dangerous then to start actually having any sort of policy based on something we don't know. Like how about genocide? Like, oh, these aren't humans after all. How about we just like, you know, send the rape dogs for them and kill them all? It's like, we got to see the humanity in people. Otherwise, we become worse than animals. Well, that's what Robin Thick was talking about. And it is an interesting question. If you take a dog's head and put it on a human and a human head and put it on a dog, which one is more human? Is the human more contained in the head or is it the body? I mean, I think it's just a false dichotomy, really, but it's weird to think about the motivations of people who have the power to do these experiments to blur the lines.

48:35 Like they're clearly motivated by something, and that's where it gets into like the dark agendas of breaking God's system and trying to do all this crazy stuff. But I wanted to talk a little bit more about this audience is hearing all kinds of people talk out there. And Stitchin is a great example of, oh, here's a guy who penetrated the alternative media with a secret agenda to spin people off into thinking things that his people who signed his paychecks approved of. Well, let's update that.

49:11 I mean, that's still got to be going on. And I heard in another interview. interview, you said that the way that they quote unquote operate is sort of LARPing in this LARPing fashion. They will put people around a researcher to control their view in a sort of grand theater way. And I think that's well said. I mean, that is a little bit different. So Sitchin is a Zionist who's trying to fit his narrative into the evidence. Whereas this is a little different. This is a person who's kind of innocent, who's trying to do good work, but they get co-opted and certain people are placed around them.

49:48 And all of a sudden, they're in this bubble and they probably are getting validation from people they maybe consider further down the chain or people they consider mentors. And those people are all strategically placed in their life to get them to go and advocate for something as if they think they discovered it or they think it is the truth when really it's some kind of manipulation behind the curtain. Talk to us a little bit about that sort of stuff happening. And I don't know if we want to throw out specific people's names as possible examples of it. I definitely have one or two. I would. But just the shape of the thing. Talk to us about that.

50:25 And then people listening need to pay attention to this. Very much so, especially in this time where we're consuming a lot of alternative media that's sort of like a mainstream media. A lot of the numbers bear that out. So, as somebody who has been on the mainstream media of something like History Channel, I'll tell you that the numbers that they have coming in for even their best performing episodes, you'll hear this about a lot of cable television shows. They're nothing compared to when you just look at a YouTube video of a popular podcast. They're like just a pale in comparison. So a lot of this legacy media is just propped up because it's legacy and they can't let go of the boomers. And so, but it's not real. It's, it's like it's there, but that alternative has really started to become the mainstream.

51:09 And that is dangerous because we're thinking it's countercultural or, you know, subversive somehow, but it's not. It's actually very well funded. And yes, in terms of there being a LARP, it is. It's someone like Sitchin. Yes, he knew what he was doing. He was doing this on purpose, but look at what he did. How many people now promote the Sitchin idea and quote him and have businesses from him that have no idea even of the Zionism or of his ulterior motives or any of that? They've just built a world around them. And then people aspire to be like those and then they just go on and go on.

51:45 But that's that example of Sitchin and what I call Anunnaki Inc. But there's just this, this happens in any of these industries where if the controllers at the top, these power broker elites, they think they have all the cards. What they love to do is collect people. This is just, you can read this in many different books. This is just a known strategy that people who are power brokers find value in networking because that is the most valuable thing. But they also want to have people under their control. And so they like to collect people and have that big network. So you don't need to have, like, if you, if you're going to have a LARP around you, you're going to have some sort of like Minnie Truman show.

52:23 You don't need every single person involved to be part of it. You just need it to be orchestrated at the top and to have those individuals sort of set an environment where it will naturally occur. So there's that plausible deniability so that everybody who's in it, so like a stage play, the actors don't even know they've been hired actors. They're just doing, you know, maybe improv, but they're, but they don't see that they were placed on the stage by the directors. So the directors can just, you know, if you put the right improv people there, they can just walk off and there's a show that's going to happen. And it's going to be self-contained because they created the stage and the boundaries for that.

53:00 And so, and this is, again, this is documented both in some occult literature from a long time ago, where they would talk about different magicians going after each other and putting them into occult prisons. That's what they kind of used to call it. And Blavatsky, it was said, was in one of those at one point where her whole thing got usurped and she became not controlled opposition, but sort of just controlled. And so that is the idea in the occult aspect of it. But then you have the basic political aspect with Cass Sunstein, who wrote the book Nudge and that whole thing. And he was involved in the Obama administration. And this is just part of economics. And, you know, how do we get a group of people to do the things that we want them to do?

53:44 Well, we can't control each person, but we can control their environment. We can place them in a situation where the probability of them doing what we want them to do is much higher. And so Sunstein and others called that nudging. Like we just kind of make the environment, we can control the environment, right? We set policy, we make rules. That's all that it takes then to move the herd through the system. And so they won't even know it. So if you take that theory and take that model. and just kind of pull it down a little bit, it's the same idea that if you say have an interest in pushing a particular agenda or pushing a particular type of alternative media, you have a media company. You can have a small one, and a lot of people are interested in funding these alternative media companies.

54:27 And it's because they know that these are very effective ways to use this system against people. So, you say, start a media company, and you are the controller at the top. And then you just collect a lot of people who want to be part of that media company and you put them together. They do what they do. But also, you can be in a situation where you're introduced then through a network to this other person who maybe they're an agent, right? Because they wanted to be an agent, they want to network. They're that kind of person. And so, they were introduced by that person and this person. Before you know it, it's just networking and introductions that are made, and they seem very organic and natural.

55:05 But what you've had is the casting call where everybody's on this like Zionist theater, and the controllers were the ones who built the script and built everything. There's an element of improv to it because humans are irrational, but that's baked into the plan. As long as you can create the environment where it's more likely that they're going to behave in the way that you want them to for the particular outcome, they can do a lot of things and it can look unplanned because it is, but as long as they're working towards that outcome. So, it sounds like a lot of overthinking, and it sounds like a lot, but that's exactly what they're doing because the stakes are so high in media. Because if you can get a large group of people to then start overtaking media from the legacy and you have, say, podcasts or shows or whatever, they're getting like hundreds of thousands of views, which may not seem like a lot, but when you consider mainstream media numbers are really tanking like

56:00 that, some of these channels get millions of views. And so they are the mainstream. And that's, I think, where we have to be even more careful now: is trying to find those connections and be very much more, I guess, skeptical a little bit or on watch too for what we looks to be kind of gritty or alternative and know that it very well could be another controlled opposition. Yeah, it's unfortunate that we have to do that because, like, we have so many things to do during the day. Can we not just enjoy something? Can't have anything nice. Agendas everywhere. I mean, agents, and managers, and networks, and publishers, and producers, they control the levers of exposure that the talent gets.

56:44 And they might have some perception management motivations that they don't even have to disclose. They can just quietly be selective of who they include. And if they control the opening of certain doors, then you just find the people who are going to support your perspective on things. That is a position of power that doesn't get talked about a whole lot. And in terms of people that are in kind of that LARPing category of being like wrapped up in a theater around him, I think Tom DeLong could qualify. I think David Grush could qualify because my problem with a lot of these people on the forefront of disclosure that get paraded out on like a Joe Rogan show, it's like, okay, we got the guy.

57:27 He's got his stories. He's going to go out there. He's going to give the narrative. None of them have seen anything. They're like, I know a guy who showed me this document of a thing. And we know behind this closed door, I haven't gotten behind that there's an alien body. And it's always a few degrees removed. Well, what is that? Tom DeLong, people are more critical of him because he has this history where he's in Freemasonic garb and he's in this band that was obviously elevated. And his bandmate is now married to a Kardashian and the other one's parents were military intelligence. So maybe there's something else going on there. But it does seem like he had a genuine interest in the UFO question.

58:08 And then some doors were open for him. And it's like, well, talk to this handful of people. And then he's really wrapped up in it. And then he goes forth and he's like, oh, we got to tell this story. And he's like, I talked to all these military guys and they disclose this stuff to me. And I can't say anything about this and this and that yet, but there's something there, I promise you. It's like, what, what's real, man? You know, what were you shown? You don't seem to have any real information. David Grush was just on Rogue and everybody's going nuts about it. It's like, again, it's like you talked to people who might have been playing you. Bob Lazar might qualify too. I think so. Yeah. And this is the thing. He's genuine. He's genuinely trying to talk about what he believes is a truth, but he was co-opted.

58:53 That's different than someone who's intentionally trying to manipulate you, but they actually get better results from a person that is a true believer in a false narrative that they've crafted for him. Yeah. And that's so important to point out because some of them seem so credible, like a Bob Lazar or, you know, I would put Whitley Streeber in that category as well. Yeah. You know, I've spoken with him enough times to believe that he believes in his experience, what he's experienced. But he's also, he'll put those little things out there. Like, I don't, maybe, you know, I don't know about this. Like, he's skeptical of his own story, even. So I think that there are a lot of people that way. I would argue Chris Bledsoe would be one of them.

59:33 Yeah, I know. But that there are people who they go through something, they experience something, and they're not doing it on purpose. Now, that doesn't mean they lack the agency. Maybe they need to step up and recognize the situation they're in. But some people get in so deep and they feel that they now have a community around them. It's like a cult. You know, if you have everybody around you that's just like telling you how special you are and how important you are and all of this, it's going to be more difficult for the average person to step back from that. So it's a mind fuck all the way around. And they get you. That's why it's one of these LARP things.

1:00:11 It's like a Truman show. They put you in it and then just do this. So there can be unwilling participants, but that get tricked. So for sure. And I think that's why so much good information can come out of these sources mixed with the disinformation. And it reminds me of William Cooper. So like Bill Cooper started the whole thing too, where he was like going out talking about the alien, you know, things he saw that he read these reports from the Navy. And for a long time, that was his story. And then he switched and was like, wait now, you know, after he started thinking differently and putting out different content, he even admitted many times he thinks that he was intentionally shown that material so that he'd go out and talk about it.

1:00:54 I would put a lot into what Bill Cooper talked about, especially since he paid the ultimate price, right? I mean, tax man coming and shooting him in his back in his driveway. I mean, hmm, I don't know. That's just me. But yeah, that's interesting that he himself turned around and said, no, all those things I told you, you know, I don't know anymore about that. I think they were shown to me by design. And so, but that would be an example of the types of things that could happen where it's not that primary source, right? It's like, well, a guy told me, or I saw these documents or whatever. And there you go. Like, and then you get so deep into it. It was, I think, Kurt said too, like, and he said, they can give you a whole adventure.

1:01:37 I thought, damn, that's exactly right. They can give you a whole adventure. And there are people that, for some reason, the only examples that come to mind are involved in the alien UFO thing. Like, I would maybe put Linda Molten Howell in that category because she had all this information, all these government people giving her the stuff. And she's just the journalist at the end of the line, public facing, giving the information. And Dr. Stephen Greer, too, again, same similar kind of thing. Although both of them are in that photo at the Lawrence Rockefeller ranch with Bigelow. It's like Bigelow is kind of a big player, right? He's not just some journalist going on coast to coast.

1:02:16 So you got Lawrence Rockefeller's secret meeting at a ranch where he's got a photo of 20 people, including Linda Moltenhow, Stephen Greer, and Bigelow. Seems like a big deal to me. Seems like something was talked about there that, like, you're going to go forth and be the person who promotes this, that, and the other. And someone once described Dr. Stevens Greer to me off the record as a discarded Rockefeller asset. And I had not seen that photo yet. And I didn't understand exactly what they meant. But we all have to pay our bills. So if you are in the club and then they say your usefulness has is exhausted, you know, we've exhausted you, then you still have to do something.

1:02:55 And that's when I guess you start leading meditation retreats for $2,000 a pop out in the desert trying to get the lights to show up for you. You even had, and we've talked about this in private, but you had a scare recently with some kind of co-option. I wouldn't even bring it up, but I have heard you at least mention it publicly. So you have guarded against the co-option of the grand theater, it seems. I did. I will admit my fallibility and the fact that I almost got sucked in and it was complete accident and didn't see it around me. That's happened to me once before, a long time ago. It wasn't quite as dire like financially driven because it was so crazy that I thought, this is crazy.

1:03:39 Nobody's going to give me that kind of money to do this. Like, what's going on? Plus, the connections, it was so weird. And I was like, I don't know about this. And so that was over there. And then now this happened and it's like more overt and I'm more savvy. And so, and I understand now about the Grand LARP or the grand adventures they can give you, but I did not know because like this was. different. This was my initial dealings with somebody who actually came to me almost like what you'd think, what like many people might think, like, oh, they come to you and they offer you things and there's a sign here. And it's like, that is what happens. So I experienced that. And, but that's easier to say no to. Well, unless you want it, then you'll be like, okay, well, like, I'm not about to sell out that way.

1:04:19 So it was obvious to me. And I'm like, no. But then they can do a different tactic. And the tactic was, we won't even ask. We just kind of strategically put people around you. And because I trusted particular individuals who should be trusted, by the way, who also didn't realize. And so this is without naming names, but you know them. So like just the audience will just have to know that these are things that can't be discussed completely for people will get hurt. So essentially, yes, I got myself almost in a situation where I unknowingly signed a deal with the devil and saw it and was like, what?

1:04:57 And so got out of that. But it happened through trusting a network, trusting the people that, again, should be trusted because they weren't in on it. It's these factions will weasel their way into a pre-existing network and start coming in, sort of like a Co-Intel Pro kind of thing, sort of like, you know, what would happen with, well, any of these things. They just, this is what they do. It's like they take over like the Tea Party, the Tea Party, if anyone remembers that was a good example where it was an organic movement, you know, Ron Paul 2012, whatever. It was just a whole thing. And then it started to get infiltrated by like wacky people and it turned into something ludicrous.

1:05:37 And so then it was discredited. Same thing with Pizzagate. So Pizzagate, a legitimate concern over what is actually real human trafficking, which is completely the crux of our problem right now that people don't want to seemingly talk about. But then they send the guy in to comet ping pong and the so-called basement. And then he recants the story and is like, oh, woe is me. I can't believe I was duped. And it makes this really great play that the media was able to say, oh, look, this guy was just crazy. And now you could just name the thing because they brand everything. So it was Pizzagate. And so now anybody who brings up anything even slightly related to that can be just dubbed like crazy Pizzagate person or, you know, so that you have all these ways to discredit and discount.

1:06:22 So there's real things and then people will come in and take it over. And you just got to watch for that. You could be involved in a very real thing and you just have to always be on the lookout for those who are coming in to try to usurp and take over. And yeah, it's a hive of scum and villainy, man. It's a jungle out here. On that note, it is always good to talk to you. I know you have an event very soon that I wish I could attend. It's my daughter's fifth birthday. So unfortunately, I have to go do what dad's got to do. Fortunately. Tell us about it in the end. I mean, sometimes I think about holidays and stuff and we're like, are we giving our kids too many gifts and this and that? You get about 10. You get from, and before five, they're too stupid to understand what's happening.

1:07:07 Then they understand the concept of gift giving. You get from five to maybe 15 and then it's over. So enjoy the birthdays, you know, enjoy the holidays. That's what I guess I'm going to do. But sometimes I like talking to adults too, because my mind can only handle so much kid talk. Either way, tell us about this upcoming event. I think this will be out in time for it. Probably not in time for people to arrange flights and all that and get there. But you probably have other stuff going on too. You got other projects, an upcoming book, all that good stuff. Let them know. Yeah. Well, I am going to be in Austin on the what day is that? I'm terrible at this. I'm really bad at pitching this weekend of the 17th. It's October 16th, 17th, and 18th.

1:07:48 I'm going to be in Austin, an Austin Quest. So if you are local and you see this and you want to come out, that's cool. You can get tickets on my website. There's also streaming tickets so you can stream it and watch it from home. A lot of good speakers, Randall Carlson, David Hatrick Childress, Billy Carson, a lot of like these ancient type people, Dan Richards. So that's going to be fun. I'll be talking to him this evening on a live about that. And then, of course, our friends, Kurt Metzger and Duncan Trestle will be there doing Mystery Boys live. So that'll be fun. Lots of fun stuff in store. So definitely, if you're in the area, come out and see me. I'll be there signing things and having a good time. So other than that, you can find me on the h files.com and look at my sub stack if you want to check that out and see all these articles.

1:08:32 And then I have a new book coming out in April. It's on for pre-order, and I think you mentioned it too. YouTube, whatever. Find me on the H files. And if you're interested, you can click around the links there and be like, what's she doing? So I'm there. Nice. Well, if you see Hugh Newman, tell me these good people. And if you see David Hatcher Childress and get to talk to him, let him know he's on my dream guest list. Respond. Respond to those emails, David, please. Oh, I'll let him know, too. He's so nice. He's so nice. Oh, well, he is. And I think he's just above doing a bunch of podcast interviews because he doesn't really do very many. But I mean, I still get his catalog for the books he publishes and the books he's written. I mean, it's all the stuff I love, like what's going on in the Grand Canyon and rogue weird archaeology stuff and a lot of hollow earth stuff.

1:09:19 Yeah. That's my bag. So I really, I really want to get the great DHC here one day. But you are the best. Thank you so much. Clearly, you're getting recognized for your talents out in the world. I see you all over the place, and that's a beautiful thing. And just stay away from anyone trying to sign you to any deals you don't like. But keep the Rebel Spirit alive, Heather. I'll see you when the book comes out probably. Yeah. Thanks so much for having me. I really appreciate it. You got it. Well, sad, my damies. You know where you lover, the great Dr. Heather Lynn. She has quickly become one of my main work friends and one of the people that I talk to most regularly.

1:09:59 I knew I wasn't going to get this out before her Austin event. I was trying to be ambitious, but I guess I'm glad we didn't because the event didn't even happen. We were talking about how this past weekend was actually my daughter's fifth birthday, but maybe I could catch a late flight out and be there for Sunday, although Sunday is always the weakest day of an event. Though this collection of people almost moved the needle for me because it's the right people that I would like to meet in person. But the whole damn thing got canceled because the organizer didn't have the cash to pay the venue in full. Man, Billy Carson flew in from Egypt. Hugh Newman flew in from London.

1:10:38 Not to mention all the regular folks who made the trip just to be a part of it. Maybe it was their one thing they wanted to do this year. I was just very shocked because that almost never happened so close to the start of an event. It's not like the venue has time to book anything else. So I guess if it was me, I would step in and just try to capture money at the door or something or tell the organizer to divert ticket sales right to me if you wanted this to continue. Maybe try to salvage something out of it, but crazy. She also told me, though, that the Austin experience has her moving there now. Congratulations. I know she was on Mystery Boys and a couple other podcasts.

1:11:20 It's obviously a podcasting hub down there, and being a local does help. She posted pictures of going to the comedy mothership with David Hatcher Childress. I mean, come on. That made me more jealous than the conference even. Through Instagram, it looks very fun. Austin was a candidate when we were deciding where to move when we left San Diego. Really, more hill country than Austin proper, but any income tax-free state was on the list. I just don't really love Austin. It's kind of small, but also just Texas is huge. I like road trips. I don't want to have to drive eight hours just to get out of the state. I mean, I am kind of in that situation here in Florida, but I have the whole East Coast to explore.

1:12:05 I mean, it takes eight hours to get out of Texas. And when you do, where do you want to go? Arkansas, Oklahoma? No offense. Plus, they're just too strict on weed. I don't want to have any unforced errors on that front. You know, my friends who live there, they actually drive up to Oklahoma and buy bulk weed and drive all the way back. And I don't know. I just have too much to lose these days over something so silly. Plus, the winter snowstorms can be pretty brutal. Who cares? Congrats to Heather for the move. I'm sure it's a very good professional one, and she is in a fun circle of people to hang out with.

1:12:46 Coming from Ohio, seems like an upgrade. She seems very happy about it. But I love having her here. She writes so much and so fast that it's very easy to have her back frequently. I'm glad we got to the TikTok menstrual blood witches in the first hour so I could put that in the title. I was going to put Israeli rape dogs in there because clearly that's an attention grabber. But I think that would get me buried on YouTube pretty fast. There's channels I watch where they bleep out the word rape just in regular conversation. I would never go that far, but I guess I don't need to actively damage my reach more than I already have.

1:13:27 Another funny thing that happened, though, we had family movie night here at the Carlwood House the day I recorded this interview, which is a big deal because we don't turn the TV on a whole lot despite the constant temptation. And my daughter picked up. And I don't think I ever really saw up, but I was watching along thinking about today's interview and realized, huh, I might be watching the O. the only kids movie with a dog army in it, a dog army that electronically takes orders from a central command, so to speak. Very weird. What are the odds, you know? Still, great first hour, action-packed show, and the second hour only goes deeper.

1:14:08 Help me help you. Like Hitch, I came 90% of the way. You come 10. I want to give you the full great show that's right there for you. We added many things to the plus stack. In the second hour, we talked about what Heather thinks is the most correct narrative for our relationship with entities in the larger human story, the age-old practice of demonic transfer and leadership, and the history there, and these leaders who have historically lost their minds. Maybe it's related, right? When the god eats the host, as she put it. But then there is this one quote that I didn't get to, but I want to read here. The Roman Emperor Caligula is remembered as a madman.

1:14:51 He declared himself Jupiter incarnate. He had conversations with the god. He built a bridge between his palace and the Temple of Jupiter so he could visit his, quote, brother. He executed citizens on impulse, displayed sexual behavior that horrified even Roman sensibilities, and demanded worship as a living deity. Nero followed the same trajectory. His early reign was competent, even praised. Then came a progressive disillusion of personal identity into the role. Murders, grandiosity, performance replacing governance, Rome burned and he sang. The conventional explanation is insanity. The ancient explanation was more specific.

1:15:31 Are these examples of a host leader being eaten by an entity that was too powerful to contain? I love it. She's great. And that was just a really good part of the plus show. We also talked about this idea of how some figures are used and shown certain things and then told to go talk about it in the alternative media. And they themselves might be victims of a fictional LARP bubble that they don't even realize they were placed in. We talked about some of that and who a few candidates might be. You know the drill. The first hour is great, but the full two-hour interview is always better. Become a plus member. It's super easy.

1:16:11 The URL comes in the welcome email. You just take that and copy and paste it in your podcasting app and you're switched over to Plus in under a minute. My wife actually wanted to hear a recent show, Zach Bush, I think. And she went through the process and was like, wow, that is a lot easier than it used to be. That's right, baby. We're on the cutting edge of how to distribute a paid private podcast without any third party doing it for us and taking their 30% cut. And if you're unsure, the free trial doesn't even require a credit card. Come on, try it, sign up. And when you've heard a few full shows yourself, you'll know that it's right for you.

1:16:52 And all your wildest dreams will come true. And you know, I'm doing this drive, trying to get to that goal of 500 net plus members added to the list before the end of the year. And now's the time. If you've ever been curious, come back if you are thinking about doing that. Or if you plan to cancel, just wait till January. We're going to make it to that goal one way or another, regardless if we have to game the numbers a little bit. We're at about 110 of 500. I think we can do it. Less than 1% of the free listeners need to come over. And I very much think what we got here is worth it. All right.

1:17:29 But happy with today's show. I was reminded how Gordon mentioned the Sitchin Rockefeller connection in our first interview ever. But man, I did not know how far it went. Heather did a great job digging out a lot of stuff. I had no idea he was so connected in the Zionist movement. I certainly have maintained some of that ancient alien engineering story into my big picture analysis. They say we have fused chromosomes and there are a few other anomalies in our genetic code that seem concocted in a lab, the big chimp hybrid thing and all that, but it's impossible to know.

1:18:09 I like to think that we are as we were meant to be, here to have our human experience in the big material sandbox, but plenty of entities have been trying to mess with us forever. So maybe they had success a time or two in our ancient past. It's this idea that there is a chosen group of leaders and the rest of us are a slave race to them. That seems to be the big Zionist theme that they want to seed. The rest just feels like a wrapper that helps dress it all up. The aliens, the spaceship, the. Planet X thing.

1:18:47 It's all extra. But telling people they are a slave race, just bred to take orders like sheep and seek out authority, it's provocative. It's a nice thought exercise, and I liked it when I was a teenager, but it's not very empowering and probably does have an effect on the psyche. I guess we have to add it to a long list of narratives we're told about ourselves that end up making us feel small and inconsequential. I prefer to feel powerful and impactful, like I am on an important mission. I am fulfilling a role in the greater flourishing of everything and the re-enchantment of the world.

1:19:24 I'm a net positive for the field, I think. And the more people who see themselves as important and able to influence the field and then choose to impact it positively, I think that's all there is at the end of the day. Did I make the biggest net impact I could and was it positive? That makes us all very significant, which is why there's so much energy put into maintaining a wide range of distractions and endless entertainment. And of course, the economic pressures and all those commitments. And that's really all that's needed to eat up a huge piece of a person's life pie. We do what we can, right? Okay, higher side news. All I want for Christmas is to hit that goal.

1:20:08 Get us back to 2021 numbers, and I'll keep churning out good stuff. But apparently, I missed the mark a bit last week with the Jason Burmes show. I liked it. I thought we had a good vibe going. I thought we could even be friends. But that show settled in at a 4.2. Another one that is kind of low on our scale. And I'm working on that, by the way. I know it's tough when you can only rate between one and five stars. So if you give a show four stars, that should be telling me that you thought it was pretty good, but not great. But we end up with an aggregate 4.2. And I think my whole empire's falling apart.

1:20:50 It's all out of whack. I will say I recently vibe coded a new plugin because I couldn't find the simple thing I wanted with all the available options. I've heard WordPress is a big ecosystem, but you can't get a regular ass plug-in. But I'll throw it up on the screen here. This is what I had it make, and this is what I think we need. A 1 to 10, easy to use with a submit button, because people tell me they accidentally fat finger the wrong star, and then they're locked in because there's no submit button. It just takes it and grabs it. And, you know, we want these ratings to be accurate. We want people to communicate their feelings on the show. And so this little technical thing sometimes gets in the way.

1:21:35 But you also got to be careful with these vibe-coded things. So it is being tested right now. Hopefully it'll be ready in a week or two. But if AI can do anything right, it should be coding, right? So 4.2, maybe I shouldn't think of it as such a poor rating, but we tend to do better than that. So what can I say? I had a good time with him. I saw that the biggest criticism seemed to be his COVID takes, which I tried to speed along and get through. But then really also saying how he got it wrong on Howard Ludnick, but then was defending Tom Hanks when I was kind of going off.

1:22:14 Was that a plus show thing? I can't remember. I think it was. But I myself made a mistake because I said Tom Hanks' son, Chet, had his face all tattooed up. And that's wrong. He actually has his whole body tatted up, but not his face. And he does have an all-seeing eye huge on his chest. I don't know where the esoteric symbolism came into his cookie-cutter suburban rich dad life, but he does seem damaged by a father who fakes his wholesome image to hide the real darkness in there. We'll never know, but his face isn't tattooed like I thought it was. So record corrected.

1:22:58 But those were reasonable criticisms. There's no reason to defend any member of the elite class. Like I had said about the Lutnik whistleblower. According to that guy, Ludnik was scamming the system way before he was part of this administration. We know he was doing shady property deals with Epstein way before that too. He's on the island. This is not a recent situation for Howard Ludnick that he should be criticized and scrutinized heavily by any regular person. It's best to just assume they're all dirty until they prove otherwise if they even can. Don't look for heroes in the hierarchy or the hedge funds, right? Pretty much a good rule of thumb if you're going to be.

1:23:39 be in the conspiracy content space. We did get Jason over 80,000 subscribers on YouTube, though, and that is nice. It's arbitrary, but he put the goal out there. And Alex Jones's audience couldn't do it, but we could. So, thank you for answering the call. I know it made him happy. And last but not least, we got to talk about the meetup calendar. Coming up on Monday, North Coat Tavern in North Coat Point, Auckland, New Zealand, November 8th, St. Paul, Minnesota, Blackstack Brewing. Also, November 8th, Los Angeles at the Trails Cafe. The They Lie About Everything, Coffee Social. Then November 11th, Hudson, New York at Upper Depot Brewing.

1:24:21 November 13th, Quartzite, Arizona. And November 14th as well, the Raleigh Brewing Company, Raleigh, North Carolina. November 15th, Savannah, Georgia. I had a great time when I went to Savannah, Georgia, but this is a boiled peanut party at Turner Creek Boat Ram. All right. If you haven't been to Savannah, they have a whole economy based on ghost tours because the city is basically built on the dead. And the dead arrived in several different ways, but it's a creepy kind of place. It's got a very gothic vibe. And when you go out at night, it's just a bunch of ghost tours everywhere you look.

1:25:04 So it's fun. If you live in the area and you want to go there, I think you'll have a good time. November 15th, Boiled Peanut Party. The fun never stops. Brooksville, New South Wales, Australia, November 15th. We have another meetup there. And then Tampa, Florida. Oh, no. November 21st. I might have to go. Coppertail Brewing. That's a good venue for an event. I'll see what I can do. And then November 25th, Sharpsburg, Pennsylvania, Hitchhiker Brewing. Wow. Well, the calendar is full, especially for the end of the year when I know we all have our own commitments to do on a personal level, but that is fun.

1:25:47 And I like seeing a Tampa one on there. I was going to make a Tampa one. I had a different place. I was going to try to make it happen. But I think we did Coppertail once before, and it was short notice. And I didn't say I was going to go and I ended up going. But let's plan on me being there this time. And let's see if we can blow it up. Anyway, anyone can make an event quick and easy. Find a local gathering place and just put it on the calendar. Usually in most major cities, I'm told you can expect about 10 or 15 people, which to me is a perfect size group to get to know each other and not burden any venue with some crazy crowd. And as you heard, many events end up being recurring. So it seems like a good time.

1:26:32 People are liking it. HiresideMeetups.com. RSVP, if you heard about one you plan to go to, it's just good manners. And of course, making one is easy. So, all right. Well, thanks again for listening. Thanks to Heather for being so cool to me and for coming back again. She's also got these Substack posts about the history of elite cannibalism and them eating mummies. It's crazy. We didn't even get to that. But join Plus if you can help me make that end of the year goal and just get twice as much show. Do it for yourself. But I have done my part. I'm getting out of here. Your move, Anunnaki Inc. agents, alternative media puppets, and Blood Witches of TikTok. You're fucking,

1:27:24 but she didn't buy in. She went to class, but saw through the spin. Got what she needed, and got out again. The academic double agent, Dr. Heatherlyn. The professors say, keep the boat for hockey. Keep the narratives intact. If you find something anomalous, that's something to subtract. Don't mess with success. So we got the tech stacked. When the truth comes knocking, how you gonna act?

1:28:19 Leave behind fancy credentials and crushing student loans that won't fund your studies. If you go against the crane, they got no cash for information. They don't wanna explain. explain. The professors say, Keep the boat from rocking, keep the narratives intact. If you find something anomalous, that's something to subtract. Don't mess with success, we got the deck stacked. But when the truth comes knocking, how you gonna act?

1:29:19 She enrolled, but she didn't buy in. She went to class, but saw through the spin. Got what she needed, and got out again. The academic double agent, Dr. Heatherlyn.