Ryan Peverly | Wilhelm Reich, Orgone Energy, & The Emotional Plague Of Mankind

00:10 The planet's puppet masters almost surely have a plan There clearly may be something there beyond Until we've thoroughly tested every last close chest of you I find the more you think, the less sure it is Where would we be without T.C.?

00:52 Here we go, Iriside Chatters doing the thing from the Sunshine State. I'm Greg Carlwood and in today's world it is about as obvious as ever that the global technocratic state expends great resources to control information and suppress any alternatives to one true mononarrative

01:33 on almost any subject that's important to them. They parade their experts across the media landscape, fund fact-checkers that only prop up establishment positions and launch sophisticated smear campaigns meant to discredit anyone who says otherwise because what we think and how we think are fundamental to the big machine maintaining tight control over the slave system in which we so casually acquiesce And when you look back at the 1940s and hear about a man who discovered what he called Orgone Energy, invented weather pattern controlling cloud buster devices that also sucked the energy from UFO's, emphasized and lectured on the energetic potential and importance of the orgasm, created energy-based healing chambers, rallied against fascism, and apparently even cured cancer.

02:19 It's no surprise that he was attacked and defamed by the system serving FDA, had six tons of his publications burned by order of the court. Was commanded to stop distributing Oregon accumulators and got locked up in prison when he didn't obey or he would ultimately die of heart failure just over a year later we should come to expect such things but hopefully were also intrigued to dig deeper into the details of what the system was so clearly threatened by Of course, I'm talking about the life and work of Wilhelm Reich. And today's guest Ryan Peverly, the host of the now completed A Culture & Lieber Ohio podcasts is just the guy to tell us more as he has dedicated a lot of time into researching Reich and even recently wrote a screenplay about him So why waste any more time? Let's get into it! The Reich researcher, Orgone enthusiast and strange stuff screenwriter Ryan welcome to The Higher Side

03:13 Greg, man I have to thank you for both the time and for making the most mundane guests feel special. You know? I look forward to digging into what has quickly become one of the most fascinating yet under-told stories about one of the most fascinating yet misunderstood figures in recent history and you did a great job of sort of encapsulating all that in your intro there so thanks for doing that and thanks for having me! Of course, man. This is gonna be a fun one! You had reached out to me to say that you heard the previous Rike-related episodes I've done and they covered some aspects of his work well enough but there are still missing pieces we've yet to explore and that we barely scratched the surface in terms of importance of his work specifically when it comes to the state of man today And that is intriguing to me so...I like

04:06 subjects to be covered in totality. If we left something out, I'm happy to go back and fill in the holes. I know we're going to have to back it up but give us a little preview or broad overview of what you consider important pieces of the Reich puzzle that don't get talked about as much as cloud busters and Oregon accumulators Yeah, so I think that like you said going back and kind of starting the story from the beginning is important because when a lot of us are first exposed to Reich and his work and ideas and theories and inventions it is more provocative stuff from his American period. But when you dig into research and you dig into the period before that

04:52 everything sets itself up early on in his life when he's with Sigmund Freud. And we'll get into what he did with Freud and some of the concepts that he dealt with there that informed, you know, his later work but in terms of what we're going to be talking about and I guess digging into further is this idea of the emotional plague of mankind which I think is an important concept to just illustrate real quickly upfront here because that is the sort of culmination of Reich's entire body of work. And he came to this conclusion that man was suffering from his own sort of naivete and ignorance, and there's a lot to discuss into or I guess as it relates to how he came to that conclusion which we'll get to

05:45 But the emotional plague of mankind, I think is what we're living through right now. And I think when you walk around in your local communities, you see this everywhere. You see what Reich would call armored individuals. You see people who are resistant. I hate these terms, but you see the Karens who try to dictate everything to everyone nowadays. You see the politicians who tried to dictate everything to everyone these days and I think that what Reich was doing was identifying a biological character flaw in individual men and women that contributed to this, and that this was a plague that was worse than any plague in the history of humanity. And you know whether plagues existed or not we don't need to get into but this is how Reich thought and talked about it right?

06:36 And to him, this was the most egregious threat to the future of man and really to the children of the future which he dedicated a lot of his later work too. If you pick up a book like The Murder Of Christ, you'll see it's dedicated to the children in the future. He was very interested even from his early days in helping the youth and the working class which we'll get into as well. So this idea of this plague is something that I knew nothing about when I was reading about Cloudbusters, right? And reading about what were labeled sex boxes. You know the Oregon Accumulators those are the more provocative and sexier ideas that we get introduced to but these other concepts that he dealt with i think are what I would love to flesh out to your audience because Reich was a complicated individual. He was a complicated man. He was a complicated professional

07:27 He was just a complicated being, you know? And he's so much more than I think of what people in these spaces like these podcasts Occupy talk about. He's an artist. He's a philosopher. He's an alchemist. He's an energy medicine pioneer. He's a biologist and at his root, he's a psychoanalyst. And I think that those are the missing pieces that we should try to fill in here today as best we can Yeah, I think that's a really great summary. And of course context is key and going back to the beginning of where a lot of his foundational ideas and the lattice work of his later ideas comes from is important. And I understand like, I totally acknowledge we live in a sexually repressed society and that comes out in the West in so many unhealthy ways

08:20 But when we get into Sigmund Freud, I've always just kind of felt like he overemphasized sexuality and the Oedipus complex and this sort of stuff. It's just never really been my bag. It's not that it's hard to talk about. It's just, to me, an over-emphasis. Sometimes it gets really weird. And I actually grabbed this from Reich's biography—it's right on his Wikipedia page but He was taught at home until he was 12 when his mother was discovered to be having an affair with his live-in tutor. Reich wrote about the affair in 1920 in his first published paper, about a case of breaching the incest taboo presented in The Third Person as though

09:06 to be about a patient. He wrote that he would follow his mother when she went to the Tudor's bedroom at night, feeling ashamed and jealous and wondering if they would kill him if they found out that he knew. He briefly thought of forcing her to have sex with him on the threat of telling his father. In the end, he did tell his father. After a protracted period of beatings, his mother committed suicide on October 1st 1910 for which Reich blamed himself I mean, man that is going to create some complexes in a person. But it's that kind of stuff that just makes me think some of these guys are freaks. I also don't like where psychology has gone and psychiatry has gone over the years. Of course it's a big mess these days

09:52 But I guess talk to us about some of this stuff. It is clearly important, Oregon energy...I tend to equate it more with the ether but that isn't right. He thought it was sexual energy so let's just lay it out as he would have. Well, I'd like to address the youth period very quickly because you mentioned it and yeah I don't know. It's a young boy and I do think young people have sexual curiosities, and now...I don't know about the incest taboo and I don't know about the sort of Oedipal complex as Freud described it. I don't know if those things are true. I've never had those thoughts myself but maybe I'm sure you haven't either." And it's like yeah some of that stuff is a little out there

10:37 I know very, very little about Freud. But what I've learned from Freud about Freud through this process of learning more about Reich was that Freud tended to project a lot of his own bullshit into his psychoanalytical theories which becomes problematic when you realize that he's the sort-of godfather of this scientific practice and everybody defers to him as the quote unquote expert here So he becomes this really, really interesting figure to look at in that context where it's almost cult-like the command that he has

11:16 over the young psychoanalytical crowd that's following him in the late 1800s. And then, you know, Reich doesn't come through until 1919 and meets him so there is just a very long time period here where he has built up this following and it becomes cult-like and these ideas become dogmatic. This is why I think Reich does set himself apart from that and Carl Jung did too they had a famous break about 10 or 15 years before Reich even met Freud. But Jung became tired of the dogma as well and went and did his own thing, and Freud found that problematic, of course. And Reich did the same thing later which we could get into but just to address that thing about Freud and just the youth struggles that he had

12:01 I don't necessarily hang my hat on anything Freudian when it comes to Oedipal complexes or incestual fantasies, but there's a lot of data and casework that Reich writes about in his early patients where they did describe these same fantasies. They did describe these sort of incestual fantasies or this sort of like Oedipal complex I don't want to disregard that as something that some people may have thought about or fantasized about over their youth, or even maybe their adulthood. But I've never personally gravitated towards that. It doesn't really add much to this story here that is relevant and we won't be talking about it but I'm glad you brought it up because it needs to be addressed. And so I lost the second part of your question...so maybe you could rephrase that for me if you want? Oh sure!

12:55 I tend to, because I want it to be true, equate Orgone energy with the Ether. But he actually had pretty well-defined differences between how he thought of the Ether and Orgone energy. And Orgone energy is more associated with the orgasm rather than the fabric of consciousness or fabric of energy in the universe And it's probably important to be accurate about that rather than how we want it to be. But I also just wanted to say, Freud being the uncle of Edward Bernays always sent up a red flag for me and kind of being foundational to atheism actually informs the emotional plague of mankind that you brought up like I think a lot of the reasons we have a spiritual crisis today is because atheism was seeded so hard

13:47 in the West. But, you know these are just the kind of things that I think about on the periphery of such material and when adult men are just really borderline obsessed with the sexual thoughts of children that gets to be strange territory but regardless talk to us about Reich's thoughts on Orgone energy and its connection to sexual energy the way he would have said it yeah so you're actually both right And I wouldn't say you're wrong. Story of my life? Well, you're right in the sense that Ether does connect to this it's just we have to define our terms and what we mean by that and if we have to go back to defined terms then we might as well just go back to what Reich would call the function of the orgasm and this was sort of, I guess to use a pun, the breakthrough in his professional life and his work

14:47 worked a lot with Freud's idea of libido, right? And that's kind of an outdated term these days and you use the term sexual energy which is what I prefer. It's a little bit easier to comprehend and to grasp what that is because we've all been sexually excited and we know there's an energetic component to that so... That was an early example too of what will call energy work or energy medicine which I think it also just important to throw in here The way that Freud talked about it was that it was the fundamental energy of all expressions of love, pleasure and self-preservation. And so that's what libido is at its core. It's nothing perverse...it's nothing bad in its own essence

15:36 It's just the fundamental expression of love, pleasure and self-preservation. And if you look that up in a dictionary today, that is exactly what you will find. That is the definition people still work with it as. So Reich was introduced to this concept obviously as a young student in Vienna and he gets into the Freudian crowd after being sort of disenchanted with law which he majored for a very short time then went to medical school which he did complete He did get that prestigious MD next to his name But he'd never worked as a medical doctor. He actually fell in with the Freudian crowd very early, and when he's introduced to this idea of libido or sexual energy based on the youth story that you just read to us... You could see why someone like that who was exposed to sexual energy and sexual trauma as well very early in his life would gravitate towards something like that. And so

16:31 When he got into the work though itself, you know. He found very quickly that the energy was blocked in a lot of his patients that these neurotic symptoms which we'll call mental health symptoms today... You know back in that day it was called neurosis and psychosis were sort of the two buckets that they would toss these mental health disorders into We don't use those terms anymore so if I say neurotic I'm just referring to mental health and or mental health disorders, specifically things like schizophrenia paranoia and so on. And so he would be able to observe in his cases with these patients who were mostly in the working class too which I think is also important but we don't have the cover off on all that right now but these neurotic symptoms that he observed

17:22 he connected back to these blockages and energy flow in the body. And because he was in the libido headspace, let's call it everything to him was sexual at that time so he was working with patients who for example would come in and they would relay symptoms to him about you know, any sort of mental health disorder. You know I'm depressed, I'm anxious, I can't eat and then sexual things like I can't get an erection and so on and so on. And he's doing talk therapy for a while before he realizes this isn't working we're not really treating anybody, we're not making anybody better. It wasn't until he kind of went and did his own thing that he started to see tremendous results

18:11 in that and is when he started to work with that energy as not just a sexual energy, but a biological energy. That was brought on by what he called genital disturbances now that sounds sexual but it's actually biological because the genitals are a biological organ we all have them they all have a function right? And Reich just noticed that when he was talking to patients they would express themselves differently if they could describe their sex life to him. And I know that sounds problematic, but basically what he was seeing was people who were more satisfied with their sex life and able to find more pleasure and gratification during the sex act exhibited less mental health symptoms.

19:05 And so he focused a lot in this early period of his life, in the 1920s on just discharging what he called sexual energy. That was trying to help remove the blocks by talking to patients about what was bothering them but also beginning to touch them as well and he's kind of a pioneer in body work too and that comes later but he was really focus on this idea of the proper genital orgasm. And that's what he was observing, was that once he was able to get to the root of the patient's problem and connect it back to something in their youth that was at either the stage of development —that was called the genital stage— or that involved something sexual... Once they sort of talked about that and cleared that emotional block

19:59 they reported better overall health and better satisfaction in the sexual area. So that part of the story, it's extremely sexual and I get that and that can make some people uncomfortable. I get that because you're talking to random people about their sex life and about their, sort of the potency of their orgasms but that is what he was doing. And I don't want to shy away from that and ignore that so I think defining this further would help people understand it too. He called this orgastic potency, it was literally the potency of one's ability to achieve a proper orgasm. Now to Reich though, a proper orgasm wasn't necessarily ejaculation. It was a full body convulsion and the ejaculation of course is a byproduct of that but it was more about

20:58 the entire body musculature convulsing at the climax of the sex act. And what this did through his work and his observations was that it loosened all of this biological and muscular tension, this stuck energy in the body. He would later go on to describe this as character armor or muscular armor but he noted that the more potent energetic release was the fewer symptoms that his patients exhibited. So I think that, you know just to further define those terms, zyrogastic potency term... That's kind of self-explanatory someone who is able to achieve regular potent orgasms is healthy

21:47 and those who can't are orgastically impotent. So he theorized that it was just this lack of potent orgasm that was the root cause of all neurosis, all mental health disorders. And he would also go a little further and use more relevant sort of sex life terms that we all use like lovemaking. He would say the quality of love making not the quantity was assigned to potency For example, if a man could quote unquote last all night and not orgasm. That was actually assigned the man was not potent he was not able to find release or satisfaction from the experience because they were unable to surrender or let go Or as you would actually say to melt into what he called the genital embrace that's what he called The sex act was you were just embracing

22:41 your genitals were just embracing each other in an act of love. And he did not like the term fucking, he used it only to describe the sex act without love, the sex act between these sort of hardened armored people And so his work here, going back to what I just said about the man who can't let go and sort of melt during sex and ends up lasting all night. It really calls into question too this idea of masculinity and how we perceive or define that in actual men. You know? I think being able to last for hours has always been something that we men hang our hat on as some sort of trophy or achievement

23:18 But Reich would say, no. You're literally hard all night without release and your body never softens and because you can't soften and you can't release, you remain sick. And so this is the energy that he was working with I guess some of these energetic principles and concepts in his early days. Now, I don't know if that answers your question fully because I just wanted to sort of set that foundation for how he interacted with these ideas of sex in orgasm And if you want to get me back on track here, feel free. But I can touch on the sort of ether and the orgone connection that comes later if you would like me too. Yeah, obviously we're kind a little all over the place but I thought that was a really great breakdown of some somewhat complicated material to talk about. You could say there's an analogy to the sexual dichotomy you laid out with just

24:16 it being kind of a paradox that it is a weakness for men to never display the quote-unquote weaker emotions. If you never cry, you never express that your unhappy or sad You know, we consider that there's like a flip on that where society considers that a strong man. But you could also say that actually that man is the weakest one because he's unwilling to open up to the full range of emotions or display the full range of emotions and they're just talking about that in a sexual context and I do think that's interesting their stuff too

24:52 think about in there. We've done shows about Kundalini experiences that women have had, Dr. Joanna Kujawa and it really seems like a potent aspect of sexuality that is just completely lost in the West and it might harken back to a lot of the iconography of the female goddesses and what their gifts really were this ability to facilitate a Kundalini experience And the West is clearly all mixed up when it comes to sexuality and the potency of the energy there, and how it can be harnessed and used in a healthy person's life.

25:31 So, yeah. There's material here that is compelling and I guess just before we go into Orgone and the Aether, I wanted to ask you about your personal experiences with this because you mentioned to me that Reich's work helped you overcome a nasty porn and sex addiction and that maybe some of that blockage was removed. And more recently, you've experienced a higher level of that potency than maybe a lot of other people haven't experienced. A lot of other men probably haven't They think that the orgasm is the ejaculation and you really don't know what you're missing until you maybe reach that next level or plateau. I'm also just curious if this relates to circumcision, or what Reich thought about circumcision? Because when I watched that documentary American Circumcision...

26:24 Saw that there's like much like for women. There's multiple different organs that facilitate a male orgasm in different types But we cut those off of children, so we're left with just one organism And it's kind of a really messed up thing. You don't know what you're missing, so a lot of men just kind of write it off as like well is what it is but yeah, it's significant. It's more significant than people realize but I guess talk to us about some of these things your own experiences and you know what other people might be missing? I guess just to go back to what you said about the addiction, that is something that I've not really talked a lot about publicly obviously because it's a bit embarrassing at first when you realize that you have some sort of problem. And especially in this area of sex and pornography which is so prevalent in our society. You can go on the internet right now and spend a day down the Pornhub rabbit hole. It's very detrimental though

27:20 for a lot of reasons. And I think, for me chief among them was that you know i did have some sexual trauma in my youth that I did not really address until I was probably 35. I'm 39 now, you know? And it's like... I didn't realize how that was driving and dictating my behavior just this one experience when i was 18 years old essentially formed the entire 20s and early 30s drove me to some unhealthy behaviors and habits and relationships It wasn't until I dug into Reich's work that I started to make sense of what I was dealing with in my own body, that I wasn't an addict necessarily. That what I was doing is exhibiting what he would call compulsive behavior and habitual behavior as a means to try to get my body back to homeostasis

28:20 And there was something about my biology that wasn't balanced and my hormones or, you know, just overall health. Like there was just something about me that wasn't in balance." And learning about his work led me to this idea that I just described to you about orgastic potency and how I had realized that I had never experienced that before. And then beyond that, this attempt to feel better all the time like whenever I would feel down or depressed or anxious like some people pick up a bottle of Jack Daniels. Some people snort crack, I don't know like there's so many different vices and addictions out there and mine was just you know i'm just gonna sit down and just try to clear this energy out. And I think in hindsight it may be one of the healthiest addictions that you could have or compulsions because it feels good of course but then you're not satisfied afterwards and it wasn't until I came across these ideas that I just shared with you guys

29:20 that I started to process my own biology and how my body worked. And granted, I'm just using one man's explanation of this. This is not a panacea. This is not an end all be all solution. I do think Reich has a holistic form of health here that could be studied by a lot of people and find benefit from but I'm not going to hang my hat on this as the only way but for me This felt like the way because of my own life story because of my own experiences this clicked for me and it made sense And it wasn't until I started to focus on my body Energetically, my energetic health in general. This goes beyond diet this goes beyond supplementation This even goes beyond exercise in a lot of ways

30:04 It wasn't until I started to focus on my body energetically that i started to feel some of that stuck energy clear out. And it's been a years-long process for me, and I've kind of avoided sexual encounters during that process because I didn't think that was, at some point a healthy expression of my own behavior. Was to continue to be compulsive and habitual in this act. And so I just took a break. I was abstinent for a long time and just allowed my body to sort of course correct itself by focusing more on that energetic component, which you've had many shows about this. I've done bile field tuning with Eileen McKusick. I've done sound healing with some other practitioners. You know, I've done some Kundalini exercises. I've done all of these things that you've talked about and that your audience is familiar with. I kind of feel like my body is a laboratory

30:59 It's a gift for me to experience life in this body right now, and I should test it. I should put myself in different situations where I'm feeling different types of sensations and different types of energy flow." And so I went into all of this. I've done light therapy, I've done hyperbaric oxygen stuff, I've done cold therapy... All this stuff was important in getting me back to a sort of baseline I could function what I would call more normally for myself in my own body to just feel more like I was a functional organism and not this sort of rigid mechanical robot walking around bipedally, just going through the motions so to speak. But the thing is it's just how a lot of us live. We kind of do have these repetitive motions that we go through every day and we don't know why. And it's very abnormal

31:56 anti-life, if you think about it. It's not living and so I just came around to all this and reading what Reichs work intellectually and philosophically and then doing some of the things that i just mentioned just led me to this breakthrough where I met someone new we started a relationship It was the first time I went into a relationship like this with this body of mine, right? With this mind of mine. This sort of cleared out energy. I just felt more like myself and... The experiences that I've had in this relationship sexually speaking are so night and day to what I experienced before where you know, I don't want to go too much into the gory details of it because I don't think that's why we're here And I know I'm rambling on about this Greg So I apologize but those experiences

32:47 I don't know people are missing out because they kind of scared the shit out of me in a lot of ways. Because I felt so energized that I was overwhelmed by it and if you ever like have, if you've ever like woken up when your arms asleep? Like you sleep on your arm wrong and you got that feeling of just like you can't feel anything sure That's kind of how it felt in a more positive way It's a similar feeling but it didn't feel...like I wasn't worried about it. It was just like there were these these energetic sensations just shooting down my arms. I've never felt this before, and it was overwhelming and I had to sort of stop myself and be like what is going on here? And the satisfaction that I found afterwards from that experience was very different than any other type of satisfaction that I have... Well, I guess I can't even say that I would been

33:37 satisfied before, you know? This sort of energetic release was something that I think that I had built myself up to over the course of a few years of just focusing on myself. And it sort of coalesced in that moment, so to speak. So again, I don't want to say people are missing out on it but Reich would say you are, absolutely. I don't want to say that but Reich would say you all are missing out on this. This is how your biology is supposed to function. You're supposed to feel this. Your body is supposed to convulse and it's supposed to be releasing energy when you build this sort of excitation up in your body like this is how you are supposed to function. You are a functional organism. You are not mechanical

34:18 And I think that when you look at not just your behaviors every day, but if you want to go into your sex life. Look how you have sex? Is it mechanical or is it just going through the motion so-to speak? Or is there a form and function of what you're doing right? How was that expressed in the climax of that act? I didn't mean to put you on blast with all your personal life, but it helps to inform why out of all the subjects you might have covered in your podcast. You gravitated to this and it helps validate that there is some merit in Reich's perspective because you do have lived experience that

34:56 shows that you did reach a new level by diving deeper down this particular rabbit hole. And of course, as you know from a podcast that does focus a little more on the esoteric and magical side they say the secret at the heart of Freemasonry or the OTO is the uses of sexual energy and maybe how intertwined it can be with manifestation. And these are just other elements of sexual energy that are totally off the radar for most people, even though we have partners, we consider them loves our lives, our best friends, we do The Act for decades with them and sometimes we don't even explore

35:41 different ways of doing it or different applications are just ways to push further into that territory and I think that's all healthy stuff that could and should be explored but to get back to Reich When it comes to some of this foundational scientific work and philosophy that leads up to Oregon Energy, you had mentioned bioelectrical experiments. I'm kind of interested in that when it comes up in previous episodes with experiments where certain frequencies are shot into

36:17 tadpole eggs and they turn into salamanders or whatever the hell, like making a salmon grow three times their size. There's definitely a bioelectrical layer to the body that rarely gets talked about and it's kind of an esoteric science but what would you say about that? And just some of the other important stuff to talk about on our lead up to The Big Show here. Yeah yeah...the climax so to speak Let's talk about character armor first, because I think that leads into the bio-electrical stuff really well. So as I attempted probably poorly to outline earlier just this function of the orgasm with this orgastic potency, this idea of sexual energy, Reich saw that the character armor which is a term I mentioned earlier

37:06 was something that sort of layered itself, built itself over the musculature in the body and that this energetic armor was something that prevented proper energy flow. And this then would lead to a physical expression or presentation that we're all kind of too familiar with tension throughout the body and your muscles and tissues, poor posture, awkward gait, nervous system issues, pinched nerves and things like that And he concluded that this armor not only led to a more rigid biological structure, but also a more rigid character structure or a more like rigid emotional structure. People who are basically what he would call uptight and conservative kind of fit this mold because they're rigid. They're not open to new ideas. They're not open to new experiences. They want things to stay exactly the same at all the time because it's predictable

38:01 And to him, that was robotic. That was mechanical and that was armored because their energy is suppressed it is repressed and you know that's kind of I think just an interesting component to his work that again doesn't get discussed a lot but if you just look at his psychoanalytical work by itself That's his legacy. It's not even the function of the orgasm necessarily, because that was kind of shit upon by a lot of people. A lot of Freudian fanboys—his colleagues and peers—didn't really take the orgastic potency seriously

38:39 So if you're having doubts out there, you're not the only ones. But the character armor was something that everybody gravitated towards and it made a lot of sense biologically even though these people were not biologists they were psychologists like they still recognize that I guess if your scientist can't deny the science because he would present case studies over and over about this character armor and then removing it just the life flow coming back to these patients. And so that work was taken a lot more seriously And that is what sort of led him to this idea of bioelectricity. He essentially invented bodywork at this time, too... I think I mentioned that earlier, you know just gestalt therapy and some other systems that people might be familiar with but he took an interest in biology after his observations of physical character expression in his patients

39:36 What he did was, and this I think is the most important part of his work that doesn't get discussed as much because he had a lot of conversations with Freud in the 1920s about verifying or measuring libido. And Freud was keen on this until he wasn't and that's a whole other story if you want to touch on that we can but that's kind of the more speculative thread that we could pull on But Reich had always been fascinated by the idea of verifying scientifically, the existence of libido or sexual energy. And he's able to do this in Oslo Norway in 1930s there is about a five-year period of his life right before he leaves for America where he starts a series of experiments called The Bioelectrical Experiments. So he starts this series of experiments and also Norway called The Bioelectrical Experiments and it's about a five year period

40:34 And there's other experiments that follow with different life forms and different organisms that we could touch on too. But to address just what you asked about, he took a bunch of patients and he hooked them up with electrodes to a device that could measure electrical current in the body. It's called an oscillograph. You've probably heard of it. You probably have seen it if you pull one up on the internet right now, it's a very basic looking machine. And it just has wires coming out of it and the electrodes he would hook up to different parts of the body your temples and your testicles I mean, he would just do at all like he would put them anywhere because what he was trying to do was measure the energy flow in the body in specific, I guess erogenous zones will be the best way to describe that temple is behind the ears around the neck

41:23 And what he found was pretty astonishing. He would stimulate patients with different stimulants, he would do very simple things like put sugar or salt on their tongue because the tongue is sort of erogenous too and see...and the tongue is a muscle by the way which we don't talk about as much but it's one of the most powerful muscles in the body and so he would test the tongue with salt and sugar and he would notice that based on the reaction, the energetic reaction to the electrical reaction to these stimulants that the readings on the machine would increase. And so there was a legitimate sort of energetic component or I guess energetic response to these physical sensations and even though we're talking about taste with tongue there, there was still an energetic response. So when you moved to other areas of the body he would do various things

42:15 I guess he would like run feathers over people's arms, right? Just like very slight sensations that would also produce electrical sensations in the skin that were measured. You know he would tickle people under the arms and just try to get them to laugh and found out you know that increased energy flow as well it was measurable it was showing up on these readings Mm hmm. And he also, you know I mentioned he did, you know do some sexual experiments with this as well with the genitals and had people kissing each other when they were hooked up to these things? I don't know for sure but i think he did watch people have sex doing this just to measure the response. I don't know if it was by themselves or with other people

42:58 but I've seen some stories about that and i don't have any reason to doubt them. But the readings were the same too, like every time he stimulated someone with these positive sensations the electrical current would increase and it was visible on the machines now in contrast he would do other things that were more negative he would yell at people I don't think he would hit people, but he would definitely like kind of pinch them and give them sensations that weren't as positive in these same areas. And those readings would always go down the electrical flow or current would actually decrease in the body because of that

43:38 And so this was a series of experiments, like I said that took place over the course of probably one to two years in Norway. That led into some other work that...I don't know if you want to touch on that stuff but that is sort of the bioelectrical component in a nutshell he did this because he wanted to validate essentially the theory of sexual energy and the theory of what would become orgone energy, because this is the precursor to him creating that term. It's rooted in these biological bioelectrical experiments in Norway. Right on! Yeah I think that's super interesting. Energy flow like looking at nature it seems like if you

44:23 don't have good energy flow, you will develop some sort of issues and blockages. And we know that oxidative stress and stress itself is one of the biggest factors in early grave. Perhaps that's because we have these blockages and maybe good sexual medicine could relieve us of that stress that we seem to be carrying around. You mentioned Norway. I believe this is where the Bion experiments came in too, and I wanted to touch on that because Reich as a cancer researcher who maybe had like real success in curing cancer is another aspect I almost never hear about but it seems pretty consequential. It does yeah! It's actually you mentioned up front like all the things that people do and that Reich have done that get swept under the rug because they don't fit into

45:17 the mainstream, you know, medico-scientific establishment viewpoints. You know, Reich took an interest in cancer research because of Freud actually. Freud was diagnosed with cancer about 1923 and you know, Reich being his sort of colleague star pupil so to speak really became interested in what would have caused cancer in Freud to begin with? And when he was still working with the sort of libido sexual energy stuff in 1920s specifically, he had his own theories and thoughts about that in terms of did the armoring lead to cancerous formation in the body? Did this repetitive stuck energy lead to cancer formation in the body. And so he developed some ideas early on but it wasn't until he got to Oslo and

46:10 and after these bioelectrical experiments that he really dug in because I think for the first time, not only did he have access to a scientific laboratory but that the equipment actually existed for him to be able to do this stuff. And I think we take it for granted all the things, if you walk into a hospital today like my god you're overwhelmed with all the machines and things that they can use to treat you and measure you and all this stuff. That didn't exist 100 years ago! And it wasn't until 1930s that Reich was able to actually use a microscope for the first time. This is what led to these bion experiments now Greg I'll be very honest with you this is very complex science and I'm going to do my best to summarize it so if its little clunky I apologize because it's very very

46:58 It's just hard to explain. It's hard to read it and it's hard to explain it all good All right, sure And I'm kind of like you like I'll read a dense 700 page book about this stuff But I won't retain at all Right, right? I'll retain the sort of crux in the essence of the 10% that I think is relevant and so that's what I'm gonna share here Is just what I think is relevant about these experiences. And so Right? Because of the electrical response in the body that he saw in his human patients, he just kind of assumed that well if this electricity and this energy flow is measurable in man it has to be measurable in other life forms. And so you can start to see the seeds of the Orgone theory propagating here right like these are the sort of early thoughts he's having about a life force energy

47:49 And so he takes this bioelectrical experience and he turns this to different life forms. They experiment on mice, and they see the same thing. They start to experiment with plant matter, grass, soil...and see the same thing. He really starts to get interested in what we'll call cellular life or microscopic life, bacteria. Because these are the original life forms I think if you really trace the story back like that's kind of where we all start as these single-celled organisms. Some people will call that the zygote these days. So Reich started these bio experiments with protozoa and protozoa if anybody doesn't know it is just another fancy scientific term for a single cell organism and he took this protozoa and he grew

48:42 cultured vesicles, which are vesicles again another fancy term for basically just a structure within or outside of a cell. And so you take this single-celled organism and you put it in this environment, and you just see what happens. You're just trying to see how this responds to the environment." And he used different things. He used different stimulants I guess too, to bring that term back. He use grass, he use sand, he used iron filings, he used animal tissue, and he put this around the protozoa in these cultured environments, and he boiled these

49:21 to incandescence, right? So he just lit these things up. He added some different ingredients here and there just to experiment. He threw in some potassium here and there. He threw in some gelatin here and there. And he lights these things up. What he sees growing after a little while in this environment after it's exposed to this heat is... He writes that he saw bright glowing blue light in this environment. This is what he calls the bionds And he believed that these were a rudimentary form of life because he would also grow these bionds in environments that were sterile. So, he's covering all his bases here. He is growing them with things that are living like grass and sand

50:10 and he's also growing these things with dead animal tissue. And so there's life and death in these vesicles with these protozoa, and he's seeing that the single-celled organism is essentially coming to life during these experiments. He felt like this was life being spontaneously generated. He then discovers that not only is this life being spontaneously generated, but in that animal tissue that he was experimenting with. That upon further examination he found cancer cells in some of these tissues and he was like well how the hell is this thing growing? In an environment where there's dead animal tissue laced with cancer cells And so he gets even more curious

51:07 pulls out some of these cancer cells individually, and he sets them on a slide. And he takes some of these cells that the bionds have formed and he puts them on the same slide under a microscope. He watches the healthy bionic cells just disintegrate the cancer cells almost immediately. This is what leads him to the idea that oh wow you know, so there's something about this light blue energy that I'm seeing. This life energy that i think can treat cancer he never used the word cure he always said cancer patients that he treated were symptom free and he began to treat a lot of cancer patients both in Norway and then more specifically when he came to America after that this is

51:57 where the organ accumulator box comes from as well. And a lot of cancer patients were treated in there." And so basically, he is just... Man! I don't know anyone else who goes from libido to cancer research and it's the same through line, right? It's the same thread of scientific experimentation that just continues to evolve. And I tell people all the time that In this weird era that we live in where people want you to trust the science, Reich was just trusting the science. He just followed one single theory from the 1920s up until his death and everything that came during that is a product of him following that one idea and this cancer research is another stop on the road for him. This is what leads into the idea of Orgone Energy

52:51 And he coins that term, he makes that term up. It's short for organism and orgasm and bion is thrown in there as well. He just creates this new term to describe what he thinks he has discovered, this sort of life force energy, this glowing blue light energy. Unfortunately, he isn't the first one to discover it. I mean, he isn't our modern context. He was the first one to measure it scientifically but He just discovered what all of the ancient cultures and indigenous peoples of this world have known for a long time. The East, they call it chi, they call it prana. You mentioned kundalini earlier I guess that's a little bit of a different idea but these ideas are old. They are so old. They're so ancient but Reich is on this path where he is... For better or worse, he's a material scientist through and through

53:47 It changes a little bit later in his life if you want to get to, you know, his ideas on spirituality later. But he's discovered this thing I think that we take for granted right? That we think is maybe not real because we can't see it but he took this into the laboratory and he showed that there is something electrical there is something energetic here and not only that but this actually is a disease treating energy. And that if the organism has this energy flowing properly, it will never get sick. It will never have cancer. It will never have diabetes. It will never have any mental health expressions." I hope that covers off a little bit of what you wanted to talk about there but that's kind of the depth of my knowledge on the bionds and I think the sort of crux of the experiments to begin with because as you can tell this is very dense stuff that i'm not an expert on

54:42 I know people who are if you want to talk to them, they'll probably talk about it in a much better and more satisfying way. Well i think that's a great breakdown! I've never really heard the foundational experiments described that way and it does kind of speak to a type of bioluminescence, a soul energy just a vibrancy...a life energy as you say? And I agree that these ideas are pretty ancient. It was really a rediscovery on his part That's a huge rabbit hole. As you know, are we really progressing through history or are we regressing? Are we trying to reclaim our former perfected state or exalted state? I definitely lean more that direction

55:27 Society has probably intentionally steered us into a lot of these cul-de-sacs that we're now waking up from in the various sciences. It's tough to know exactly what aspect of Reich's work poked the bear the hardest, I would assume it was some of this stuff but as you noted not only were his works burned by order of the court at the end of his life but also the Nazis in a previous chapter of his life also gathered up a bunch of his material and set it ablaze. And that's gotta be a unique characteristic, I don't know many people who've gone through that experience twice or even

56:07 Published enough material to create a pile worth burning, but as you said to me. It's probably part of that project paperclip Continuity that has the same kind of people wanting to suppress what he's revealing while also studying it in in secret behind the curtain showing that it has validity otherwise they wouldn't be interested at all or probably wouldn't even waste their time suppressing it because they like to see us confused and going in the wrong direction. Yeah, I would agree with that and I think you touched on something that I also didn't know about before I started reading into this was, I don't know of any man on record or woman on record who's had books burned by two different governments at two different times in their life for the same reason. And yeah it is... Maybe there are some paperclip shenanigans going on there as well because the Nazis in the 30s and US government in the 50s

57:04 You can make a case it's kind of the same crowd, right? Yeah. But I think that this brings up the idea of... And I know you covered this previously with Shemangineer but I think this mass psychology of fascism which is a book that Wright wrote actually predates his Norway period that we just talked about but it builds off of the orgasm and character armor stuff if you don't mind if I could talk about that for just a moment Go for it Cool. Yeah, so this sort of like mass psychology of fascism the more I think about it and the more that i read about It's not only my favorite aspect of Reichs work but I think in our current socio-political climate its way too relevant right now Its the most relevant aspect I think of Reichs work if you want to just actually project his work onto culture and society at large

57:54 We know fascism though, as a sort of political ideology. And we just mentioned the Nazis it's associated with the Nazis is associated with this heavy handed authoritarian totalitarian ideology and to Reich that actually existed everywhere you could look in our daily lives He saw it at home, he saw it at school. He saw it at your workplace. He saw it in the church and everything for him based on what you said earlier about his childhood, it all starts at home for him and this sort of fascist structure that we're unfortunately too used to in our society starts with the father. It starts with the authoritarian family unit. That's how he described but these are not my words

58:52 And because of that sort of top-down structure, this is where that repression is created. This is where that sexual suppression is created and I want to extend that sexual suppression out too...I just think we should call it an energetic expression or an energetic repression that's created in the biology, because you're not really allowed to express yourself. You're definitely not allowed to express yourself sexually in these fascist environments but also I don't think a lot of people feel comfortable expressing themselves energetically either where they just think about something as simple as laughter when you're in the wrong environment it's really hard to laugh when you're not feeling well or you're around people who are giving off these sort of

59:39 bad vibes, these authoritarian vibes. You don't really feel like your body is functioning naturally and your entire energy flow is just damned up I think. Yeah that's really interesting because he's kind of saying it's a flip on what we typically hear which is that the nuclear family is the thing holding the west together and Of course, a nuclear family just being a mom dad and a couple of kids doesn't have to be fascist or authoritarian. It's kind of the tone and approach that a father might take but structurally there is ahead of that pyramid I guess no matter how loving that father is

1:00:20 I'm just curious if Reich ever talked about a better way that he thought children should be raised. Was he more of an it-takes-a village kind of person? Because in today's world, that is equated to the state and the state likes to project well we should all be raising your kids. And its like well...I don't agree with that either! So I don't know, but it is an interesting flip on what the Jordan Petersons of the world and everybody is just saying is required to keep the West from unraveling. Is that nuclear family unit? Yeah, and right did have some thoughts on that he was the ultimate anti authoritarian in general. And so He would never say that the state should raise your child you know, he was very much against the state as an institution especially later in his life when he fought against them for so many years

1:01:10 But basically, he saw children as not really his children. He always referred to them as young people you know? I shouldn't say he always referred to them as young people but he talked about them as a young people a lot and that as young people they should be autonomous they should be able to choose their own education, for example. This is kind of popular now with this sort of unschooling wave that's happened the last few years where the kids are choosing their curriculums in some of these environments because when you force these sorts of things onto kids, you create suppression and repression and not just sexual but this is energetic

1:01:57 this sort of creates this relationship at home that then gets mimicked in these other environments as you go out into the world, that the workplace takes the same shape. The state takes the same shape. The church takes the same shape." But he thought that children should be autonomous and one of his most radical periods in the late 1920's was saying they should be autonomous in all aspects of their life including sexuality And only with people their age, he was not incestual. He was not pedophilic in any way from what I can tell. Although he has been accused of that we should mention that but this whole period where he's talking about the sort of autonomy of children in their lives is his answer to this as he saying

1:02:46 Nuclear family is fine. It's healthier to have a mother and father who are there in your household to support you, but they should support you Support was the key word? They should not dictate to you And as long as there was a mutual respect both ways of the relationship that everybody in the family should be autonomous and that he proposed to Freud this radical reconstruction of the family unit. I don't know how he would accomplish that because it was just theoretical, I don't know how you would implement that in a worldwide manner but I think in terms of the analytical crowd and their teachings and their dealings with their patients like this is what he was preaching

1:03:26 we need to radically reshape the way that the family is structured. And giving children autonomy over their lives was the sort of key feature of that. Yeah, I mean, to a degree, I definitely am of that mindset. Kids are irrational, they don't really know the world you don't want to let them run out into the street but to a degree for sure. They should be self-directed, and a lot of times when my daughter's making a mess me and my wife are like well she is learning you know she is playing with her food sure but like you can't stop it every single time and just kind of forget as an adult that those are experiences driven by curiosity and exploration and eventually they'll wind down

1:04:12 But getting back to fascism, is there anything more to say? To put a finer point on Reich's thoughts about fascism and how it might relate today before we get into some of the weird stuff. Yeah. I think that he would ultimately say his sort of major theory on fascism was that this sort of armored character structure that we touched on earlier was what made people more susceptible to these fascist and authoritarian ideas. That man's musculature is so rigid that the rigidity of the fascist state, and all their ideas of restricting you actually appealed most to these kinds of people because it matched their own inner life. So that the external reality that they were interacting in mimicked their own sort of inner reality. And because of that, it was more desirable here

1:05:08 you know, Reich was very frustrated by that. I mean he dealt with that face to face for many years and he was always wondering like what the hell is going on in people? That they cannot see this why can't you not see fascism when it's right in front of you and why don't you do something about it? And he would always say well we always see it when we look back oh we should have seen it right we should have seen this happening while it was happening It was very obvious that it was happening but for some reason Not everybody sees it when it's obvious that it's happening. And he would just ask these questions over and over, he got obsessed by this for about three years. His ultimate answer I think to that question was that the individual is so ignorant to their own life, their own health and their own character structure... Mm-hmm. ...and everyone else around them is as well. That this ignorance is what leads to this sort of lack of recognition. It leads you into areas of asking

1:06:11 and debating questions that ultimately have no meaning, that have no purpose. It just leads you into these fruitless areas of exploration and experience when while you're doing that the state on the side is gearing up for the ultimate takeover of the body or the ultimate takeover of society or the world at large or however you want to phrase it or look at it you know, that plagued him for a lot of years. And unfortunately he fell victim to that system and we might talk about that more in the second hour but I think that...I ask that question almost every day when i'm out in the world now or I guess when I'm out in society and I've asked that question every day for the last three years of course because it's frustrating Gregg when you see something happening you see they're riding on the wall and not everybody else does yeah and Reich saw this he saw fascism emerging before it did

1:07:06 and he was trying to talk about it. Now, he got a little distracted by his own politics as well. He was a known Marxist for a very short period of time but he saw this forming. You know, he came across this with his own colleagues and peers who deferred to Freud at all times as the sort of fascist dictator of the psychoanalytical movement. You know, he saw this in the church. The church had a tremendous amount of power over the city of Vienna where he was working in the 1920's. And then he saw this sort of Nazi apparatus forming when he went to Berlin in the early 1930s. And he said, this is going to be a problem. This is going to be a problem now everybody sees what's happening here we should do something about this and of course you know he's preaching to essentially no one or a very small group of people who see it as well and that's how I think it maps over to right now yeah it's gotta be frustrating

1:07:56 It seems like for us we're gonna be getting one flavor of fascism one way or another. You can have the blue Kool-Aid or the red Kool-Aid, but it's coming! Man, this has just been really enjoyable. A wild one! I like to consider different ways of thinking about things and Rike definitely had a unique train of thought on many subjects and are there any other links or information about future projects? Or past projects we should tell people about before we call it in? Well i guess the past projects if you want to hear me talk more which after this maybe you don't but

1:08:35 The Oculture podcast is still available. And I guess you would probably better off searching Liber, Ohio L-I-B-E-R, Ohio because that's where the entire feed is located but everything that I did in the podcast space is on that feed. The Patreon and the sub stack I had attached to those are still active if you want to hear the bonus material or the extensions or whatever it's still there. I don't promote it because I'm not doing it anymore but if you're interested it's there future projects aside from the writing, I don't really have anything on the docket right now. But that's taken up a lot of my time and it's about to get more intense because I just turned in like I said the second draft for this screenplay so i think if anybody is interested in connecting about that, about the screenplay, about writing in general any artistic or creative pursuits you may want to collaborate on because

1:09:29 a lot of what you talk about, I don't know if you've noticed this trend. There's sort of an undercurrent of movies that have been coming out primarily on Netflix really that really do talk about a lot of conspiratorial topics in more like a comedy setting but just the fact that there are movies and storylines out there being made about these subjects... Like I just watched one called They Cloned Tyrone which is about human cloning right? And I'm just kind of fascinated that these things exist now, like this is part of the culture in some way. It's a bigger part of the culture than it has ever been and I think that will only continue to increase and so when we look at what kinds of stories we want to tell and interact with in the future...I think it's stories like Rikes. It's stories like a lot of the things you talk about, ideas that are built into stories

1:10:19 And so that's kind of how I'm focused on my writing. I have a lot of other projects that I want to develop, that delve into a lot of the esoterics of stuff we've talked about over the years and if anybody is interested in that please feel free to connect with me via email probably ryanpepperley at protonmail dot com is the best way to reach me I don't have social media anymore. I've walked away from that, and I think that's been a big improvement to my life as well because I don't podcast anymore. I don't have to promote shit and it's such a great feeling but yeah so that's really all i have to promote or to offer up I like it. I like it. I have not seen they cloned Tyrone yet, but I do have it on the list Have you seen that to bring up a whole another thing? But have you seen sorry to bother you? I have yeah That's a gosh that was probably five years ago that I watched that or right around when it came out and I thought that Was also interesting kind of a similar premise right kind of yeah, I never want to watch it again Yeah, but I would say that I've never experienced a bigger

1:11:19 Diversion from where the trailer thought I was gonna be, you know what? Where I thought I'd be going with the trailer to where I ended up. I've never seen a movie go so far into strange territory that was just completely unexpected, though. Uh...I don't know if i'd call it a good movie overall but It definitely tackles some interesting THC adjacent subject matter let's say that That's what i'm getting at you know like there's a lot of i think adjacent THC subject matter that is just working its way slowly into the culture and I would ask you if you want to keep talking just for a moment because What do you make of that? Because as a guy who's done a show about these topics for years when they weren't accepted, when you start to see them trickle into mainstream conversation even if there is shit on. Even if they talk about this stuff on CNN just to downplay it like the fact that it's being discussed some of these topics that you've talked about over the years just has to kind of blow your mind doesn't it? It's kind of baffling to me

1:12:18 Well, I guess so. The way I think of it is just it's always kind of been there like Twin Peaks the X-Files. I mean even the Fargo show had a UFO experience in it how new it is really but I do get a charge when I see that kind of stuff. I just think in the last few years media has really kind left me wanting a lot more. And the shows that I do actually like are not really that related, you could say Succession was somewhat related shows how elite media billionaire family is very fucked up and cutthroat in the way they go about things

1:12:59 But I really am really just like in things like righteous gemstones, which also you could say it's somewhat adjacent to things we talk about another fucked up family that is charlatans who are milking people's. Desire for some kind of religious thing to fill that hole. You know, a foundation is pretty good season one of foundation I liked the lot That's a sci-fi one. I think people should check out but I actually find that not enough is really exciting me these days obviously I'm fatigued by the nonstop onslaught of superhero material and That has kind of coopted

1:13:39 Any other type of big budget actiony type thing. If it's not a superhero movie, just really doesn't get made anymore I suppose but i don't know if you think of other things I should be watching and let me know because I'm just up. I'm dry my well is dry man yeah no I uh I should take this back I use one social media platform it's called letterbox cause I use it to sort of log all the films I watch now and there's a small community on there that does follow these sorts of topics and they curate lists of films that are adjacent to these topics. And so I'll see what I can dig up for you because there is quite an extensive list of things out there, and superhero films by the way are just military industrial propaganda vehicles. So it's interesting to watch those from that angle where yeah, I'm not going into theater spending $13 dollars to watch the latest Thor movie

1:14:30 But I'm interested in seeing at some point, like what are the messages that they're putting out there through these movies? You know like The Doctor Strange movies are curious to me for that reason as well. Mm-hmm but yeah you know iIm fatigued by it too. I did the Barbenheimer thing over the weekend we were talking a week after that came out and you know I just want to see like what's in these films you know and of course they're kind of woke ESG adjacent movies so they have plot lines that you know I mean Oppenheimers is pretty obvious what The Barbie movie is, you know kind of like men are bad. Patriarchy sucks and women rule and that seems like a talking point right? Smash the patriarchy yet the patriarchy are the profiteers of the film and the products that are related to the film which is just uh yeah it kinda always is but whatever You know people are totally willing to take that shade if they also take those profits Yeah And that's what I think like I would love to focus on and you know

1:15:28 a lot of my ideas are in this wheelhouse, or at least embed these ideas in the subtext of the stories. Because I don't know if it's accessible enough to make them the focal point but if you can weave them as sub points or sub text, I think it is more digestible for people at least begin to think about these ideas and to entertain them. And I think that is one thing I like about writing, is that it's a real challenge to do that. It's a real challenge to conceive of surface level narrative and then conceive the subtextual narrative that's not being discussed, you know? The sort of themes and symbols that you are able to work with in film... Not that I want to influence people in sort of negative way but

1:16:10 I just have always loved that medium and i think that is the best way to sort of share ideas and tell stories. So we'll see what happens in the future man! Yeah right on well thanks again for doing this, I appreciate you reaching out and laying a girthy outline on me. I do hope the Reich material and the THC archive is a little more complete now and best of luck on the film. I look forward to seeing it Cool, man. Thank you so much for the time and I do appreciate it and you know i had fun even though I think I struggled at times to explain some of this because It is very dense to explain but I do appreciate you You know having me on and entertaining Me for a couple hours Yes, you did great man Sadatay my dameys there we have it Ryan Peverley

1:16:58 A guy I've digitally known for quite a while actually. I think i might have been on a culture when it was in full swing? Hard to remember but, I certainly know we've had conversations over the years and I would think that our audiences have or at least had a fair amount of overlap But kudos to him for moving on when he felt like it was time and taking on such an ambitious new venture as screenwriting I probably should have asked him about the strikes in Hollywood and how that might be affecting the project but...I didn't think of it until like right now. Hopefully he's outside the circle enough that he can just do his thing, but when The Man said we're missing a big part of the Wilhelm Reich puzzle? I just couldn't let that go and hopefully even people familiar with Reich heard a few things that filled out the edges of their knowledge on The Man and his work

1:17:51 And may we all be having better orgasms, right? Nothing wrong with trying to up a small sliver of our satisfaction in a regularly unsatisfying world. But yes another Hireside Chats episode that takes the path less traveled and avoids the well-worn topics of the moment sometimes as a listener I feel like i'm jumping around through the four or five people I like And they're all just giving their take on the same set of current events, and it's a little frustrating. So I do keep that in mind and try to bring you something different here! Although nailing a bullseye on the diverse interests of tens of thousands of people isn't exactly an easy thing to do either... But speaking of bringing you things you haven't heard, I hit you with a new opening theme for this one- A submission from Chasing Maxwell

1:18:42 I appreciate that and i will put a link in the show notes to their soundcloud as well as to a music video. I found on my own while searching their name which is actually unfortunately overshadowed by a podcast called chasing Galane, Maxwell of course but when you get past all that you scroll down You might find like I did a song they wrote about the inner earth called Inner Earth So, good work and thanks for sending in the song. I love new submissions for the THC theme song and hope to get more! But good stuff here Ryan knows how to research and he certainly brought some new layers to my own Reich understanding so big thanks to him If you liked the first hour there's only deeper and more interesting material in this second In fact Ryan had mentioned that he had a fair amount of speculative material And wanted to keep that out of public domain

1:19:38 And I love hearing that. That's what plus shows are for! I do try to tell free listeners in these wrap-ups what the second hour contains, but i don't often mention that it's not completely uncommon for a guest to say... Hey so we're in the second hour now right? Because I just want to make sure before I say this thing It's infrequent but it does happen and Plus members know I'm not just blowing smoke But anyway In todays We added things to the stack like The politics of Reich's time and intelligence actually steering ideas in psychology, and the parallels to the woke ESG paradigm today. Psychiatry as intelligence gathering which I did think was really interesting kind of reminds me of the old confessions booth we also talked about Reich and his proximity to MKUltra, Reich vs Young, The Rockefellers, Tavistock & MKUltra

1:20:35 and a little bit of fuckery in Reich's death. Ryan actually made a call for help from the audience if anyone might have some knowledge on deeper connective tissue, on some of that material moreso than what he was able to find on his own. So don't let the man down! In higher side news though the marketing budget money bomb test run has ended we didn't hear from the final winner so let's do that Hi Greg this is Chris from Durham North Carolina I'm a long-time listener, plus subscriber and recent recipient of your money bomb. Now THC is one of only two shows I subscribe to and this is because you truly set it in yourself apart from the many many shows out there covering similar material by being as thoughtful as you are, as inquisitive as you are, and by doing the homework you have to do in order to truly surprise a guest with a deep cut question that they just haven't heard before

1:21:33 So thank you for truly being one of a kind and for working as hard as you do to make this material count. Now, as for the money bomb—listeners! I debated with Greg the ethics of taking this money and honestly feel like I should send it right back. I'm thinking of some creative ways that I can launder it or something so Greg don't be surprised if I subscribe all my family members to the show or buy a couple dozen conspiratees from the shop… we'll see. Anyway thanks again and keep up the incredible work Hmm too kind man. I told him to send it to someone in his own life if he doesn't need it But we shall see and that's pretty much all I have to add except of course the next few events on the THC meetup calendar which are August 15th, We got events in Nashville Tennessee and Salem Oregon August 20th the V for Ventura Ventura California Meet up

1:22:28 and August 25th one at Port O'Pints in Crescent City, California. So that's really it for the rest of August just a handful of events but there you have it highersidemeetups.com to get more details to scope out if there are any on the horizon in your area or to take matters into your own hands and make one don't be shy people And that said, thanks again to Ryan. Best of luck to him on the film and I'm gonna get outta here! Rumor has it I might be a father of two before the end of the month so... A lot going on in my world but I've done my part Your move Orgone Energy Secret Keepers Buy-on Cancer Treatment Nonbelievers and Emotional Plague Of Mankind Perpetrators You're fuckin' done Tweet dreams to The Aliens

1:23:21 Out on THC Uncovering secrets and conspiracies Everybody's looking for something Some of them want to use you Some of them want to get used by you Some of them want to abuse you Some of them want to be abused E.F.C Sweet themes on DHC Who the hell could disagree? We know the rabbit hole goes deep Everybody's digging for something Some of them want to use you Some of them want to get used by you Some of them want to abuse you

1:24:26 Some of them want to be up overseas