Nick Bryant | The Franklin Scandal & The Elite’s Big Pedophilia Cover Up

00:00 A beautiful day in the neighborhood, a beautiful day for a neighbor. Won't you be mine? Here we go Hiresight Chatters drinkin' little drinks smokin' a little smoke from sunny San Diego I'm Greg Carlwood and i am really looking forward to delivering today's little bonus show to you because it isn't about speculation and hearsay this is about a specific widespread network of child pedophilia and trafficking that was boldly swept under the rug and quarantined to protect high-ranking politicians and government officials that not only want to avoid prosecutions for their previous crimes, but also just want to continue molesting kids and abusing their power. And I'm sure many of them still are because again nobody was found guilty so why would they really stop?

00:41 But Nick Bryant, the guest today has dedicated so much of his life and career to the meticulous journalism required to write about such things. And even though he's dealing with some serious health problems that have him on some very heavy medication He still dedicated enough to The Cause to talk with me about it for a little while today There is no plus show and originally this was going to be just a bonus episode for subscribers but I would not feel right doing that in this circumstance on a subject that has already had a hard enough time getting the exposure it deserves, so I just wanted to let you know what was going on with that before we dive in. But here's my talk with a guy who deserves more credit than he is getting... Nick Bryan On The Franklin Scandal

01:23 Sweet dreams to the elite We're calling them out on THC Uncovering secrets and conspiracies Everybody's looking for something Some of them want to use you Some of them wants to get used by you Some of them want to abuse you Some of them want to be abused Alright people, we hear rumors of pedophile networks among the elite and sometimes this darkness is briefly exposed to light only to have powerful people circle the wagons and lock down the situation until it blows over and slips silently back into the shadows. Well today's guest has fought the noble fight against these people for a long time and as a journalist, author, and hero quite frankly he has done more than most!

02:22 And the culmination of this work comes in the form of the thickest and most detailed book on my shelf, The Franklin Scandal. A story about power brokers child abuse and betrayal Nick was kind enough to join me for a little while today to talk about it I couldn't be more honored Nick welcome to THC Well thank you for having me Greg Yeah man, I mean the pleasure's mine. Thank you so much for not only being here but for all your hard work and dedication on this topic From what i understand you put seven years and over 40 000 miles of travel into the Franklin scandal which should be impressive to anybody listening So i just have to tell you how much i respect and admire you for that But for people who might be hearing about this case for the first time can You give them a little background on this saga And why it's called The Franklin Scandal?

03:07 well the franklin scandal is about an interstate pedophile network that flew children from coast to coast and pandered them to the rich and powerful. And it was ultimately covered up by various facets of the federal government including the department of justice, FBI, and secret service. It gets its name because a front for this pedophile network was the Franklin Federal Credit Union in Omaha Nebraska So that's why it is called the Franklin scandal. This credit union was essentially a front for this pedophile network.

03:53 Lawrence E. King was the manager of the Franklin Credit Union and also one of the ringleaders of this pedophile network He had a second, there was a second ringleader named Craig Spence who lived in Washington DC But Lawrence E. King He plundered the Omaha area for kids. He plundered Boys Town, he plundered the foster care system and then he acquired kids that just kind of fell through the cracks runaways and uh...kids that were generally from extremely dysfunctional families And he was the centerpiece for flying the kids from coast to coast and also involving them in child pornography

04:40 and other nefarious activities. Everything malevolent that you can do to a child, Lawrence King has done to a child." Yeah it is definitely a sad saga and shocking in so many different areas but how big do you assess this particular ring was? How many children do you think have been used by this group? It wasn't in operation for probably a decade Dozens and dozens of children. As I said, it had a pipeline of children from Boys Town the distinguished orphanage on the outskirts of Omaha Nebraska but they were getting children from

05:19 other milieus and they had quite a rapacious appetite for children. The Franklin scandal really documents just about every modality that a predator can prey on a child from orphanages to foster care Of course there is a lot of just abuse of power and people who are just sexually deviant, but a lot of this story also involves getting powerful people in compromising positions so that they can be controlled and blackmailed by holding it over their head that they've been having sex with children. Is that right?

05:55 Yes, that's where Craig Spence comes in. He was Lawrence E Kings partner in this pedophilic pandering enterprise and he lived in Washington DC and he had a house that was wired for audio visual blackmail in Washington DC And a lot of the pedophiliac parties would go down at Craig Spence's upscale DC house and people that had inclinations for any type sex sexual objects or illicit drugs would be providing with them and they would subsequently blackmail and There's a there was a lot of documentation gathered by the Washington Times on Craig Spence as black male enterprise and The Washington Post played in real integral role in covering this up along with various branches of federal law enforcement

06:47 So, to get into your book a little bit. A large part of it is this chapter about the investigation done by a highly skilled private investigator, this Gary Caridori guy? Can you tell us about his part in all this? Yes well what happened in the Franklin scandal was that people and personnel at social services were aware of King's interstate pedophile network and his parent of children. And these social services personnel went to law enforcement in Nebraska, both federal and state law enforcement, and asked them to investigate. They were just simply ignored there was no investigation whatsoever carried out. So ultimately

07:36 What happened was, Lawrence E. King got busted embezzling $40 million from the Franklin Credit Union and a Nebraska Senate subcommittee was formed to look into king's embezzlement of this money because the franklin credit union had been audited in four years and they thought and it was uh it was a credit union that dealt with lower socioeconomic people so the fact that it was supposed to have 2.5 million minutes on the fact that king alluded for 40 million and he hadn't been audited in four years because ran a federally insured credit union which requires an audit yearly

08:17 The Senate subcommittee formed to look into the financial crimes of Martin Luther King and when they formed social services personnel went to the senators on this committee and said, King's looting of the Franklin credit union is only part of the story. He was also responsible for pandering children trafficking child pornography So the Senate subcommittee started to look into those allegations and they hired a very good private investigator named Gary Caridori. And he started finding new victims and recording their testimony on videotape, and then started actually really starting to break it open. If the dominoes would have started falling in Omaha, Nebraska

09:08 They would have followed the way to Washington DC. It was something that had to be covered up at all costs in my book, when he started video recording these kids that would come forward the media would just demolish the kids credibility. It was very obvious that the media had a vested interest in covering this up. So ultimately what happened was there was a photographer who worked for King, who did child pornography and I think also took blackmail pictures

09:47 He had a falling out with King and he met Gary Caridori in Chicago and gave him pictures that would have busted this thing wide open. And it would have really jeopardized, I think the Bush administration. And Caridori was flying back from Chicago to Nebraska with these pictures plane mysteriously broke up in midair and the pictures were never recovered. And then a state and federal grand jury declared that there was no child abuse within, well the state grand jury declared that there was no child abuse at all within two weeks of Gary Caridori's plane crash so ultimately Garry Caridori was like the first piece covering this up, beating Gary Caridori

10:32 Yeah, yeah definitely. And then this guy William Colby investigated his death and was pretty sure there was foul play involved in Caridori's death but would only say so off the record which is unfortunate but tell us a little bit about Colby he was a CIA director too wasn't he? Up until 1976 when he was deposed and Gerald Ford installed George Herbert Walker Bush Now, the Franklin Committee hired William Colby to investigate Gary Caridori's death. And that was in 1990

11:10 And Colby died some years after that, but Colby didn't publicly state that Gary Caridori had been murdered. But he privately told people that were affiliated with the investigation that Gary Caridori had been murdered. But six years later, Colby died under very mysterious circumstances. But then it's six years following the Franklin cover-up Right, probably not directly related but I'm sure there are a thousand reasons to knock off an ex CIA director. Apparently he took his kayak out with half his dinner still on the table and was never found again so yeah definitely suspicious but getting back to this case in your book...I mean you know you're researching something that at least one other person died investigating This had to be a little bit scary And you did encounter quite a bit of trouble along the way wouldn't you say?

12:04 Well, I had a death threat when I first went to Nebraska and I've had a lot of heat put on me. I too went for pictures like Gary Caridori with Rusty Nelson. Rusty Nelson isn't the most ethical of individuals and he kind of tricked me out of wild goose chase but when i was driving Rusty Nelson home after this wild goose chase we were pulled over and I was summarily deposited in a police car and my car was then just completely ripped apart, my rental car. So yeah there were a number of...and then there's been certainly there has been phone harassment too so yes i was subjected to a lot of heat as I investigated the Franklin appeal

12:51 Yeah, I mean harassment intimidation. It's so sad to see someone doing such a noble thing and facing such negative consequences And it's a very heroic task man You were even so bold as to break the law with some of the documents you included in the book didn't you? Yes, one of the grand juries was really corrupt. Well actually there were two grand juries that were really corrupt in Omaha and then there was a grand jury that was really corrupt in Washington DC I managed to get the field grand jury testimony of one of the very corrupt grand juries in Nebraska that declared that all their child abuse allegations were a carefully crafted hoax. And I published grand jury transcripts in The Franklin Scandal, which is illegal for me to do. You're not allowed to publish grand jury transcripts and I could have been arrested any day since that book had been published

13:50 Yeah, that's a bold move but I agree with your assessment that this case they obviously want to bury this case. They don't want to draw attention to anyone who is researching it and so i think you made a calculated decision that ended up benefiting you in your favor because you faced no repercussions because they just can't risk the attention of the case Yes, that's the thing. If they arrested me then they would bring a lot of attention to this case if law enforcement arrested me they'd bring a lot of attention in this case so until it starts to receive more attention I think i'll be unscathed for publishing seal grand jury transcripts

14:30 Yeah, and I do want to get into some of the details of the case itself. Some of the things that these kids said had happened to them you know this one kid Bonner said that a guy had put cigarettes out on him during sex another girl Shanita Moore who was picked up from Omaha's girls club at nine years old and used in satanic parties You also wrote about some of these kids being sent around on commercial flights to smuggle drugs for some of these guys Definitely pretty dark stuff They use these kids for all kinds of stuff. And a lot of these pedophiles, these were very powerful pedophiles that these kids were... A lot of the pedophiles were and they did unbelievably sadistic things to these kids I mean unbelievably sadistic things and The kid that i've talked to all of them Had very sadistic things done to them so it's really uh It's very tragic that these kids

15:25 have to live not only with physical scars but with these deep emotional scars of being molested with impunity and they were all the all these kids were as i said earlier state and federal law enforcement concluded that not a single child had been abused, so all these kids were essentially lost with impunity. Yeah and another thing that surprised me was the fact that you were able to actually get an interview with this one guy who ran an escort service for Craig Spence he really wanted to stick to providing over 18 escorts but it seems like they came on pretty hard to get him to provide children didn't they?

16:03 That gentleman and I, his name is Henry Vincent. He and I co-authored a book called Confessions of the DC Madam, The Politics of Sexualized and Black Male that's come out this month And he ran an escort service in Washington D.C Craig Spence would provide it but only his escorts were all adults. He didn't provide children and um... Craig Spence spends up to twenty thousand dollars a month on escorts at his escort service These parties that were in Washington, D.C., if you wanted young men in their early 20s or young women in their early 20s or children I mean whatever you wanted you'd be provided with

16:43 So that's how Henry Vincent got hooked up with Craig Spence because he became Craig Spence's go-to guy for male escorts. And yes, they put a lot of pressure on him to ride them with children but he refused to do that and he too had an affair I got a prize for that. But how these parties would generally work is Craig Spence would have a who's-who of the Washington elite there and they would, it'd be a cocktail party, it'd be a Washington DC cocktail party and people would begin lubricating on alcohol and then at a certain hour maybe 10 o'clock or 11 after people had been suitably lubricated on alcohol

17:27 something sexually inappropriate would happen or someone break out some cocaine and maybe fire up a joint. And people that were adverse to that would leave, but then people that wanted to partake of whatever Spence had would stay and then they would ultimately be compromised because of the house was wired for audio visual blackmail, as I mentioned. You know a lot of this stuff in a lot of ways doesn't surprise me but the devil is really in the details and I was shocked more than once in this saga just how bold the actions that these people can be and how the entire legal system seems to tip in their favor to a dumbfounding degree whenever the pressure's on them and there are many aspects of the trial that highlight this unfairness

18:08 Can you tell us about some of that? Well, there were two kids that the FBI came in and got really heavy with the kids. And the kids recanted their abuse but two kids refused to and one was Alicia Owen and one was Paul Benassi And Alicia was indicted on 8 counts of perjury by a state grand jury and Paul was indicted on 3 counts of perjury. Now each one of these perjury counts had 20 years so Alicia was looking at hundred and sixty years in all of the next sixty years and only she was also ultimately also indicted uh... i make a lot of work from the federal granters association with me is it here's a kid that's twenty one years old um... and who wouldn't be a pretty brutally molested at her and her adolescence so she will not only facing

19:06 16 counts of perjury and looking at well over or nearly 300 years in prison. So, um... And ultimately it came down to the state going after Alicia in a trial because these corrupt grand juries had declared that there was no child abuse and indicted the victims who would be cancer abuse on perjury. So for these grand juries to be validated, they had to get convictions and Alicia's trial is the biggest chapter of my book because I really show how this state

19:44 law enforcement, federal law enforcement just pulled out all the stops to corrupt her jury and uh... or to corrupt her court case. And um there was all kinds of malfeasance with the judge with the prosecutor with the jury and after three years of deliberation she was ultimately sentenced convicted on perjury and sentenced to an unbelievable nine to 15 years in prison for perjury, a kid. And she also spent nearly two years in solitary confinement which is kind of mind boggling to do that to a kid. Right? That was the saddest element of the whole case for me and the most shocking. Alicia Owen, 2 years in solitary confinement and even more in prison it's just like that...that's what you get

20:31 for being raped. I mean, how do you not feel like the entire world is against you? You're swept up in this pedophile ring as a child every adult you're involved with is abusing you in the worst ways then you finally try to get some honest people and speak out about it and this is how your rewarded. This has gotta be from her perspective the entire world is against here that's just one of the saddest elements the whole thing The Alicia Owen story is very tragic, but it's kind of interesting. Both the kids that refused to recant their abuse Paul Banasi and Alicia Owen they've actually forged lives for themselves. I mean, Alicia did her time and she's happily married she got a good job, a good career She's got the love of her family and Paul has got a wonderful wife and three kids He's got his own business so there is some poetic justice here

21:32 These kids that refused to recant their abuse ultimately were able to forge good lives for themselves. So it's kind of remarkable actually. It is, and there's a little bit of an irony in the fact that the two who wouldn't recant their testimony seemed to have the most productive lives but several of the other kids this really sent them into a downward spiral of drugs and worse right? Yeah, all the kids that was like one of the carrots that were if the kids perform adequately they'd be given money and drugs. So ultimately it's really a perfect system because these kids are molested at a very young age and turned on to drugs in a very young age and then as a certain point they use their youthful marketability

22:28 And then they're just expunged and then so you ultimately have kids that were molested at a very young age and have very low self-esteem to no self esteem. And they're also drug addicts, and they go on to commit crimes and thereby completely compromise their own credibility. So if they come forward, law enforcement can say well we can't believe this person because he did x y and z and so it's really a perfect system to get these kids young molest them and turn them on to drugs and then let them compromise their own credibility once they've lost their youthful marketability

23:07 Credibility-wise, it's a first round TKO. I mean no one's gonna believe the kid that's fallen into various criminal enterprises and drug addiction." And i've also heard you say that a grand jury is the perfect type of trial to use if you want to have a corrupt case and protect some people? Why is that? People might be surprised to hear that. Have a misconception about grand juries. They think that grand jury's I mean grand jury grand jury sounds like Like the gods from Mount Olympus have spoken and sat down in decree The grand juries are rather infamous because they can be easily corrupted actually

23:51 A chief New York state appellate judge once said, special prosecutors have so much power over grand jurors that they could get a grand jury to indict a ham sandwich. And what he meant by that is someone has appointed a special prosecutor of the grand jury now grant jurors are just regular citizens that have shown up for jury duty that had been funneled into a grand jury. So there's nothing special about them. They're just regular citizens that are shown up for jury duty and it's up to a Special prosecutor of the grand jury to present evidence and witnesses that he deems relevant To the grand jurors so only witnesses in evidence That he means relevant is shown to the grand jurors, and that's how they make their decision whether to indict or not to indict

24:42 So in the case of Franklin, the special prosecutor of the state grand jury Samuel Van Pelt called people that made the children look like they were lying and made the perpetrators look like they were telling the truth. And that's why No perpetrators were indicted and the kids that refused to recant their abuse were indicted for perjuries because of the witnesses that he called. And in the book I show how he definitely manipulates evidence, that he definitely manipulated evidence and there was all types of, all kinds of malfeasance involved in that grand jury

25:24 Yeah, one detail the grand jury wasn't even shown the full video testimonies of the kids they had been edited down right? Yes Gary Curidori the prosecutor that was hired by the Nebraska Senate he recorded the victims that he found on videotape and the video testimony that was shown to the grand jurors had been edited out so the kids didn't corroborate each other. The kids with Gary Carore's original tapes repeatedly corroborated each other, but when they were shown at a grand juror's all of it had been edited out

26:01 And there's also a disturbing element in this story of, A lot of people who helped in covering up this situation and making sure the trial went the way they wanted it to go. A lot of these people ended up getting promotions later on isn't that true? Yes, that's what's really... That's another disturbing element of this case. Lawrence King was deposited in a mental institution and they had to get him out of town for these two grand juries so he wouldn't be called So he was deposited in the mental institution Now the US magistrate that did that and also did some other things that helped cover up Franklin He became a U.S. District Court judge

26:42 The assistant U.S attorney for Nebraska that was the special prosecutor of this federal grand jury, that found that there was no child abuse he is now a US magistrate. Wow! The prosecutor that oversaw Alicia Owen getting found guilty of perjury and that was a very, very corrupt trial. He became a Douglas County, Omaha is in Douglas County, a Douglas County District Court Judge and the prosecutor that ensured that Alicia Owens stayed in prison he's now an assistant U.S. attorney And on the DC side of it, the US Attorney That helped cover

27:27 the DC side of this because it had a big DC side to it. He was an associate attorney general and now he's the vice president at the Raytheon Corporation, which is one of the largest defense contractors in the world. And Henry Vinson was represented by Greta Van Thuster and she really didn't do an adequate job according to Henry Vincent representing him because everything that the government wanted to accomplish they accomplished his silence and his imprisonment. And after that she became quite a television celebrity now she's got her own news show on Fox Television. Yeah, and you had mentioned the media's role in this a little bit but not only at the time was the media kind of

28:13 not covering the story but it's also a little curious that your book has never been picked up by someone like Oprah or Nancy Grace who are supposed to be champions of this type of thing. Well, three of Oprah's producers have my book and one of Nancy Grace's producers has my book but they won't touch it and Nancy Grace pretends to be like an advocate of abused girls but she hasn't touched Jeffrey Epstein who was the power broker that was flying young girls around uh that's recently hit the news and I wrote a an article about it in Gawker your listeners can go to Nick Bryant and google Nick Bryant and Gawker. And i wrote a couple of articles on Epstein

28:58 So, Nancy Grace and Oprah are hypocrites of the worst order. They put a lot of lip service into preventing child abuse but when they're confronted with really whole scale widespread child abuse they tend to cower like most people. It's definitely sad and you've actually covered and investigated several other pedophile rings since not only this one in the one you just mentioned but a couple others too Well, I've been working on Jeffrey Epstein and that kind of found that work. And the Jeffrey Epstein case is similar to Franklin in that Jeffrey Epstein molested

29:38 God knows how many children. And he also handed them out to his rich and powerful cronies, and ultimately really nothing happened. He spent 13 months in a county jail and he only had to spend nights there. That was the corrupt grand jury too that found that he hadn't molested a single child when the Palm Beach Police Department had put together, had five victims of his and they have this sworn testimony of a number of people that corroborated those victims. So things like Franklin and then you've got the Jimmy Seville case that's going on in UK right now where pedophilia has gone all the way up to the top floor

30:27 the food chain politically in the UK and there's been a detroit scandal in Belgium, Portugal has had one, Venezuela has had one Mexico has had one. There have been a number of these types of scandals where the rich and powerful abuse children and done so with impunity Right, and I believe it was a whole separate case that even got you to start entertaining how dark these things can get. There was a group called the Finders which is a satanic cult that slipped up and got their whole ring kind of under the spotlight for awhile

31:03 You know the finders is what got me into all this I came across the fires i was working on an article for a magazine and i came across to find the finders that are you going to support what happened there were two members of the finders which is a very strange cult and they were in a Tallahassee park with six children. And the children looked very severely abused and that concerned citizen called the Tallahassee police department on the finders, and um... The Tallahassee Police Department took

31:46 took one look at the situation and uh they arrested the two fighters then put the six kids in uh protective custody. And a doctor said that one of the kids, and the kids were like three to six years old I believe, and um a doctor said that one of the kids you know definitely showed signs of sexual abuse so they found child pornography in the van that the fires were driving And all the way what happened was the fires are a couple of warehouses in washington dc. and the DC's Megabomb Police Department, and the US Customs descended or got a search warrant and descended upon these warehouses where they found just unbelievable types of incriminating evidence. I start the book out with The Finders and actually include the entire U.S. Customs report at the back of the book just to show people that it actually exists but The Finders were

32:46 were actually, there was documentation of the finders actually buying children. And as I looked into this realm the sale of children is actually unfortunately a reality and but ultimately what happened so you had a multi-level jurisdiction investigation into the finders U.S. Customs, Metropolitan Police, Tallahassee police and the FBI was somewhere in the mix and ultimately the CIA quashed the whole investigation into the finders and the two finders who had been charged with multiple counts of child abuse by Florida authorities were let out of jail and then the kids unbelievably were repatriated to the finders

33:34 So that's what got me into this whole world. I just, when I read that finders document, but there must be something in the world that I'm completely whiffing on if something like this is happening and that document essentially started my dark odyssey into the world of organized child trafficking. Yeah and to quote from your book there, the documents are pertained to blood rituals and orgies regarding children and the purchase of a kid in Hong Kong through a contact at the embassy. And that again is just kind of ridiculous that you could go through such a high-end official channel to get children I mean...and these are just the small amount of details that we have it's got to be pretty ridiculous the things we don't know

34:28 Well I think it's beyond ridiculous, it's nefarious but yes that document is very incriminating. And what got me was you obviously had a group that had some very strange strange rituals and practices that were obviously doing malevolent things to children. And ultimately the CIA quashes an investigation, now the CIA does not have any domestic jurisdiction so they shouldn't have been able to unquash that investigation to begin with right? And that really...that document was kind of like a big bang to me it's just welcoming to how

35:08 how horrific and nefarious large-scale child trafficking can be, and who's protecting it and how it's protected. And to say one thing that is slightly positive there have been a couple of cases where in certain states certain pockets of the FBI did do the right thing, certain pockets of law enforcement actually did carry out full honest investigations and trials on some these networks right? Well, I think in the Epstein case the FBI And Florida refused to recover, uh, to cover that up and the Department of Justice covered it. So that was a good thing that the Florida Miami FBI refused to take part in the Jeffrey Epstein cover-up and the onus of that cover ultimately fell on the Department of Justice which is certainly had enough power to cover it up but yeah... In that situation

36:09 You see the FBI doing the right thing. Yeah, and that definitely seems to be the minority of cases where they do the right thing but like you did say at the Department of Justice really always seems to be the one to quash this stuff Right? Would you say they're the organization most guilty of suppressing this kind of thing? Well in the Department of Justice ultimately tells other law enforcement branches what to do in most cases. And they're ultimately the ones that can form the grand juries, that can exonerate the guilty, the corrupt grand juries. So in a lot of cases... In the Franklin case, certainly the Department of Justice was certainly

36:52 the bellwether in the cover up, the bellweather in Nebraska and also Washington DC. The dirty work was done by the FBI in Nebraska and in Washington DC the dirty work was done by the Secret Service In the finders case that was quashed before... the CIA was able to quash it even before it went to the Department of Justice so The Department of Justice was kind of out of the mix there and in the Epstein case which I've investigated over the years, it was the Department of Justice that actually covered it up immaculate. So yes, uh... The Department of Justice is responsible for a lot of this-the pedophile network coverups that I've investigated

37:36 I guess you could say they work similarly to an editor or a producer in media because the way these things are is you don't have to have every single reporter corrupt and in-the-know, hiding this information. You just need to get the editor of the paper or the producer of the media channel because they are the gatekeepers to what can get on the air In the same way there's a parallel I guess to the way that Department of Justice sets the tone for investigations And as long as you have them you know, they're going to be able to get the attention off some of these cases and put people on other things if that's their desire. Absolutely it's important to have people at pivotal positions and in the Franklin case some of the people that

38:20 took part in this on the law enforcement side were pedophiles, compromised pedophiles themselves. And I think in other cases they were just people that just wanted to climb a ladder so I think you end up with two types of people- people that are compromise themselves and then people that just want to get ahead. Yeah turn a blind eye and know that it'll benefit them regardless We're getting close to the end here, I know you gotta get out of here. You mentioned the UK pedophile scandal which is big now and we all know about the Penn State Jerry Sandusky situation And it's been a while since you wrote this book and have been looking into these things, but do you have any indication of how vast or integrated these rings are in the present day? I can only assume that a situation like this gets worse and worse over time as it becomes more apparent that it is very tough to ever get caught doing this. Well, I would say wherever there's... It's just simple economics. Wherever there's demand, there's supply.

39:20 The thing is pedophilia exists in all social strata. I mean there are people that are extremely poor, impoverished that are molesting children and then with the Franklin scandal and Epstein and other scandals like Jimmy Savile you've got the rich molesting children. One of the big differences there is that the rich seem to have molested children with impunity, whereas the poor or the impoverished they get their books thrown at them and spend decades in prison.

40:00 I know you had mentioned in the beginning that the first Bush administration would have been in a lot of trouble had this stuff come to light. I know that there have been senators that were named in your book, that were involved in using these services and of course one of the victims believe it's the same Alicia Owen was impregnated by a police chief Can you tell us in closing a little bit about the people who were using these services? I mean, we got senators police chiefs and apparently a lot of people in the first Bush administration. Yeah, I think that some of the abusers of these kids as I said earlier went all the way up to food chain, the political food chain and it's

40:45 It's the names that are quite mind boggling and my investigation as far as. the exalted status of some of these perpetrators. But getting back to our conversation earlier, these kids their credibility is so decimated because of the choices that they've made because of being molested repeatedly at a young age and then and then the drug addiction um that it's almost impossible than they named because some of these guys are just so exalted discern how powerful these people are is to look at all the power that was used to cover up this pedophile network. Three corrupt grand juries, The Washington Post, The New York Times CBS, the Omaha World Herald there were a number of

41:40 of media entities too that were used to cover this up. So we're talking about in addition to the media entities, I'm referring by the Department of Justice, the FBI, the Secret Service, the Omaha Police Department, Douglas County Judiciary Washington DC judiciary and so it gets to be kind of when you look at all the power that was deployed to just vaporize this to make sure didn't get traction. I mean, that's how you can tell that the strings are being pulled at the pinnacle of power And one other thing I wanted to bring up before we got out of here was, uh...I know in this realm a lot of people who talk about these things also are very quick to bring up trauma-based mind control and that doesn't come up a lot in your book until the epilogue. What would you say about that element of these kind of cases? Is it as prevalent as people say is more of a background role

42:38 If your readers want to or your listeners want to learn about that I would have them Google the extreme abuse survey and That was a survey that was conducted about six years ago seven years ago, and it looked at people with backgrounds in mind actually It's a very large study there were over thousand participants And if you're listeners really wanna glean some pre-pragmatic corroborated evidence of mind control that's being used. I think that that's a good place to start is the Extreme Agree survey.

43:17 Well, thanks for that. That does about do it for us on behalf of humanity I cannot thank you enough for your dedication that you've had on this case and this topic at the risk of your own safety It's more noble than the work of almost anyone I know it's truly an honor to have you here And to be able to just do a small part in helping get these types of things exposed in a real way Can you tell the listeners where they could go to get your book? You can go to my website franklinscale.com or Amazon or Barnes and Noble, there's... multiple modalities where you can purchase the book. Perfect, and you also mentioned a more recent one about the DC Madam? Yes I uh... Henry Vinson and I collaborated on a book it's called Confessions of a D.C. Madam The Politics Of Sex Life And Blackmail and it's about the blackmail operation run by Craig Spence It's about Henry's life story but it focuses quite heavily on the blackmail operation run by Craig Spence in Washington D.C

44:14 Perfect, and that's a really compelling part of the story so I'm probably going to dig into that one soon myself. But this has been awesome! Thanks again Nick we need more people like you take care yourself out there. Okay thanks Greg You got it There we have it guys, a super interesting and sad saga. And your Exhibit A in the case that none of these official organizations or authorities can be trusted and you cannot respect the law when it does not hold everyone accountable We have some seriously systemic problems and if we don't examine situations like this one even though It's an older case You and I can't drive that point home to regular people

44:52 So I hope this episode gives you a little ammunition for that. And if you enjoyed it, I would really urge you to shoot Nick a thank-you share this episode with some people that you think might be interested and if you really want to go the extra mile buy one of Nick's books! I would say The Franklin Scandal If not just out of respect for his boldness in publishing the sealed grand jury testimony... ...I mean that's baller in itself and a good reason to put it on your bookshelf or of course is more recent book Confessions Of A DC Madam if you want hear more about the blackmail angle I can plug THC Plus next time, but really if you got the extra cash it's Nick who deserves some support. I know anybody dealing with medical issues could probably use some spare change and the work he's doing has been so noble that there should be some positive karmic effect for him, I would hope

45:40 Either way, that is it for me today people. Not exactly sure what's next but I got a lot more coming at you before the end of this month so thanks for listening! I've done my part your move child traffickers in Nefarious Elite... Your. Frickin'. Move Sweet dreams to the elite We're calling them out on THC Uncovering secrets and conspiracies Everybody's looking for something Some of them want to use you Some of them wants to get used by you Some of them want to abuse you

46:21 Some of them want to be abused Sweet themes on DHC Who the hell could disagree? We know the rabbit hole goes deep Everybody's digging for something Some of them want to use you Some of them want to get used by you. Some of them want to abuse you. Some of them want to be abused.